It's Kegging time 2022

[stquinto]

Got more company on the kegging @MUZZY  and @Mickep ! Great news!

Also company on the AG with @Classic Brewing Co  

Welcome down the rabbit hole

I second all of you in being thankful for the great assistance from all of the gurus here

[ozdevil]

17 hours ago, Aussiekraut said:

Also, whilst I'm here asking silly questions, I will go overseas in a couple of months. Should I disconnect and clean the beer lines and taps while I am away, so nothing nasty can grow in them and the taps? There won't be any beer poured in my absence. I intend on turning off the gas but am not sure about the beer lines.

My advice would be to actually clean the beer lines and taps   like you normally would.
however  leave your Sanitiser in the lines and tap  until you return home   and then just pour it out until beer is back through.


we all should be cleaning the beer lines regurly even with beer in the kegs  to get the best pours even if it its just flushing once a week with water and every 4th clean stripping down taps and doing a full clean

[Malter White]

42 minutes ago, ozdevil said:

My advice would be to actually clean the beer lines and taps   like you normally would.
however  leave your Sanitiser in the lines and tap  until you return home   and then just pour it out until beer is back through.


we all should be cleaning the beer lines regurly even with beer in the kegs  to get the best pours even if it its just flushing once a week with water and every 4th clean stripping down taps and doing a full clean

A mate of mine who worked for a commercial brewery tells me a story of a pub that changed ownership. The new owners were fastidious and cleaned their lines regularly. The local drinkers initially stayed away after the business changed hands because they thought the beer was off. It turns out the previous owners weren't so fastidious and the locals had been drinking their beer for many years from cruddy lines.

[Classic Brewing Co]

1 minute ago, MUZZY said:

A mate of mine who worked for a commercial brewery tells me a story of a pub that changed ownership. The new owners were fastidious and cleaned their lines regularly. The local drinkers initially stayed away after the business changed hands because they thought the beer was off. It turns out the previous owners weren't so fastidious and the locals had been drinking their beer for many years from cruddy lines.

I have seen things like that many times as I have called on many Pubs for many years & you see the once loyal locals shifting to another drinking hole because a lot of them don't like change. I did a lot of return visits to some areas & came across some of them drinking even in other towns.

[Malter White]

Just now, Classic Brewing Co said:

I have seen things like that many times as I have called on many Pubs for many years & you see the once loyal locals shifting to another drinking hole because a lot of them don't like change. I did a lot of return visits to some areas & came across some of them drinking even in other towns.

This adds weight to my theory on who has the BEST BEER. It seems every state thinks THEIR beer is the best but I think it's just what people are accustomed to.
It's why I genuinely enjoy my own beers now. I'm never going to suggest my beers are better than breweries that have been brewing for over a century but I now prefer my beers over their's because I'm accustomed to my beers now.
 

[Classic Brewing Co]

14 minutes ago, MUZZY said:

This adds weight to my theory on who has the BEST BEER. It seems every state thinks THEIR beer is the best but I think it's just what people are accustomed to.
It's why I genuinely enjoy my own beers now. I'm never going to suggest my beers are better than breweries that have been brewing for over a century but I now prefer my beers over their's because I'm accustomed to my beers now.
 

I agree & there have been occasions when myself & others have had a couple of home brews & then gone to the pub & been served up a beer with little or no head, there are many obvious reasons, glasses not cleaned properly, too much cleaning product in the washer, dirty beer lines or inexperienced bar staff more worried about FB messages than delivering you a lovely beer with 2 fingers of foam.

Most Publicans will say they have to cater for the masses as the regular bar fly just wants as much beer in his glass as possible.

Edited March 13, 2022 by Classic Brewing Co

[Tricky Micky]

5 hours ago, stquinto said:

I kegged my first Grainfather brew that I had messed up the OG. I mentioned elsewhere that I’d had to chuck in some LME to bring it up to 1.042. The FG was 1.010 after 3 weeks, and already clear. I had upped the hop count to what the recipe suggested for 25 litres (Timothy Taylor Landlord). I think  this one might be right for the hops. So 4.2 degrees. I had wanted to add sugar to the keg but didn’t in the end. As it was clear I’ll get stuck in soon.

Sainter mate, what's the red thingy on the grey thingy on the keg?

[Tricky Micky]

There's been talk here lately about storing kegs and the best way to do that. In a very simple way could someone explain to me how this works? I understand things up to a point. Let's say I've transferred a fermented ale into a keg and added the appropriate amount of sugar for natural carbonation and I now wish to store this keg at ambient temps - is that okay? I believe it is but just want confirmation.

The next bit is where I'm struggling to understand the process or maybe the science of what should happen next.

Let's say that the ale keg has sat for 4 weeks at ambient temps of around 20 degrees c and had 181grams of sugar added to it @9g/l as per bottle secondary fermentation. ( I may have this wrong - I know there's a calculator out there for this)

what is the process or science  behind the next step when you hook the keg up to gas at 2 degrees? If the keg is carbonated just like a bottle carbed beer is - then what happens next? Assuming a serving pressure of around 14 degrees. Is the CO2 at this point just a means to push the already carbonated beer through the line.....or is there the possibility of over carbonation?

Sorry if this seems like a really silly question but I'm trying to get my head around this process.

[ozdevil]

13 minutes ago, Mickep said:

There's been talk here lately about storing kegs and the best way to do that. In a very simple way could someone explain to me how this works? I understand things up to a point. Let's say I've transferred a fermented ale into a keg and added the appropriate amount of sugar for natural carbonation and I now wish to store this keg at ambient temps - is that okay? I believe it is but just want confirmation.

consider the keg  like a bottle @Mickep     and just put the appropriate amount priming sugar  in the keg

 

 

17 minutes ago, Mickep said:

The next bit is where I'm struggling to understand the process or maybe the science of what should happen next.

Let's say that the ale keg has sat for 4 weeks at ambient temps of around 20 degrees c and had 181grams of sugar added to it @9g/l as per bottle secondary fermentation. ( I may have this wrong - I know there's a calculator out there for this)

what is the process or science  behind the next step when you hook the keg up to gas at 2 degrees? If the keg is carbonated just like a bottle carbed beer is - then what happens next? Assuming a serving pressure of around 14 degrees. Is the CO2 at this point just a means to push the already carbonated beer through the line.....or is there the possibility of over carbonation?

Sorry if this seems like a really silly question but I'm trying to get my head around this process.

just put say 5 psi just enough pressure to push and once carbanation is lost   just bump the psi back up to your 12-14 psi  

as the beer is already carbonated

others will tell you exactly the science  as i honestly havent done this method as i dont usually have  keg storage

 

[DavidM]

9 hours ago, stquinto said:

I kegged my first Grainfather brew that I had messed up the OG. I mentioned elsewhere that I’d had to chuck in some LME to bring it up to 1.042. The FG was 1.010 after 3 weeks, and already clear. I had upped the hop count to what the recipe suggested for 25 litres (Timothy Taylor Landlord). I think  this one might be right for the hops. So 4.2 degrees. I had wanted to add sugar to the keg but didn’t in the end. As it was clear I’ll get stuck in soon.

Nice job on the Labels, even straight, well done.

[Shamus O'Sean]

2 hours ago, Mickep said:

Let's say I've transferred a fermented ale into a keg and added the appropriate amount of sugar for natural carbonation and I now wish to store this keg at ambient temps - is that okay? I believe it is but just want confirmation.

I agree with OD.  Store the keg just like a large bottle.  I was doing this a while back when it would be a month or more before I got space in the kegerator for a recently kegged brew.

2 hours ago, Mickep said:

what is the process or science  behind the next step when you hook the keg up to gas at 2 degrees? If the keg is carbonated just like a bottle carbed beer is - then what happens next? Assuming a serving pressure of around 14 degrees. Is the CO2 at this point just a means to push the already carbonated beer through the line.....or is there the possibility of over carbonation?

I slightly disagree with OD on this one.  But like OD, I do not know the science.  When I had a naturally carbonated (sugar added) keg ready to go in the kegerator, I just hooked up the gas at 14psi (my serving pressure, due to 1 non-return valve in the line).  Hooked up the beer line.  Let it get cold, usually overnight.  Drink.  Simples.

It should not over-carbonate any more than any other keg in the kegerator.  I say "should not" because if it does, something is wrong.  Your serving pressure is when the system is in a type of equilibrium.  So, in my case, 14psi is enough to keep CO2 in the beer, but not enough to force more CO2 into the beer.

[ozdevil]

1 hour ago, Shamus O'Sean said:

I slightly disagree with OD on this one.  But like OD, I do not know the science.  When I had a naturally carbonated (sugar added) keg ready to go in the kegerator, I just hooked up the gas at 14psi (my serving pressure, due to 1 non-return valve in the line).  Hooked up the beer line.  Let it get cold, usually overnight.  Drink.  Simples.

It should not over-carbonate any more than any other keg in the kegerator.  I say "should not" because if it does, something is wrong.  Your serving pressure is when the system is in a type of equilibrium.  So, in my case, 14psi is enough to keep CO2 in the beer, but not enough to force more CO2 into the beer.

i have learned something here , but still dont know the science   , and as i said i have never done this  with priming sugar  in my life
and was coming from a blank thought on this one

So it is good to know if you have pre carbed  like you would with a bottle  and then put on tap  at serving pressure   it will be fine

i would like to hear the science behind it

[Tricky Micky]

2 hours ago, Shamus O'Sean said:

5 hours ago, Mickep said:

Let's say I've transferred a fermented ale into a keg and added the appropriate amount of sugar for natural carbonation and I now wish to store this keg at ambient temps - is that okay? I believe it is but just want confirmation.

I agree with OD.  Store the keg just like a large bottle.  I was doing this a while back when it would be a month or more before I got space in the kegerator for a recently kegged brew.

5 hours ago, Mickep said:

what is the process or science  behind the next step when you hook the keg up to gas at 2 degrees? If the keg is carbonated just like a bottle carbed beer is - then what happens next? Assuming a serving pressure of around 14 degrees. Is the CO2 at this point just a means to push the already carbonated beer through the line.....or is there the possibility of over carbonation?

I slightly disagree with OD on this one.  But like OD, I do not know the science.  When I had a naturally carbonated (sugar added) keg ready to go in the kegerator, I just hooked up the gas at 14psi (my serving pressure, due to 1 non-return valve in the line).  Hooked up the beer line.  Let it get cold, usually overnight.  Drink.  Simples.

It should not over-carbonate any more than any other keg in the kegerator.  I say "should not" because if it does, something is wrong.  Your serving pressure is when the system is in a type of equilibrium.  So, in my case, 14psi is enough to keep CO2 in the beer, but not enough to force more CO2 into the beer.

Thanks Shamus, love ya work mate cheers Mick

[stquinto]

9 hours ago, Mickep said:

Sainter mate, what's the red thingy on the grey thingy on the keg?

Not sure of the technical term mate, spunding valve overflow maybe? The red thing is a spunding valve which often goes on the gas line on a pressure fermenter. The grey tube has a ball to block the entrance to the spunding valve. You put the unit on the gas connections of a  keg when filling it from a pressure fermenter. If any beer comes out the little white ball will block the exit to the spunding valve. Got it off this vid:

In my case no beer came out but I think it protects the valve

 

[stquinto]

4 hours ago, DavidM said:

Nice job on the Labels, even straight, well done.

I normally wouldn’t go that far but since we moved office I had to take stuff home with me, including a tape printer. Actually quite handy, especially since I can hardly read my own handwriting

[Pezzza]

3 hours ago, Mickep said:

Thanks Shamus, love ya work mate cheers Mick

@Mickep Mick - seems like @Shamus O'Sean has resolved your issues... just fyi this is an earlier discussion w @Greenyinthewestofsydney and since then I wouldn't use a @PB2 cup or 181g... think less is good - less yeast in the keg - unless I guess if you are doing yeast driven styles like HW

And if you can find the below message noting 80g - a few above it - @kmar92 Kmar kindly put link to the Calculator...  which may or may not come across in my attempted copy see below? : |

On 3/12/2022 at 2:56 PM, kmar92 said:

Found this calculator @Itinerant Peasant

https://www.brewersfriend.com/beer-priming-calculator/

 

[Tricky Micky]

26 minutes ago, Itinerant Peasant said:

@Mickep Mick - seems like @Shamus O'Sean has resolved your issues... just fyi this is an earlier discussion w @Greenyinthewestofsydney and since then I wouldn't use a @PB2 cup or 181g... think less is good - less yeast in the keg - unless I guess if you are doing yeast driven styles like HW

And if you can find the below message noting 80g - a few above it - @kmar92 Kmar kindly put link to the Calculator...  which may or may not come across in my attempted copy see below? : |

 

Thanks IP, it's all coming together now. We use the calculator for the grams of sugar per liter when kegging....thanks mate beautiful stuff.

[Aussiekraut]

14 hours ago, ozdevil said:

My advice would be to actually clean the beer lines and taps   like you normally would.
however  leave your Sanitiser in the lines and tap  until you return home   and then just pour it out until beer is back through.


we all should be cleaning the beer lines regurly even with beer in the kegs  to get the best pours even if it its just flushing once a week with water and every 4th clean stripping down taps and doing a full clean

I had planned on a big clean when I get back. Take the whole thing apart and clean the taps and replace the beer lines with a decent length. Might do it all sooner I suppose. I'll fill a couple of growlers before I start and still have beer whilst it is all happening  

 

I clean the lines every now and then by running some sodium percarbonate through them and letting it sit for a few hours, then run sanitiser throughit and let it sit for a bit before I re-connect the disconnects. But I think I should do it more often.

[kmar92]

44 minutes ago, Aussiekraut said:

I had planned on a big clean when I get back. Take the whole thing apart and clean the taps and replace the beer lines with a decent length. Might do it all sooner I suppose. I'll fill a couple of growlers before I start and still have beer whilst it is all happening  

 

I clean the lines every now and then by running some sodium percarbonate through them and letting it sit for a few hours, then run sanitiser throughit and let it sit for a bit before I re-connect the disconnects. But I think I should do it more often.

I do not know what you will find @Aussiekraut but I have given up on cleaning taps. Everytime I dismantle the Nukataps they are completely spotless. I usually run some PBW through the lines and taps between kegs and then sanitise but I am wondering how dirty that they would ever get without cleaning. They are not exposed to outside atmosphere, and that seems the major culprit with any nasties growing within. I am thinking just a rinse would clear any debris in the lines and taps and if they remain sealed they should be fine.

[Tricky Micky]

11 hours ago, Itinerant Peasant said:

14 hours ago, Mickep said:

Thanks Shamus, love ya work mate cheers Mick

@Mickep Mick - seems like @Shamus O'Sean has resolved your issues... just fyi this is an earlier discussion w @Greenyinthewestofsydney and since then I wouldn't use a @PB2 cup or 181g... think less is good - less yeast in the keg - unless I guess if you are doing yeast driven styles like HW

And if you can find the below message noting 80g - a few above it - @kmar92 Kmar kindly put link to the Calculator...  which may or may not come across in my attempted copy see below? : |

On 3/12/2022 at 2:56 PM, kmar92 said:

Found this calculator @Itinerant Peasant

https://www.brewersfriend.com/beer-priming-calculator/

Thanks IP @Itinerant Peasant and Greeny @Greenyinthewestofsydney,  Gotcha - many thanks. And Greeny mate, would that 80 grams of sugar thrown into the keg be good for pretty much any style of beer. 80g/19l

[Pezzza]

Finally got into Town and to the agency that assists in the handling/swapping of the Nitro Beergas... (I fortunately own my own Nitro Mix cylinder... believe they are a bit more beefy than CO2 re pressure rating) and lo and behold they had a cylinder full waiting to swap!?! 

Please peruse the label... pretty funny... in the main they are more of a welding gas/industrial gas supplier... ; )

Anyway... all good... will be nice to eventually get some creamy top Brews going again 

Cheers

IP

aka HBM 

[stquinto]

6 hours ago, Itinerant Peasant said:

Finally got into Town and to the agency that assists in the handling/swapping of the Nitro Beergas... (I fortunately own my own Nitro Mix cylinder... believe they are a bit more beefy than CO2 re pressure rating) and lo and behold they had a cylinder full waiting to swap!?! 

Please peruse the label... pretty funny... in the main they are more of a welding gas/industrial gas supplier... ; )

Anyway... all good... will be nice to eventually get some creamy top Brews going again 

Cheers

IP

aka HBM 

Hey IP (or "Home Brew Man") ! You have a special regulator for the nitro, right ?

[Malter White]

9 hours ago, Itinerant Peasant said:

Finally got into Town and to the agency that assists in the handling/swapping of the Nitro Beergas... (I fortunately own my own Nitro Mix cylinder... believe they are a bit more beefy than CO2 re pressure rating) and lo and behold they had a cylinder full waiting to swap!?! 

Please peruse the label... pretty funny... in the main they are more of a welding gas/industrial gas supplier... ; )

Anyway... all good... will be nice to eventually get some creamy top Brews going again 

Cheers

IP

aka HBM 

Look! Up in the sky. Is it a bird? Is it a plane?

No, it's Home Brew Man.

Home Brew Man - strange visitor from another planet with powers beyond those of mortal brewers.

Home Brew Man - who can change the course of specific gravity and bend beer lines with his bare hands...and who, disguised as @Itinerant Peasant, a mild mannered boozer for a regional hobby farm, fights a never ending battle for brews, pest rabbits and the Australian way.

It's Home Brew Man!

 

[RDT2]

3 hours ago, stquinto said:

Hey IP (or "Home Brew Man") ! You have a special regulator for the nitro, right ?

Yes you do as Nitro is stored at a higher pressure than C02 and you need a different bottle as well. They also have a different thread. 

Edited March 15, 2022 by RDT2

[Pezzza]

@stquinto

Q:

9 hours ago, stquinto said:

Hey IP (or "Home Brew Man") ! You have a special regulator for the nitro, right ?

@RDT2

A:

6 hours ago, RDT2 said:

Yes you do as Nitro is stored at a higher pressure than C02 and you need a different bottle as well. They also have a different thread. 

Haha all done thanks to all involved ; )

 

6 hours ago, MUZZY said:

It's Home Brew Man!

Haha @MUZZY Gold!

Edited March 15, 2022 by Itinerant Peasant