What's in Your Fermenter? 2021

[Pezzza]

1 hour ago, MitchBastard said:

Decent clarity for a beer that hasn’t been CC’d yet.

Maaaaaaaate... Dubbya 34... pure GOLD!  ; )

[MitchBastard]

7 hours ago, Graubart said:

Maaaaaaaate... Dubbya 34... pure GOLD!  ; )

Hahaha was waiting for that!

[MitchBastard]

8 hours ago, jamiek86 said:

@MitchBastard has a nice colour and head in the hydrometer tube looks like a goodin

Cheers mate!

[MitchBastard]

9 hours ago, Tone boy said:

Good work MB. Is that an all grain recipe? Color looks good. Gonna try a Pilsner soon on my next brew. Just researching some partial mash recipes at the moment. Do you think I should consider some acidulated malt in the mash? 
Hope it turns out well for you. 
Cheers

Thanks TB, it’s seems to be tracking well so hopefully it turns out nice. 
 

in regards to your partial, I’m not overly sure that acidulated malt it too necessary. Since the majority of the fermentables come from the extract, the mash pH probably isn’t too much of a concern. I could be wrong though. 
 

did you have a recipe put together just yet?

[Tone boy]

53 minutes ago, MitchBastard said:

 

did you have a recipe put together just yet?

Hey @MitchBastard Mitch,

For my first one I’m going to keep it pretty simple and work from there. 
I was thinking I would use a black rock Lager or Pilsner light as a base, or maybe even the TC 86 days Pilsner/European lager. Then a mini mash about 1.2kg of Pilsner malt for 60 min (that’s about my limit on volume). I’ll add in some dextrose or LDME to get the alcohol up to about 4.5%. 
For hops I was thinking classic hops like saaz or hersbrucker in the boil - probably at or close to flameout. 
I’ll try the w34/70 yeast plus the can yeast. 
I wasn’t sure if I needed carapils in with the mash, or a little acidulated malt....

my boil will only be about 5 litres, but was wondering if I should decant that into a sanitized container to cool overnight before adding it to the other ingredients- like a mini cube I guess. Or I could let it cool in a sink with an ice bath.... Anyway looking forward to giving a lager a go now I have temp control

Edited February 3, 2021 by Tone boy

[Shamus O'Sean]

8 minutes ago, Tone boy said:

my boil will only be about 5 litres, but was wondering if I should decant that into a sanitized container to cool overnight before adding it to the other ingredients- like a mini cube I guess. Or I could let it cool in a sink with an ice bath

I did a 5-6L boil last weekend.  Between chucking the pot in the sink a few times with cool tap water (prob 3 times) and making up my water volume with 2°C pre-refrigerated water, I got it down to 20°C no problems.  For mine, no need to cool your boil overnight.

[BlackSands]

18 hours ago, Graubart said:

 And that ol' conditioning question (yeah on other thread) but how long would you leave it sit on yeast cake for any final activity after you hit FG - think your post over on the Condition thread would suggest only a cuppla days?

With ales I generally don't do a D-rest as a separate stage at the end of fermentation as it's essentially already done in the days it takes you to confirm FG is reached.  With Kveik it all happens much quicker.    What I've been doing more recently to track progress is having a trial jar and hydrometer full of the fermenting brew sitting next to my FV.  Active fermentation is visibly quite vigorous!  And then two days later... all is very calm, and the yeast subsequently starts to drop away very quickly.  At this point there's no doubt it's at FG.   I wait another day, by which time I'm pretty confident that any diacetyl has been mopped, so I then immediately CC the beer.   Which is precisely what I'm about to do now! 

[Pezzza]

6 hours ago, MitchBastard said:

Cheers mate!

I do have a more serious question tho for you @MitchBastard mate... and am not trying to be pedantic... just see that you are taking the festive AG brewing very seriously and are doing a beautiful job.

Hence am a bit confused why you would brew - get it done - and then add something later like the Lactic Acid to provide a bit more acidity on the palate.... I am getting it for say a Sour... but not so much a Pilsener... now each to their own and this could be a great thing to get that perfect palate...

But I would have thought that should be able to be achieved by ffffffarkin around with the water quality i.e. ionic additions of whatever ilk - salts in solution - the water salt profile or acidulated malt or the malted grains and the yeast...  which produce the palate outcome you are chasing rather than an addition after fermentation.

Am happy to be corrected/learn more how this all works though hey.   And I did come across a Micro adding tiny amounts of Phosphoric Acid to their mash to adjust their water profile to perfect pH. 

 

I have a Saazy Boi at the moment and yeah I did throw in a swag of Maris Otter (cos I had it and is Euro Malt with better diastatic power than my predominantly aussie grain inventory)... and Vienna and Munich (cos had no Pilsener or Palt Malt on hand) plus I did use Saaz... and it is all a bit mellow rather than crisp (and I think some of my megaswill mates will be happier with it than some of the crisp bitter beltings I give them with other brews haha)... but that is just a learning I guess in my brewing journey... and will change it up next time.  

Anyway - whatever - and haha maybe Saazy Boi could very much do with a sound dose of Lactic Acid?!

Just interested to read what you think on this mate... 

[Pezzza]

5 hours ago, Tone boy said:

I’ll add in some dextrose or LDME to get the alcohol up to about 4.5%. 

TB - would recommend using LDME rather than Dex to get closer to the truth ; )

Tho I guess if you want a lighter body maybe Dex will provide you more of what you want.

Or even possible a lovely tin of Coopers Light Liquid Malt mate maybe?  

That will give you better body and head and head retention and creamier mouthfeel... depends what you want tho. 

Cool for the Ferment is good mate.

Good luck with your brew mate! 

[Pezzza]

5 hours ago, BlackSands said:

... all is very calm, and the yeast subsequently starts to drop away very quickly. 

Sandman what do you do for your Gelatin finings process... I do believe I have got some dry powder somewhere.... and should really give it a run some time - not done it before... think the book says something about making up a warm solution... and at what time in the CC do you add it for max efficaciousness?   

Thanks for any help you can provide mate

[BlackSands]

46 minutes ago, Graubart said:

Sandman what do you do for your Gelatin finings process... I do believe I have got some dry powder somewhere.... and should really give it a run some time - not done it before... think the book says something about making up a warm solution... and at what time in the CC do you add it for max efficaciousness?   

Thanks for any help you can provide mate

See here:

 

[Classic Brewing Co]

Anyone got any ideas with Brigalow Munich Lager, I was thinking 1kg Dextrose/500gm Light Dry Malt ( but I am thinking it needs a bit more ) or would any of the  BE 1/2/3 be better.

I was thinking of using German Lager Yeast but not sure on which Hops.

Maybe someone has a foolproof recipe.

Cheers

Phil

 

[Tone boy]

42 minutes ago, Graubart said:

TB - would recommend using LDME rather than Dex to get closer to the truth ; )

Tho I guess if you want a lighter body maybe Dex will provide you more of what you want.

Or even possible a lovely tin of Coopers Light Liquid Malt mate maybe?  

That will give you better body and head and head retention and creamier mouthfeel... depends what you want tho. 

Cool for the Ferment is good mate.

Good luck with your brew mate! 

Thanks @Graubartbearded one. Great info from a man who knows his craft. 
I get that the original article may have more body, so yep LDME might get that. The extra tin of light malt would definitely get there too, however with two cans of malt and 1.2 kg grain I might not know who I am after a few cups!

My thinking was to make it a bit of a lighter body with an ABV of around 4.2 to 4.5% and hence the mention of the dreaded dextrose!! And with less fermentables I might get away with 1 pack of “dubya “ and 1 kit yeast - keeping it lowish ABV to harvest and reuse the yeast for the next couple of “bigger” lagers with some fancy new age hops maybe.  Just my thoughts but your suggestions are really appreciated mate. And I like the idea of extra liquid malt - I have heard you espouse the virtues of the extra liquid malt in its support of a frothy head!!

Blacksands has also given his method for Cc and gelatin brother, it’s on another thread. I’ll try to find it and tag you in. 
Cheers legend
 

[Tone boy]

1 minute ago, Tone boy said:

 

Blacksands has also given his method for Cc and gelatin brother, it’s on another thread. I’ll try to find it and tag you in. 
Cheers legend
 

I was too slow. He’s already done it!!!

[Pezzza]

1 hour ago, CLASSIC said:

Maybe someone has a foolproof recipe.

@Shamus O'Sean has a whole spreadsheet I think of them Phil...

I would suggest 

1. One tin of Beer Concentrate of your choice (suggest Coopers 86 Days)

2. One tin of Coopers Light Liquid Malt 1.5kg

3. 1kg of BE3 - if hopping probs steep Hallertau Mittelfrüh (mostly referred to as Hallertau) or Perle for half an hour in hot wort... 

4. Yeast: One pack with a starter or two packs of Fermentis W34/70 yeast - some like two - I have generally got away with one and starter - best practice is two if sprinkling I believe - others may have experience here... 

5. Brew at 15 deg C or below and probs best to follow the Lager Temp Protocol - someone may be able to direct you to a posting... but basically you need to raise for Di-Acetyl Rest about 5-6 degrees higher after 3/4 way through... then once no SG change bring back down 2-3 degrees per day back down to 3 degrees and cold crash for a week... prior to bottling...  Some just do 15 deg for like 2 weeks and certainly until no sign of any further bubbling and a few days clean-up thereafter.  

But this is by no means an easy foolproof way forward I suspect Phil and as always - there are many ways to the top of the mountain ; )

HTH mate ; )

 

Edited February 4, 2021 by Graubart

[Pezzza]

1 hour ago, Tone boy said:

I have heard you espouse the virtues of the extra liquid malt in its support of a frothy head!!

Check with me man @Red devil 44 he is a true believer haha!

You there Red?  I don't think there is a brew that goes by at RD44 Brewing without an extra tin of Coopers Liquid Malt is there mate?

[Classic Brewing Co]

@Graubart  Hey Mate, that's fantastic, Thanks.  I seem to be doing too many IPA's got 3 (different ) on the go & one bottled so a Lager then a Pilsner & then we should be in Stout territory.

I love the flavours of German style beers. I really appreciate your help.

Cheers.

[jamiek86]

18 minutes ago, Graubart said:

Check with me man @Red devil 44 he is a true believer haha!

You there Red?  I don't think there is a brew that goes by at RD44 Brewing without an extra tin of Coopers Liquid Malt is there mate?

I've been same last 4 brews no going back for me

[jamiek86]

17 minutes ago, CLASSIC said:

@Graubart  

I love the flavours of German style beers. I really appreciate your help.

Cheers.

you really can't go wrong mate a tin some malt some more fermentables plus German yeast and German hops no right or wrong way as long as get temp down

[Classic Brewing Co]

Well I do have temp control so looks like a goer. I haven't used Liquid Malt for a while but I reckon its got more body than the dry. 

Brew fridge should be free by the weekend so I will get it going.

Cheers

Phil

[Pezzza]

13 minutes ago, CLASSIC said:

Well I do have temp control so looks like a goer.

Here is a basic table - it is ONE way of doing things - and it aligns with John Palmer How to Brew methodology for cold temp bottom fermenting lagers/pilsners - and is MY interpretation with excellent assistance from cold temp brew king @Otto Von Blotto OVB... one thing is quite important and that is you need a good population of yeast... 

You may prefer to go slightly warmer on your first one - suggest like 14 degrees maybe and then go up to 20 (below is 10 going to 18)... should be ok with Dubbya 34 (W34/70)

And you need to be hyper clean as it is slow - the faster Ales are more forgiving as they colonise the beer quicker and ferment faster... 

I would - whatever you do - follow the warm up (di-acetyl rest) and the cool down - for the yeast clean-up - is pretty important.

Anyway... some others may have better advice... this is just one possible way of doing things.  Hope it is helpful mate - it is a bit complicated sorry.

 

[Classic Brewing Co]

WOW that's a pretty demanding job sheet !! However I will try & get my head around it.

I understand Lagers unlike Ales need to be brewed at cooler temperatures so slowly, slowly catch the monkey.

I have a lot more time on my hands now as I retired in March 2020 so I am not in a rush to set things up properly.

Cheers @Graubart  That really helps.

Cheers

Phil

[Otto Von Blotto]

Yeah, that's pretty much what I do. Usually about 4 weeks from pitch to keg. Thankfully I have two fermenters. 

[Classic Brewing Co]

Yeah I have 2 x 30l a Coopers 23l & a Craft Kit, I am going to try Bulk priming when one is free, but I think the Munich Lager is going to take a bit of my time. 

[MitchBastard]

@Graubart perfectly good question mate. 
well, all beers have different mouthfeels and finishes on the palate. A lot of this does come down to grain bill and water profile, but, some of this is also impacted by the beers finishing pH. A lager or Pilsner with a finishing pH, of say 4.4 or 4.5 is going to feel a bit “flabby” in the mouth. It might Taste fine and look the part but it doesn’t finish right. 4.3-4.5 is good for an ale or an ipa as it’s more hop driven and that flabby ness actually translates as a “bigger” mouthfeel. Since lagers have sweet FA to them, that crisp snap, as you would know is what gets you going back for more, and actually provides a lot of balance. Something I think is important in lagers and pilsners or anything in this folder. 
 

During the brewing of my pils, a lot of the pH adjustment was done during the mash and boil etc and was actually tracking to where I wanted it. It just didn’t drop in pH enough during ferment to finish how I want it. I will be working on this recipe again. Since it’s 100% Pilsner malt, Next time I will change up the water profile and see how that goes. Something a bit dryer. Maybe something more towards what I do with my Aussie lager. Saying that though, The Aussie lager has Dex in it which actually helps dry it out, yet the beer has a higher finishing pH than the Pilsner. Go figure. It’s just a bit of faffing around and a bit of data collection. 

the Pilsner is still in its RnD phase and this time round it will get the post ferment acidification with lactic but as mentioned next time I’ll approach the water a bit diffo, and hopefully won’t have to.  Just as an FYI, I’m only going to add maybe .5-.8 of a mil of lactic To a whole 23L batch. 
 

you’d be surprised where some commercial lagers finish pH wise. Next time ya have an asahi, GN or any mega swill crispy boy, measure the pH. They’ll be between 3.8-4.1

and next time you pour one of your saazys, just drop 1 or 2 drops of lactic in it, if you can. You’ll see what I’m on about. 
 

sorry for wafflin

 

 

Edited February 4, 2021 by MitchBastard