What's in Your Fermenter? 2021

[Stickers]

Red draught

Cooper's draught can, BE3 + 500g LDM, 300g cold steep cara aroma, 30 min boil with citra and amarillo @ 10 mins and citra @ flameout. kveik voss yeast. 1.048 og, should get down to 1.012

[Classic Brewing Co]

Hey Shamus,

I notice the recipe states 7.5 ABV, would that be achieved with only one carb drop ? But then a longer storage might do it. 

But 6.8% still is good, well done. I do like the Vintage & Dark Ales, good with a cheese plate with all the trimmings.

I trust you will enjoy - now I had to ask to be sure ...  is Shamus O'Shean Irish. ? 

Pardon me if I am wrong.

Cheers

Phil

 

 

 

[Classic Brewing Co]

Hey Shamus,

I notice the recipe states 7.5 ABV, would that be achieved with only one carb drop ? But then a longer storage might do it. 

But 6.8% still is good, well done. I do like the Vintage & Dark Ales, good with a cheese plate with all the trimmings.

I trust you will enjoy - now I had to ask to be sure ...  is Shamus O'Shean Irish. ? 

Pardon me if I am wrong.

Cheers

Phil

 

 

 

[Shamus O'Sean]

39 minutes ago, CLASSIC said:

Hey Shamus,

I notice the recipe states 7.5 ABV, would that be achieved with only one carb drop ? But then a longer storage might do it. 

But 6.8% still is good, well done. I do like the Vintage & Dark Ales, good with a cheese plate with all the trimmings.

I trust you will enjoy - now I had to ask to be sure ...  is Shamus O'Shean Irish. ? 

Pardon me if I am wrong.

Good point.  It made me realise I made a bit of a mistake.  The 6.8% was without priming.  So the 2 carb drops will add 0.4% to get to 7.2% and the one drop should add about 0.2% to get to 7.0%.

I think the yeast did not convert as well as expected.  My last two Vintage Ales (2018 & 2019) both finished at 1.010

I like the dark ales too.  

My grandparents on mum's side were both Irish, but I was born in Aus.  Shamus is a nickname from years ago.

[Classic Brewing Co]

To Be Sure ... To Be Sure, I had an Irish girlfriend once she was from northern Belfast, man could she drink, I love the culture & the history especially their Pubs.

They can get a bit boisterous when they get liquored up, but then again that is life.

I hope you enjoy your brews.

[MitchBastard]

7 hours ago, Graubart said:

Is that with the W34 you are not particularly impressed with Mitchie? 

Yeah mate. Its proving me wrong this time. About time too. Last few batches I admittedly underpitched and expected it to magically act like a lager yeast.

[jamiek86]

49 minutes ago, MitchBastard said:

Yeah mate. Its proving me wrong this time. About time too. Last few batches I admittedly underpitched and expected it to magically act like a lager yeast.

did you use 2 packs this time and only one the last few? I'm yet to try it for first time after my current pale ale i have 2 packs and 86 days pilsner with 2kg malt planned. Along with some sort hop tea maby sazz and EKG 

[MitchBastard]

@jamiek86 I actually used 2,the last 2 or 3 times and while it did ferment, I feel like it was still under pitched. Maybe the packets were a bit long in the tooth and I didn’t get the growth I needed...? The lag phase was almost 3 days and there was presence of yeast stress in the the form of isoamyl acetate (banana). Lagers benefit from aiming for a pitching rate that will achieve 1.5million cells, per ml , per degree Plato. So if my starting gravity is 1.048 (12 plato) a healthy yeast pitch for a lager of that gravity should achieve 18million cells of yeast per ml of wort. Kinda pointless info to know if you don’t have a microscope and cant do cell counts but it’s useful if you need to punch in numbers for an online yeast pitching calculator. 
 

What’s your starting gravity going to be? 

[jamiek86]

probably about 1.050 not sure 86 days pilsner tin 1.7kg plus 1.5kg Light liquid malt and was going to add 500 grams light dry malt and 2 packs of w34/70 and aim for 12 degrees. maby 22 litres or 21

Edited January 25, 2021 by jamiek86

[Tone boy]

6 hours ago, jamiek86 said:

probably about 1.050 not sure 86 days pilsner tin 1.7kg plus 1.5kg Light liquid malt and was going to add 500 grams light dry malt and 2 packs of w34/70 and aim for 12 degrees. maby 22 litres or 21

Sounds like a good brew JK. Let us know how it turns out. 
I think there’s a spreadsheet somewhere on this site (IanH spreadsheet?) that works out your OG. Probably at least 1.050 for 21 litres though looking at the amount of fermentables. 
cheers TB

[MitchBastard]

@jamiek86 if you’re OG is going to be 1.050

im not entirely confident that 2 packs will do it. The brewers friend calculator would indicate you’d be short on yeast and  need a 2L starter stepped up to 4 to achieve desired cell count for 21ltrs at 1.050. 
 

 

[Pezzza]

8 hours ago, MitchBastard said:

presence of yeast stress in the the form of isoamyl acetate (banana).

Hey there Mitchie... yeah mate I am way too poor to put in two packs of yeast... nivver dunnit... I do starters too but not monster ones... 3L max.... and never had any bananas... not one bent yellow fella in sight or smell haha... and I don't get out of bed for anything below 1050 haha... unless I stuff up with an over-enthusiastic pseudo-sparge haha (only once and learned me lesson there) 

I do often follow @Otto Von Blotto Kelsey's Lager and Pilsener cold temp regime (similar to what's in Palmer) where we raise up approx up to even 8 deg C to do a di-acetyl rest and I think that is likely to get rid of the Di-A... followed by a slow cool down for the clean-up... so all my Lagers and Pilsy fellas have been just fine... as clean as.... If you got the dough then sure 2 packs is the biz no doubt - definitely recommended/best practice.   As opposed to my ol' Bush-Pig bucket-brewer methodologies haha... I also do the ol' dump in on existing yeast cake stooge so that usually will overcome an underpitch as well... 

Maybe the Di-Ac Rest has saved me?  And the word on the thread is that the Pressure FVs discourage the generation of the Di-Ac but not done many in there just yet... but so far been ok.

Cheers Mitchie and Go the W34 Woohoo!!!

[jamiek86]

Thanks @MitchBastard @Graubart I won't be doing it for a while but the last few brews I done with kit yeast and 11.5 grams of s23 lager came out ok. The og was only 1.045 and I brewed them on 15 degrees. I was thinking of doing next one on 12 degrees so might do a starter. The basic principle is 100 grams light dry malt per litre? If its a starter at warm temps for lager yeast I'm giving the starter off flavours?

[Pezzza]

1 minute ago, jamiek86 said:

Thanks @MitchBastard @Graubart I won't be doing it for a while but the last few brews I done with kit yeast and 11.5 grams of s23 lager came out ok. The og was only 1.045 and I brewed them on 15 degrees. I was thinking of doing next one on 12 degrees so might do a starter. The basic principle is 100 grams light dry malt per litre? If its a starter at warm temps for lager yeast I'm giving the starter off flavours?

@Greeny1525229549 Greeny and @Otto Von Blotto Kelsey and @ChristinaS1 Christina assisted me with moving into starters... yeah 100g/L sterile solution is the go... don't think it matters re off flavours if you run the starter warm-ish 18 to low 20s for instance.... never had an issue... though someone else might be better qualified to answer the question ; ) 

Besides you can pour off most of "the beer" if you chill and let flocc out beforehand - and then just swirl up and pour the yeast sediment into your FV with the fresh Wort... HTH

[jamiek86]

@Graubart thanks for trying to bring out the cavalry with the starters mate all good I knew there were links on here that have been reposted a hundred times. I guess if your into it for scientific purposes then it's a good thing to muck around with. Most times starters are done with light dry malt that cost $10 a kg? If your splitting a pack of yeast say 4 ways or an infinitie im sure you eventually come out on top. For me a 3 litre starter with $3 of light dry malt and all the sterilising and risk involved is half way to a $6 pack of yeast. Mean no offence to the ol bush pig brewer  which is why I say its good science also and maby your not using light dry malt. I might just give it a go this time though but aren't going out to buy those glass beacons any time soon might dig out and wash a 3 litre milk container and chuck 2 packs of w34/70 in that with 300 grams LDM

Edit did someone say it wasn't good practice to collect lager slurry like it was ale?

Edited January 25, 2021 by jamiek86

[Journeyman]

52 minutes ago, jamiek86 said:

which is why I say its good science also and maby your not using light dry malt

I make a 2L starter with ~200g sugar, stir vigorously several times and pitch it at high Kraussen. Sometimes if I am doing 2 brews I will do 300g sugar in 3L water then just before pitching, stir it up and tip half into a jug for the 2nd brew.

Admittedly I am not doing lagers, but my brews are foam covered in an hour or 2 and 7cm deep in Kraussen within 8 - 10 hours tops. I figure that's a good sign they are not under-pitched.  

[jamiek86]

51 minutes ago, Journeyman said:

I make a 2L starter with ~200g sugar, stir vigorously several times and pitch it at high Kraussen. Sometimes if I am doing 2 brews I will do 300g sugar in 3L water then just before pitching, stir it up and tip half into a jug for the 2nd brew.

Admittedly I am not doing lagers, but my brews are foam covered in an hour or 2 and 7cm deep in Kraussen within 8 - 10 hours tops. I figure that's a good sign they are not under-pitched.  

thats where im a bit unsure if I do it with a lager wether not over pitching the starter will have any consequences to the outcome. Say the 2 yeast in 2 litre starter. Think I might just do the 2 packs normal and try to brew it on 14 instead of 12 still low enough not to get esters but obviously not as clean as if was lower. So far have been happy with results from brewing on 15 to 16 and bumping up to 18 after 4 or 5 days of good fermenting.

[Journeyman]

40 minutes ago, jamiek86 said:

thats where im a bit unsure if I do it with a lager wether not over pitching the starter will have any consequences to the outcome. Say the 2 yeast in 2 litre starter. Think I might just do the 2 packs normal and try to brew it on 14 instead of 12 still low enough not to get esters but obviously not as clean as if was lower. So far have been happy with results from brewing on 15 to 16 and bumping up to 18 after 4 or 5 days of good fermenting.

It's very difficult to over-pitch, so much so it's not something to worry about.

[jamiek86]

1 minute ago, Journeyman said:

It's very difficult to over-pitch, so much so it's not something to worry about.

ok thanks I might try a 2 litre starter with 200g ldm and 2 packs w34/70 and pitch it at high krausen and see how i go with it.

[Greenyinthewestofsydney]

42 minutes ago, jamiek86 said:

thats where im a bit unsure if I do it with a lager wether not over pitching the starter will have any consequences to the outcome. Say the 2 yeast in 2 litre starter. Think I might just do the 2 packs normal and try to brew it on 14 instead of 12 still low enough not to get esters but obviously not as clean as if was lower. So far have been happy with results from brewing on 15 to 16 and bumping up to 18 after 4 or 5 days of good fermenting.

IMO its impossible to overpitch a lager. I regularly do full slurry or pitch onto the yeast cake. Even done it on the yeast cake twice in a row. All it will give you is a cleaner crisper brew which is what you want anyway. I start my lagers lower and let them rise. Start at 7 or 8c and let it rise to 10c. I find it gives the best result.

[Greenyinthewestofsydney]

2 hours ago, jamiek86 said:

@Graubart thanks for trying to bring out the cavalry with the starters mate all good I knew there were links on here that have been reposted a hundred times. I guess if your into it for scientific purposes then it's a good thing to muck around with. Most times starters are done with light dry malt that cost $10 a kg? If your splitting a pack of yeast say 4 ways or an infinitie im sure you eventually come out on top. For me a 3 litre starter with $3 of light dry malt and all the sterilising and risk involved is half way to a $6 pack of yeast. Mean no offence to the ol bush pig brewer  which is why I say its good science also and maby your not using light dry malt. I might just give it a go this time though but aren't going out to buy those glass beacons any time soon might dig out and wash a 3 litre milk container and chuck 2 packs of w34/70 in that with 300 grams LDM

Edit did someone say it wasn't good practice to collect lager slurry like it was ale?

If your worried about the cost of LDM then you don't have to tip off the starter. Particularly with my AG ales i indecant some off the main batch and make a starter while the main batch is no chilling. Come 18 to 24 hours when its chilled down pitch into the fermenter the main batch and the starter. Good idea though with the starter to ferment it at the same temp as you would the main batch.

[jamiek86]

8 minutes ago, Greeny1525229549 said:

If your worried about the cost of LDM then you don't have to tip off the starter. Particularly with my AG ales i indecant some off the main batch and make a starter while the main batch is no chilling. Come 18 to 24 hours when its chilled down pitch into the fermenter the main batch and the starter. Good idea though with the starter to ferment it at the same temp as you would the main batch.

thats why was wondering how it worked and if the starter itself could be over pitched. I understand people say not to worry about 2 packs in over 20 litres but was concerned about 2 packs in 2 litre starter After the reassurance I will be giving it a go trying to keep starter under 18 then pitch it into brew at high krausen. My last lager I had OG of only 1.044 with 11.5 grams of s23 and 7 gram kit yeast from GCL and only got it down to 1.013 when would have thought would go to 1.010 which I had previously been getting from only 1 pack s23. Same brew temps on 15 degrees and same OG and ingredients goes to show each brew is different and sometimes doesn't make much sense.

Edited January 26, 2021 by jamiek86

[Greenyinthewestofsydney]

3 minutes ago, jamiek86 said:

thats why was wondering how it worked and if the starter itself could be over pitched. I understand people say not to worry about 2 packs in over 20 litres but was concerned about 2 packs in 2 litre starter After the reassurance I will be giving it a go trying to keep starter under 18 then pitch it into brew at high krausen. My last lager I had OG of only 1.044 with 11.5 grams of s23 and 7 gram kit yeast from GCL and only got it down to 1.013 when would have thought would go to 1.010 which I had previously been getting from only 1 pack s23. Same brew temps on 15 degrees goes to show each brew is different and sometimes doesn't make much sense.

Ok gotcha. A quarter of a pack in a 2L starter would be enough. Putting 2 packs in a 2L starter won't hurt anything except your wallet.

That's for ales. For lagers id go 1 pack in a 3L starter.

Edited January 26, 2021 by Greeny1525229549

[jamiek86]

6 minutes ago, Greeny1525229549 said:

Ok gotcha. A quarter of a pack in a 2L starter would be enough. Putting 2 packs in a 2L starter won't hurt anything except your wallet.

That's for ales. For lagers id go 1 pack in a 3L starter.

so u reckon doing this id be pitching more good yeast than 2 packs straight into brew at 15 degrees?

[Journeyman]

14 minutes ago, Greeny1525229549 said:

I had OG of only 1.044 with 11.5 grams of s23 and 7 gram kit yeast from GCL and only got it down to 1.013

I may be wrong but there is an implication here that you think the amount of yeast pitched has something to do with how much the brew ferment to FG.

That's not the case unless you have really under-pitched and the yeast goes dormant.

The FG depends on how much fermentables are in there and what percentage conversion (attenuation) the yeast can achieve. (with a given that you have temps correct)

Edited January 26, 2021 by Journeyman