The English Bitter Thread!

[Beerlust]

1 minute ago, Ben 10 said:

Still fermenting. But BERRIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm looking to directly compare it to Columbus in late boil/dry hop. On paper they appear similar.

Could you see yourself using Bramling Cross in a Pale Ale for late flavour & aromatics?

Cheers,

Lusty.

[Shamus O'Sean]

1 hour ago, Ben 10 said:

Still fermenting. But BERRIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I was going to pick up 50g of Bramling Cross from my LHBS tomorrow for a 60 minute boil in an Oatmeal Stout.  Your exclamations and your recipe has made me decide to get another 50g for a whirlpool addition.  I reckon that a berry infused stout would be a good thing. 

[ben 10]

8 hours ago, Beerlust said:

I'm looking to directly compare it to Columbus in late boil/dry hop.

Nothing like I have had from Columbus.

[Beerlust]

2 hours ago, Ben 10 said:

Nothing like I have had from Columbus.

Better? worse?

Could you see yourself using Bramling Cross in a Pale Ale for late flavour & aromatics?

[ben 10]

11 hours ago, Beerlust said:

Better? worse?

For me incomparable. 

An amber for sure but dunno about a pale. The beer is fermented, I'll keg shortly when I empty one and let you know.

[Beerlust]

18 minutes ago, Ben 10 said:

For me incomparable. 

An amber for sure but dunno about a pale. The beer is fermented, I'll keg shortly when I empty one and let you know.

I've only ever read of Bramling Cross in bitters & stouts. Just wondered if it could extend into other things. That berry character is rare among the hop world.

I'll be interested in your thoughts.

Cheers,

Lusty.

[ben 10]

Massive berry. IF you can get a hold of Heroes and Villains Winter Solstice the berry was amazingly pronounced for a darkie without actual berries. I'll bottle the last bit and send you one of mine if you'd like.

 

[Beerlust]

It sounds very intense. Almost Cassis-like?

It might even be something worthy of a late addition/dry hop to a Saison? 

Thanks for the info. 

Lusty.

[Titan]

This the one I raved about in the goto bear thread.

 

[ben 10]

Bramling cross hopped EB. Really nice. Very smooooth bitterness, subtle berry flavour. I like it. I have a bag of Marrissssssss so next brew will use that and more of this. Imperial Berry Bitter???

 

[The Captain!!]

That looks and sounds fantastic @Ben 10

[ChristinaS1]

Bottled #3 in my string of English Bitters yesterday and put down #4 today:

Fancy Molasses Bitter

 

1.7kg Coopers APA 

850gm Maris Otter 24.3%

415gm Home Toasted Maris Otter malt 11.9%

140gm C60L 4%

70gm Aromatic 2%

60gm Acidulated malt 1.7%

260gm Crosby's Fancy Molasses 7.6% boiled x 10 min

15gm EKG boiled x 20 min

20gm Centennial hop stand x 20 min 

15gm EKG DH x 4 days

10mL Clarity Ferm

22L water

7 gm Coopers Ale yeast. Fermentation temp 22C.

 

OG 1.042 FG 1.011; ABV 4.01% + 0.4% = 4.41%; EBC 22.6; IBU 19.5; BU:GU 0.75.

 

In Canada Fancy Molasses is pure sugarcane juice that has been evaporated down to 25% moisture. It becomes partially inverted during this process. Crosby's is also purified. It is considered the highest grade of molasses, but technically it is not a molasses because no sugar has been removed. 

 

We will see how this one turns out. After this I might take a break from making English Bitters and make something else. 

 

Cheers,

 

Christina.

[BlackSands]

On 8/13/2019 at 7:26 AM, ChristinaS1 said:

After this I might take a break from making English Bitters and make something else. 

I occasionally hit 'fatigue' with certain styles from time to time. Had a run of brewing regular Brit Golds for a while but got a bit tired of them after the last one. That however was until I had a rather tasty one in the UK a few weeks ago.  What set it apart was the obvious presence of biscuit malt which while I've used it occasionally in bitters but never thought to use it in a golden ale. 

One thing I learnt about UK beer recently is the 'warm and flat' aspect has a significant impact on the perceived flavour and character of the beer and really was the one thing that I believe set them apart from the ones I brew.   Every cask ale I tried had absolutely no visible signs of carbonation what so ever, but most had a nice enough head and good lacing regardless.  

Anyway...  my next brew will be something along the lines of a Hobgoblin -  a particularly nice English ale.  This is a dark coloured hoppy bitter - and I think I can make something similar - a simple partial extract brew based on Coopers dark ale tin which I happen to have on hand:

• 1.7kg Dark Ale
• 1.2kg MJ LME pouch
• 2kg GF Ale Malt
• 50g Styrian Goldings @ 5min
• 10g Gypsum
• M36

 

 

[ChristinaS1]

Yes, Wychwood's Hobgoblin is delicious. Wychwood's King Goblin is my favourite EB, "Brewed only on a full lunar moon." I am sure that makes all the difference!  It is 6.6% ABV, so I would never make it myself, but man is it yummy.

Wychwood's website gives quite a lot of info on what is in their beers. King Goblin is late hopped with Styrian Goldings and Cascade. Can anyone who has used both Fuggles and Styrian Goldings tell me how alike or different they are? My LHBS does not carry Styrian Goldings, but does carry Fuggles. I have yet to use Fuggles. They say that Styrian Golding is Fuggles grown in Solvenia, and that it has a more "refined" character. If a recipe calls for Styrian Goldings should I just use a bit less Fuggles?

Cheers,

Christina.

 

[BlackSands]

11 hours ago, ChristinaS1 said:

Yes, Wychwood's Hobgoblin is delicious. Wychwood's King Goblin is my favourite EB, "Brewed only on a full lunar moon." I am sure that makes all the difference!  It is 6.6% ABV, so I would never make it myself, but man is it yummy.

Wychwood's website gives quite a lot of info on what is in their beers. King Goblin is late hopped with Styrian Goldings and Cascade. Can anyone who has used both Fuggles and Styrian Goldings tell me how alike or different they are? My LHBS does not carry Styrian Goldings, but does carry Fuggles. I have yet to use Fuggles. They say that Styrian Golding is Fuggles grown in Solvenia, and that it has a more "refined" character. If a recipe calls for Styrian Goldings should I just use a bit less Fuggles?

Cheers,

Christina.

 

I've used Styrian G a few times and in fact it's in a new brew I currently have conditioning and of course, as mentioned above will be in that upcoming Hobgoblin-ish type brew..  I would tend to agree with the more 'refined' aspect.  Seemed more 'crisper' for want of a better word.  I used quite a lot a year or so ago in a PA... a bunch was included in some old hop stock I claimed back when I was managing my LHBS.  I remember liking it very much so will be interesting to see how it presents in this current batch in a couple of weeks time.   I've also used Fuggles, both UK and NZ quite a bit too.  NZ Fuggles will get you closer to Styrian G I think where the UK Fuggles I sense is more 'earthy' as they say.   It's all very subjective of course!   

As an aside, for English brews generally I tend to mostly use Fuggles, Goldings and Styrian Goldings simply because they're readily available.  I used Bramling Cross once and like Pacific Jade found the woody/oaky aspect pretty over powering and quite unpleasant in the doses I used at the time.  Never got the 'berries' I was hoping for!  If you ever consider these two hops - approach with caution!  Small doses could be ok in certain styles but I overdosed my bitters with them and it was not nice!  

[Otto Von Blotto]

I have Challenger and Styrian Goldings in the freezer at the moment. Trying to decide whether my next batch will be a bitter with these or my red ale. I guess I haven't done a bitter in a while so might go with that. Also have some fuggles, about 40-50g by the look of the bag. 

The last ones I did were a little bit sweet, so I might either mash lower or throw in some raw sugar, maybe increase the bitterness a bit too. Leaning towards mashing lower simply because it's less work than dissolving some sugar to add late in the boil. 

[ChristinaS1]

7 minutes ago, Otto Von Blotto said:

I have Challenger and Styrian Goldings in the freezer at the moment. Trying to decide whether my next batch will be a bitter with these or my red ale. I guess I haven't done a bitter in a while so might go with that. Also have some fuggles, about 40-50g by the look of the bag. 

Hope you make a bitter. I would like to see your recipe! 

7 minutes ago, Otto Von Blotto said:

The last ones I did were a little bit sweet, so I might either mash lower or throw in some raw sugar, maybe increase the bitterness a bit too. Leaning towards mashing lower simply because it's less work than dissolving some sugar to add late in the boil. 

Why in the world would you dissolve the sugar in water before adding to the boil? Just throw it in the kettle; it will dissolve in there. Easy peasy.

Cheers,

Christina.

[Otto Von Blotto]

Because there's a chance it might settle on the element cover before it properly dissolves and burn. If I mash low I'll still get it dryish enough to not be too sweet, maybe adjust the water profile too. 

Anyway, I might have a chance to do a brew day next Saturday, so I'll do up a recipe or edit one of the previous ones before then. I enjoy a good bitter

[ChristinaS1]

Ah, an element. That makes sense. 

I use a pot on the stove. No element.

Cheers,

Christina. 

[BlackSands]

On 8/23/2019 at 4:13 AM, ChristinaS1 said:

I use a pot on the stove. No element.

You'd still have a very hot bottom though wouldn't you?   

 

I use an induction cooker but I think that would still scorch if I wasn't careful.

Edited August 24, 2019 by BlackSands

[BlackSands]

On 8/22/2019 at 10:57 AM, BlackSands said:

 I used Bramling Cross once and like Pacific Gem (<-correction) found the woody/oaky aspect pretty over powering and quite unpleasant in the doses I used at the time.  Never got the 'berries' I was hoping for!  If you ever consider these two hops - approach with caution!  Small doses could be ok in certain styles but I overdosed my bitters with them and it was not nice!  

I was doing a bit of reading about suitable hops for bitters, looking for something different to what I've been generally using and I stumbled across someone who kinda agrees with me re: these two hops in particular.  How gratifying!  

Quote

 

Bramling Cross  Tried to like it but just tasted weird.  Has an interesting black current flavor, fairly potent.  Will not use again.

Pacific Gem  Not great, has a weird current flavor kind of like Bramling Cross.  Fairly potent.  Won't buy again.

 

 

[ChristinaS1]

On 8/24/2019 at 2:03 AM, BlackSands said:

You'd still have a very hot bottom though wouldn't you?   

 

I use an induction cooker but I think that would still scorch if I wasn't careful.

I don't find any scorching. It dissolves pretty quickly in the boiling wort. 

[BlackSands]

54 minutes ago, ChristinaS1 said:

I don't find any scorching. It dissolves pretty quickly in the boiling wort. 

I've never actually tested it to be honest.  I know dextrose is very quick to dissolve, just wasn't so sure about table sugar...

[Marty_G]

@BlackSands you use M36 regularly, what have you found the best temp for it to get a some of those esters it throws out ... 

 

[ben 10]

On 8/24/2019 at 3:17 PM, BlackSands said:

How gratifying! 

I'm gonna do an English IPA single hopped with Bramling to see if I can hate on it too.