Xenon Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 Hi Xenon. As a stand alone recipe' date=' it looks like it will produce a nice drop. If however you are aiming to reproduce a full AG version of my Amber Ale recipe, be aware you have shifted the balances notably in some areas in your recipe listing. [list'] [*] Ferment volume increased from 21 litres to 25 litres [*] Original Gravity increased from approx. 1.046 to 1.052. [*] IBU reduced from approx. 32 down to 24. [*] Multiple grain weights increases. I'm not sure if you've used the Wyeast 1318 before, but it does finish a little on the sweet side. If you don't have enough bitterness to compensate for the sweeter flavour in the beer it could come across a little sickly. The chocolate malt is mainly there to help throw the amber hue, so be careful about increasing it, as it will become a more dominant flavour & deepen the colour. I'm not sure how & when you add your steep/whirpool additions, but your calculator seemed to throw up a low IBU number compared with some of Ben 10's figures, so I'm not really sure on that one either. A couple of the other boys have done an AG version of their own, so hopefully they'll chime in with some thoughts. Good luck with whatever you end up putting down. Cheers, Lusty. My batch is actually 23 litres into fermenter , I can scale it down lower if need be no probs. Also, I realise the calculated IBU's are a bit lower , but as I am no chilling I figured I gain a fair bit from that so shouldn't be too far off. I will also scale the OG back a little too to match yours as well. No, I haven't used any liquid yeast before , so should be yet another step forward in my processes , I believe I won't need a starter for this low an O.G. , correct? Also, the flameout/whirlpool additions are a confusing thing. Beersmith by default doesn't add any IBU's for them, whereas I read an interesting article on it and the consensus was to allow for approx 10% utilisation so i put that number in and allow 20 minutes as I normally let it sit for 10 , whirlpool and then drain after another 10. Hopefully someone more experienced than me can give me some guidance. Xenon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottie Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 Well Lusty I finally met this hop and I'm enjoying right now. It is probably the most striking hop I've had in a brew and I've actually found its secret by mistake. So I was after a little bit more aroma in my PLPA clone and knew that the aroma wasn't from Cascade. Therefore I stepped up my Mosaic addition as follows: 15g @ 20 mins 10g @ 10 mins 20g @ F/O 20g Dry Hopped So as I stated in my other thread it is nothing like a PLPA, but I can see why you are a fan. This hop is partnered with Cascade but apart from an initial hit of grapefruit it is totally overpowered. To me its like someone has taken a large syringe of Mango Juice and injected it into my beer, I am not kidding this splash of Mango is unlike anything I've experienced before. Even when I tried to brew your recipe I didn't achieve anything like this. It is also the most easy beer for me to offer tasting notes on 1 Grapefruit 2 Mango Juice in spades 3 lingering pleasant bitterness tending back to grapefruit Cheers & Beers Scottie Accidental Brewer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerlust Posted June 4, 2017 Author Share Posted June 4, 2017 Hiya Scottie. Yep Mosaic is a terrific hop. Mango is an interesting call. My gut feeling is you are getting this flavour/aroma from the mix of Mosaic & Cascade (Stone fruit + Citrus) in your recipe. It definitely has some lovely tropical flavours & aromas. Not since your Styx River Pale Ale days using Galaxy & Willamette have I seen you throw decent volumes of hops at your brews. You wandered off into an ESB & Helles world for many brews for quite sometime, so I'm sure this recent 'hop shock' to your system has been a welcome one, & one your taste buds have been screaming out for! The weather has gotten very cold here in Adelaide of late (yes it is Winter now I know), & I admit I'm starting to pine for some of my Mosaic Amber Ale again. Another brewing of this is on the cards very soon. Cheers & good brewing, Lusty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottie Posted June 5, 2017 Share Posted June 5, 2017 Hiya Scottie. Yep Mosaic is a terrific hop. Mango is an interesting call.. Hey BL I've never been one of those who can take a swig of red wine and detect 1/2 dozen flavours going on. I get about as far as that tastes like Shiraz or that's tastes like Merlo. I'm a bit like that with hops' date=' initially for me Cascade just tasted like Cascade,, grab a craft beer taste it, check the label, yep Cascade. Not until I dropped a decent amount at 15 - 20 minutes did I get some bitter grapefruit, and then I guess one mans grapefruit is another man's lemon or some other citrus. Could be the same with Mosaic, it certainly isn't citrus, and I certainly is familiar. Hints of the same mouth sensation you get from one of those 2 litre fruit juice bottles you get, you know Mango. Not a sickly sweet mango, but one that tastes like beer [img']alien[/img] Over Analysis Scottie Valley Brew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowbrew Posted September 6, 2017 Share Posted September 6, 2017 I am brewing an amber ale this weekend and have decided to use this recipes hop schedule, but am worried that it might come out too bitter. (It will be no chilled) So my question is should i move all the late Mosaic additions to flameout or just brew it as is and see what happens? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowbrew Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 So i have decided to do the hop additions as per the recipe. If i find it too bitter i will change it on the next go. Cheers everyone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joolbag Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 Rowbrew,, I'm juts learning about diff types of hop oils and the best schedules to use for no-chilling. Like a lot of the other AG no-chill brewers say on this forum, try it as is and adjust in future recipes. Keen to hear how you go! I did an APA with Citra/Centenntial/Cascade at 15m, 5m and 0m and it didn't turn out too bitter at all. Low co-humulone % hops Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowbrew Posted September 8, 2017 Share Posted September 8, 2017 Thanks joolbag. Thats good to know. I know that Kelsey also doesn't adjust for no chill and it seems to work for him too. Ill brew it as per the hop schedule and see what happens. Ill report back in about a month or so when i can get one in the glass. I have used my own malt bill instead of Lustys one, and it consists of Maris otter, Munich, Biscuit, Med Crystal and a pinch of Roasted Barley. Ill put the full recipe up in the brewday thread tomorrow before i begin. Thanks again mate! Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Ruddager Posted September 10, 2017 Share Posted September 10, 2017 The whole no-chill adjustment is a bit subjective anyway. Personal habits come into it, so if you're the kind of person who faffs around for 10 minutes between flame-out and starting to chill then you might as well be making no-chill adjustments already, if you know what I mean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#granted+brew Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 Thinking about doing Mosaic Amber Ale for my next brew. I'm looking at using Coopers Family Secret Amber Ale 1.7kg 1.5kg LDM 2 litre boil with 200g of the LDM 15g Cascade @ 20 mins. 10g Mosaic @ 10 mins. 10g Mosaic @ flameout steeped for 30 mins. as wort cools 20g dry hop Mosaic day 4 or 5 going to use the reactivated coopers yeast but will sub out for something else if you all think that's a bad idea.. Pitched and fermented @ 18°C Any suggestions and advice would be greatly appreciated. Cheers, Lee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerlust Posted September 4, 2018 Author Share Posted September 4, 2018 Hi Lee. I haven't brewed the Thomas Coopers Amber Ale kit as yet to know the balances of it, but for your boil hop additions perhaps look to follow something similar to those outlined in the Coopers DIY: Midnight Mosaic Amber Ale recipe for a good outcome. Also take note of the boil volume used. 2 litres is OK this time, but I'd start to get in the habit of boiling 4-5 litre volumes regularly, especially if wish to use larger quantities of hops. You can compensate for the higher temperature of the wort when mixed in your fermenter by placing 4-5 litres of water in your fridge the day before brew day to help bring your brew wort temperature down to a suitable yeast pitching temperature. Best of luck with the brew. Lusty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#granted+brew Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 Cheers Lusty, Ended up just doing a 1 litre hop tea with 20g Mosaic. into 1.5kg LDM T.C Amber Ale 1.7kg Dry hop to follow Mosaic 20g Accidentally filled up to 24 litres rather than the 23 that I was aiming for and stuffed up and put my chilled carboy of water in rather than the one that was at pitching temp... So ended up pitching the re activated coopers yeast in at 16°C but had it up to 19°C in a few hours. O.G was 1.0435 I need to get my pots and boil gear organised anyway before I can start to dabble in any sort of boiling and steeping... I was all set to give my take on your recipe a crack at two litres, when I realised the pot I was trying to use only held about 1.8litres Cheers, Lee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Captain!! Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 Gday @Beerlust Im thinking I’m going to have a crack at one of these. Is this recipe close? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Captain!! Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 Gday @Beerlust Im thinking I’m going to have a crack at one of these. Is this recipe close? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Captain!! Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 Gday @Beerlust Im thinking I’m going to have a crack at one of these. Is this recipe close? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Captain!! Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerlust Posted October 30, 2018 Author Share Posted October 30, 2018 Crikey! I better answer him he's quadruple posting! 14 hours ago, The Captain1525230099 said: Gday @Beerlust Im thinking I’m going to have a crack at one of these. Is this recipe close? Hiya Capt. A little heavy on the Munich but I wouldn't think that would matter too, too much. The only obvious problem I see is your choice of yeast & it's expected high attenuation. The Amber Ale style is a more malt driven style & you want to carryover some sweetness into the beer from the malts you've used. To emphasise this you need to leave more final body in the beer. My recipe & yeast choice (Wyeast 1318) has the beer finish around 1.013-1.014 consistently & with a nice slightly sweet malty finish. Your yeast choice would have the malt profile finish cleaner with less residual sweetness (@ the listed 1.008 FG) & noticeably dry if it reached that level. If you wish to still use the WLP001, being an AG'er you could manipulate the mash temp to make the wort less fermentable but I have no idea on how many points of specific gravity you could gain by doing that. I'll leave that route for the experienced AG'ers on the forum to discuss & advise on. I'm more trusting of the yeast route than the mash route as I have more experience with that. The Wyeast 1318 (reportedly the Boddington's strain) doesn't have a direct equivalent in the White Labs range but choosing an English strain that attenuates a little less leaving more body behind in the beer is the best advice I can give & will produce a beer closer to what I drink from my Mosaic Amber Ale recipe. Your recipe as is would still make a very nice beer, just different that's all. Best of luck with it. Lusty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 What is the mash temp set to in Beersmith? It seems quite a low FG for that malt bill even with that yeast unless it's being mashed around 62-63 degrees. My pale ales contain almost 150g less specialty grains, and I usually mash them around 67C to get an FG around 1.012 with the same yeast which suits them well. If sticking with the same yeast you could probably mash it up around 68-69 degrees to achieve the higher FG noted by Lusty, however I think the yeast strain would have more influence over the sweetness that exists in the beer at the glass than the mash temp alone. I tried that 1318 yeast a couple of times in my red ale and I don't know whether my mash temp was out but I couldn't get it below about 1.016 with it and it ended up too sweet for me. Maybe if it had gotten down to the usual 1.012ish FG it would have been nicer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Captain!! Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 Sorry about the 4 posting, had some internet issues here at work. Thanks for the replies. Yeast: I was thinking the same about attenuation and if I can get some I’ll get the Wyeast 1450, as it leaves some sweetness behind but still chews it up. This yeast works great in the red rye I’ve been brewing. Mash: I basically always do a light temp mash around 63/64. And get pretty spot on Fg/og as predicted by BeerSmith. I think for this one I’ll mash in at 65/66 and use the 1450 yeast, then adjust in the next brews if it needs it as I do like my beers less sweet in most cases. Grain bill: I’ll have a play with the Munich and crystal malts then post again. Thanks for your help lads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Captain!! Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 How’s about now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 Higher FG doesn't necessarily mean the beer has to be too sweet. It can be balanced with hops of course. That red ale I'm always brewing I'd probably call balanced towards the sweet side. There is a noticeable sweetness from the Caraaroma in it, but it's not overpowering to the point of making it cloying or otherwise too sweet. The hops balance it very nicely. There is no Munich malt in that recipe however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Captain!! Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 25 minutes ago, Otto Von Blotto said: Higher FG doesn't necessarily mean the beer has to be too sweet. Yep completely understand that. I was referring to sweetness as FG. 1.008-1.011, not actual sweetness. Probably using the wrong terminology. Apologies. One of the reasons I like the 1450 is that it seems to hold the body of beer however it’s still dry if that makes sense. Which is why I think it’ll be good in an amber. I will think this over on the plane later today and make some more changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 It does, I find similar with 1469. It's a dryish but balanced finish that accentuates the malt a bit more than the hops. Probably why it works really well in my red. 1056 tended to reduce the maltiness a bit much for that beer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Captain!! Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 6 minutes ago, Otto Von Blotto said: It does, I find similar with 1469. It's a dryish but balanced finish that accentuates the malt a bit more than the hops. Probably why it works really well in my red. 1056 tended to reduce the maltiness a bit much for that beer. Fair call. I’ll get a base recipe with this then build from there. Changing yeast and malt to suit after tasting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 I really like Wyeast 1450 and think it would be a perfect yeast for an American Amber ale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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