pilotsh Posted October 13, 2020 Author Share Posted October 13, 2020 11 minutes ago, Pickles Jones said: I was using Woolworths Spring Water as above. Switched over to tap water the difference in the outcome was not an issue nor detectible. At $4 for 10 litres there is a saving to consider. Excellent, thank you for the post. I was wondering if my Apricot nose was due to water, but Norris has suggested it was because of fermenting at 20-22C. So now I will try fermenting at 17-19C. I have a few Water containers that I am looking to use up (thanks CVD19), so yeah..... as I normally do things thoroughly: I will pick a beer we liked and do a repeat brew with bottled water to 'prove' it doesn't change the outcome. *News flash* the SO approved an FV of spring water on the washing machine before Summer hits to use up some of the bottled water.... Sometimes I feel like a scientist! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pezzza Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 32 minutes ago, pilotsh said: Sometimes I feel like a scientist! Mmm you are... and a Brewing Scientist to boot! Good stuff. And maybe have a read of this interesting post... I think you need to try two different brews - same ingredients different yeasts... but I would seriously encourage you to not forego the use of Liquid Malts.... unless you have already moved on to Partials and All Grain perspectives of course... http://brulosophy.com/2017/03/09/yeast-comparison-safale-us-05-vs-saflager-w-3470-exbeeriment-results/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky Micky Posted October 14, 2020 Share Posted October 14, 2020 12 hours ago, Bearded Burbler said: Mmm you are... and a Brewing Scientist to boot! Good stuff. And maybe have a read of this interesting post... I think you need to try two different brews - same ingredients different yeasts... but I would seriously encourage you to not forego the use of Liquid Malts.... unless you have already moved on to Partials and All Grain perspectives of course... http://brulosophy.com/2017/03/09/yeast-comparison-safale-us-05-vs-saflager-w-3470-exbeeriment-results/ Hey BB, I've seen you've mentioned this a couple of times in your posts about using Liquid malts - you are talking about swapping out dry malt for liquid -yes? And if so what would be the difference between the two. Thanks mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pezzza Posted October 14, 2020 Share Posted October 14, 2020 (edited) 9 hours ago, Mickep said: Hey BB, I've seen you've mentioned this a couple of times in your posts about using Liquid malts - you are talking about swapping out dry malt for liquid -yes? And if so what would be the difference between the two. Thanks mate. I think I have gone on and on about it earlier in this very post... it is all about proteins being denatured in the spray-drying process of making the dry products... and that some proteins get conserved in the liquid (wet) products - but of course are better in steeps, partial mashes and then of course all grain - and these contribute to mouthfeel, head and head retention. So dry product adds body and fermentables and hence ABV and flavour - but I did a brew most with dry malt - quite a few kilos - no kit - one small pouch of liquid malt - and my own hopping - and it was very poor on mouthfeel, head and head retention albeit a drinkable ale. Then I started using a) One Coopers Kit e.g. a Dark Ale or Real Ale or Bitter or IPA b) One Coopers Liquid Malt Can 1.5kg - light or amber c) One BE or a kg or two of Dry Malt d) And some late hops in a hop sock after most of the vigorous ferment is over (when you lose volatiles i.e. hop aroma - all you can smell outside is not staying in the beer) All of the above - in the one beer - and you should end up with something pretty nice. So am not really saying INSTEAD OF - but rather - AS WELL AS ; ) I know that @Red devil 44 Red advocates the use of Liquid Malts and gets great results in his festive kegging set-up. I think that @Aussiekraut AK used to use them but has moved along with a few of us onto the all grain thing. I also know that @pilotsh Pilot did not seem to be able to pick up a discernible difference in some of his exbeeriments - so is not a true believer like some of us in the benefit of liquid malts ha ha - but am not sure that Pilot did all three requirements in one go: One Coopers Kit Can 1.7kg your choice (but Ales are easier) One Coopers Liquid Malt Can 1.5kg (light or amber for Ales - dark if you are doing a dark beer) One Kilo of BE2 or BE3 or LDME product (or maybe even two kgs of dry malt ha ha) in approx 23L of water. And use an Ale Yeast. Don't try to brew a Lager unless you use a proper Lager Yeast and do it at cooler temps. Maybe start with Ales they seem a bit easier to get good results with. Hope that helps... and then you can only try it yourself Cobber to see what benefits it brings ; ) Some may not like this, might not fit their budget, may not like heavier body beers - you know - it's all about taste and personal choice at the end of the day : ) Edited October 14, 2020 by Bearded Burbler 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilotsh Posted October 14, 2020 Author Share Posted October 14, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, Bearded Burbler said: I also know that @pilotsh Pilot did not seem to be able to pick up a discernible difference in some of his exbeeriments - so is not a true believer like some of us in the benefit of liquid malts ha ha - but am not sure that Pilot did all three requirements in one go: One Coopers Kit Can 1.7kg your choice (but Ales are easier) One Coopers Liquid Malt Can 1.5kg (light or amber for Ales - dark if you are doing a dark beer) One Kilo of BE2 or BE3 or LDME product (or maybe even two kgs of dry malt ha ha) Hey BB, very comprehensive post! If sample A tastes like Chocolate, and Sample B tastes like Chocolate, if you give me a mix of A and B it will still taste like the same Chocolate: there will just be more of it! In a brewing sense, as I see it, would just raise the ABV even more, and still taste the same. The effect of mouth feel and head retention of the brew is definitely 'discussable', but since I am now a Brown Belt with brew steeps I am already on the next step towards the "holy Brew'ale"! (hint: Monty Python) Edited October 14, 2020 by pilotsh 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pezzza Posted October 14, 2020 Share Posted October 14, 2020 9 hours ago, pilotsh said: If sample A tastes like Chocolate, and Sample B tastes like Chocolate, if you give me a mix of A and B it will still taste like the same Chocolate: there will just be more of it! In a brewing sense, as I see it, would just raise the ABV even more, and still taste the same. The effect of mouth feel and head retention of the brew is definitely 'discussable', but since I am now a Brown Belt with brew steeps I am already on the next step towards the "holy Brew'ale"! (hint: Monty Python) Cheers Pilotus - mate I do not believe dry and liquid are the same chocolate... both from taste and texture... but as you note this is discussable and you did do some liq v dry malt exbeeriments and did not pick up a difference it seems... I just dunno whether you have to go up in total OG/body to actually see the difference kick in from the liquid malts... and yeah liquid steep or partial mash should be better (well dependent also upon relative volume of each added hey)... and all grain is best ; ) I would try a partial mash next Pilot - like 64-68 deg for an hour (even half an hour) with some milled malted grain - just 'cook' up in SS pot at right temp - and then sieve off - maybe boil for an hour with some hops - and sieve off. I have never done a proper partial meself (jumped from liq malts and steeps to All Grain)... but suspect you will find info relatively easily available on the best process for doing that.... And if you can get Weyermann - Bestmalz - or some Euro Malts they seem to attenuate a bit better than our beautiful Aussie ones which are just different. You could probably add the Pils Malt mash to any brew really as an adjunct... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilotsh Posted October 16, 2020 Author Share Posted October 16, 2020 (edited) Brew 012: ROTM Lamington Stout- Thursday 15th October: Preparation/Steep Chocolate Malts Grains Cracked correctly this time and steeped, as per instructions. oh, and in case anyone missed out on the ROTM Hazy IPA, Coopers just announced more stock here: https://www.diybeer.com/au/coopers-hazy-ipa-rotm-pack.html Edited October 16, 2020 by pilotsh corrected date 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilotsh Posted October 16, 2020 Author Share Posted October 16, 2020 Friday 16th October: Brew 012 pitched! (ROTM Lamington Stout) Malt: Canned- Coopers Irish Stout. BB date on can: 06/05/22. Extra Ingredients: 250g Cracked Chocolate Malt Grains, Coopers Light Malt Can (1.5kg), 1.015kg Coopers Brew Enhancer 3 (1 box), Two tablespoons (40ml) cocoa powder. (Mid brew 250g Toasted Desiccated coconut.) Water: Unfiltered rested tap water. Preparation: Cracked Grains steeped for 1 day in 2Lt water in fridge. Brought to 5 minute boil, flame out, added cocoa, restEd for 5 minutes. Cooled in water bath for 15 minutes, strained into FV. Irish Stout and Light Malt Cans stirred into off-the-boil water, added to FV. Stir in one box of Brew Enhancer. Topped to 22.5Lt of fridge water. Yeast: Sachet from Coopers Can, AND 11.5g Safale US-05 Sachet BB date: 05/2022. Pitching Method: Sprinkled both yeasts onto wort. Initial Wort Temperature: 19C Temperature Control: Cooling- Kegerator set to 19C, plugged into the Inkbird. Heating- 35W heat belt, plugged into the Inkbird. The Inkbird prob is taped to the side of the FV. Initial Sample SG (OG): 1060. Can instructions indicated 1038, but many extra ingredients added. Spreadsheet Estimate was 1.061 so ball park check is ok. Comments: Initial sample tasted a little green again, so far preferred the Belgian Chocolate Stout initial taste, but early days yet! Photo(s): 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pezzza Posted October 17, 2020 Share Posted October 17, 2020 11 hours ago, pilotsh said: 1060. Now yer talkin' Pilot !?! Hopefully you will see the difference the Liq Malt makes in this brew ; ) Although as far as I am aware cocoa nibs can have impact on head and head retention so suspect Cocoa powder may as well - but be happy to be proved wrong!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilotsh Posted October 17, 2020 Author Share Posted October 17, 2020 Alright, time for a serious discussion! Brew 13: My Beez Nees Nostalgia Brew. I am thinking I might steep some grain and use one hops.... what varieties do we think? Also tossing up between type of honey. I am thinking: Peacher's Hefe Wheat Can (1.7kg) Wheat Malt Can (1.5kg) ½ box Brew Enhancer 2 (500g) 400g sugars worth of honey thinking 1/2 Capilano "Bold and Dark" and 1/2 Beechworth Mountain One cracked grain steep.... which one and how much? One variety of hops: When to add (boil, flameout or dry) and how much? Maybe an extra 500g of Coopers Light Dry Malt Extra Yeast- Sachet of Munich Classic (Lallemand) (have a lot of fermentables) Followed by honey batch prime, with either Capillano Yellow Box or Beechworth Regular My thinking is adding a grain steep (and BE2) for body Dark Honey to Fermet for flavour Light Honey in Prime for honey notes Hops to Counter any over-sweetness because of the honey prime. This Brew will be like an onion! Not smelly:.... it has layers! (throwback to Shrek) Thoughts, Suggestions, Comments!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pezzza Posted October 17, 2020 Share Posted October 17, 2020 1 hour ago, pilotsh said: One cracked grain steep.... which one and how much? One variety of hops: When to add (boil, flameout or dry) and how much? Hops - at flameout - maybe Mandarina Bavaria? Or maybe as a dry hop? Grain - maybe 500g of the lightest Crystal Malt you can get - as it has already undergone mashing in the seed... read up Crystal Malts... 1 hour ago, pilotsh said: Maybe an extra 500g of Coopers Light Dry Malt YES Thoughts, Suggestions, Comments!? But I must put up full disclosure - I am not expert in partials... Go you good thing! 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilotsh Posted October 17, 2020 Author Share Posted October 17, 2020 Brew 012: Coopers ROTM Lamington Stout- Saturday 17th October: 21 hours (0.88 days) since pitch. Brew Temp: 19.0C, target 19.0C Comments: Foamy Krausen, about 1cm think. Photo(s): 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilotsh Posted October 18, 2020 Author Share Posted October 18, 2020 Brew 012: Coopers ROTM Lamington Stout- Sunday 18th October: 47 hours (1.96days) since pitch. Brew Temp: 19.0-19.5C, target 19.0C Comments: Krausen less foamy and more bubbly, good action, about 1cm think. Delicious Banana Bread smell from the Kegerator. Photo(s): 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilotsh Posted October 19, 2020 Author Share Posted October 19, 2020 Brew 012: Coopers ROTM Lamington Stout- Monday 19th October: 71 hours (2.96days) since pitch. Brew Temp: 18.7-19.5C, target 19.0C Comments: Krausen still bubbly, good action, starting to thin. Will pitch the coconut tomorrow. Photo(s): Nil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilotsh Posted October 20, 2020 Author Share Posted October 20, 2020 (edited) On 10/13/2020 at 9:48 PM, Pickles Jones said: I was using Woolworths Spring Water as above. Switched over to tap water the difference in the outcome was not an issue nor detectible. At $4 for 10 litres there is a saving to consider. Excellent... I will be providing a supplemental exbeeriment to your results. The SO has approved a one-time concurrent brew on the washing machine to get rid of some of our "rations" of Coles spring water. So from tomorrow (just put a bottle in the fridge) I will be doing an identical Brew to brew 003, the only difference being bottled spring water vs tap water. Even the temperature is hovering around the same as brew 3: 20-22C. It breaks my heart not being able to jazz it up a bit with some liquid malts or adjuncts, but if I do, I won't have an answer to the water question. The 'sacrifices' one makes for Science! Edited October 20, 2020 by pilotsh 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilotsh Posted October 20, 2020 Author Share Posted October 20, 2020 Brew 012: Coopers ROTM Lamington Stout- Tuesday 20th October: 96 hours (4.0 days) since pitch. Brew Temp: 18.7-19.5C, target 19.0C Comments: Recipe Coconut “dry hop” time! Worked well! Photo(s): 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilotsh Posted October 21, 2020 Author Share Posted October 21, 2020 Brew 012: Coopers ROTM Lamington Stout- Wednesday 21st October: 120 hours (5.0 days) since pitch. Brew Temp: 18.9-19.5C, target 19.0C Comments: Coconut "dry hop" has moved around, surface still showing bubble activity. Happy. Photo(s): Nil 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilotsh Posted October 21, 2020 Author Share Posted October 21, 2020 Brew 008R: Pale Ale with reactivated yeast using Bottled Water. Prepared last night Tue 20th Oct, Reactivating Coopers Yeast for experiment: I will photo and update tomorrow 22nd October, probably with the main post of pitching. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilotsh Posted October 22, 2020 Author Share Posted October 22, 2020 (edited) Brew 012: Coopers ROTM Lamington Stout- Thursday 22nd October: 140 hours (5.83 days) since pitch. Brew Temp: 18.9-19.4C, target 19.0C Comments: Still occasional Surface bubble activity. Will start testing SG from Tomorrow. Photo(s): Brew 008R: Pale Ale with reactivated yeast using Bottled Water: Yeast still waking up. Not ready to pitch today. Edited October 22, 2020 by pilotsh 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pezzza Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 24 minutes ago, pilotsh said: Brew 008R: Pale Ale with reactivated yeast using Bottled Water: Yeast still waking up. Not ready to pitch today. Not sure whether this is relevant in this particular circumstance - but you don't wanna leave Brew lying around without pitching for too long - cos if there is one cell of wild yeast in there... it will get away... pitching soon after the brew is ready is best... just a quick thought... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilotsh Posted October 22, 2020 Author Share Posted October 22, 2020 2 hours ago, Bearded Burbler said: Not sure whether this is relevant in this particular circumstance - but you don't wanna leave Brew lying around without pitching for too long - BB you should know me better than that.... the brew is still in the can.... waiting for the yeast to get hungry! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pezzza Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 19 hours ago, pilotsh said: BB you should know me better than that.... the brew is still in the can.... waiting for the yeast to get hungry! Hahah luvyerwork Pilot!!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilotsh Posted October 23, 2020 Author Share Posted October 23, 2020 Brew 012: Coopers ROTM Lamington Stout- Friday 23rd October: 164 hours (6.83 days) since pitch. Brew Temp: 19.0-19.4C, target 19.0C SG: 1019.5 Appearance: Slightly cloudy chocolate/mud Nose: Chocolate, light apricot, hints of nut. Palate: Chocolate cake, gives way to raspberry jam notes, and even hints of coconut. OMG it actually tastes like Lamington! Comments: Very Happy! Photo(s): 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pale Man Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 21 minutes ago, pilotsh said: Brew 012: Coopers ROTM Lamington Stout- Friday 23rd October: 164 hours (6.83 days) since pitch. Brew Temp: 19.0-19.4C, target 19.0C SG: 1019.5 Appearance: Slightly cloudy chocolate/mud Nose: Chocolate, light apricot, hints of nut. Palate: Chocolate cake, gives way to raspberry jam notes, and even hints of coconut. OMG it actually tastes like Lamington! Comments: Very Happy! Photo(s): Are you sure you're not a beer judge with those tasting notes 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoppy81 Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 5 minutes ago, Pale Man said: Are you sure you're not a beer judge with those tasting notes Says the man who descibed my stout like smoking a cuban cigar hahaha 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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