Brew Day!! Watcha' got, eh!? no.3

[antiphile]

Howdy Greg

 

That should turn out to be a very nice, sessionable, mid-strength. I'd be very interested to hear out it goes, and I'll be particularly interested in how the colour turns out. If you have the means, after conditioning, you might even be able to post a pic?

 

I thought when I bottled my second attempt at a red ale (post #18 in Hairy's Red IPA thread), I thought it was lacking too much colour to call it red, probably more of a lightish golden ale colour. Yet it seemed to darken a bit more after 8 weeks bottle conditioning and was definitately starting to show some red hues. I'm tempted to make the same again (including the 500 g Carared) and add 25-30 g Roasted Barley. I'm guessing that will get me pretty close.

 

Once I'm happy with the colour, I'll only need to work out a hop schedule so it has a little more bitterness, and some freshness to give it some zing.

 

Good luck with yours!

 

[Magnaman]

Championing the cause for the much maligned OS Lager tin.

 

I have noticed that the "much maligned" OS Lager is held in little regard by many' date=' but it must be said it is a blank canvas and very receptive to "tweaking" in all sorts of ways.

I had a can from a second FV I purchased in late in February. What to do?

I had just finished a TC Sparkling Ale with re-cultured Coopers commercial yeast, so I collected some and pitched in this Lager brew.

 

OS Lager 1.7Kg

TC LME 1.5Kg

LDM 200g

made up to 23 Liters, pitched CC yeast @ 24C and then brewed @ 18C for about 2 weeks, dry hopped with 20g of Motueka and bottled.

 

I didn't expect much.

 

From the first taster after 2 weeks in the bottle I was pleasantly surprised by the result, now at 6 weeks it still brings a smile,

light flavoued, with a good creamy long lasting head with a pleasing citrus bitterness, my belief is the yeast had a big impact on the out come. I will brew this again for sure. [img']wink[/img]

 

Cheers.

 

[antiphile]

dry hopped with 20g of Motueka

 

Howdy Magnaman

 

I've heard of a few people that like Mortueka. I'll have to get some and try it (I've been meaning to get some Victoria Secret as well).

 

Cheers

[chromakey]

Hey Hairy.

 

How did your red IPA turn out in the end?

[PhilboBaggins]

It's actually going to be a bit of a brew day for me when I get home.

 

I am pitching my APA from Saturday's brew day, but I will also be making a kit beer for my brother in law based on the Real Ale kit. I have about 90g each of Centennial and Citra to put in, along with 1.5kg DME and some BRY-97 yeast. Maybe some Crystal malt too.

 

Will play with exact additions and stuff as I'm mixing it up I guess.

[antiphile]

Go nuts, P2, and experiment. The worst thing that can happen is your sister gets to choose a new spouse. Unless, of course, you like the guy. Then you'll have to give the quantities a bit of thought.

 

Though having said that, I've made several "cockups" (doing things I didn't mean to), but have been amazed the results have usually been quite drinkable and pleasantly surprising. I guess that means one of two things: (a) the kits are really very forgiving; or (b) my taste is in the place where I sit!

 

I'm guessing you're pitching today because you use no-chill. I'm really going to have to investigate that one and get some learning into me.

[PhilboBaggins]

No-chill rocks.

[GregT5]

Sir Les, I will definitely post a pic of the brew if it turns out to be somewhere near the red ales in the "Craftedpours" website you linked to your posts in the other thread. Probably post a pic even if it is not.

 

I will be interested to see how yours turns out using the CaraRed. I asked the question about getting the red colour in a brew on another forum, and was advised that CaraAroma is more likely to produce the redness rather than the CaraRed. I guess we will have to wait & see.

[PhilboBaggins]

I've used Caraaroma in IPAs, ESBs, and Dubbels. All have come out very red.

 

Good luck, it's a difficult colour to get right.

[Beerlust]

Hi Philbo.

...I will also be making a kit beer for my brother in law based on the Real Ale kit. I have about 90g each of Centennial and Citra to put in' date=' along with 1.5kg DME and some BRY-97 yeast. Maybe some Crystal malt too.

 

Will play with exact additions and stuff as I'm mixing it up I guess. [img']biggrin[/img]

Are you planning on making an IPA or APA with this Philbo?

 

Also, whilst on the subject (sort of) of IPA's, how did your home grown Chinook IPA turn out? I've been anxiously awaiting some sort of report from you on it. (My apologies if you have posted something, & I have missed it!)

 

Cheers,

 

Anthony.

[MikeM16]

The project at the moment is a Russian Imperial - basically as per Coopers standard. It's a toucan (Stout and Dark Ale), with 2 kg sugar, Coopers cultured yeast and a spoonful of coffee and chocolate topping. I'm just breaking into the batch I made last year and it's a nice drop on a cold evening.

 

Brewing this time of year is probably wrong for this type but I need consistently low temperatures to prevent it turning into a volcano. I've been doing the old Coolgardie safe routine on it for the first week, brewing around 18 Celsius. Plus I used a half dose of yeast so that it doesn't fire up so quickly.

 

Trouble is that it takes a long time in the primary fermentation, so I'll have to do some catching up on my IPA once this is through!

 

Cheers,

 

Mike

[antiphile]

Hi Mike

 

I saw your post when I woke up during the night and was a bit drowsy so I didn't want to put my foot in my mouth. Now I've had time to think about it and get several cups of coffee in me, I still have the same concerns. Of course, if you've used the "half the yeast" strategy before with good resultsbefore, then it may be the way to go. However if it were me, I'd try a different approach and accept the volcano. Let me explain.

 

Without doing the calculations, a two can with lots of other fermentables will probably be about or above OG 1.070. And if I read correctly, you wish to use half of one 7 g sachet of yeast. Here I expect you might run into stalled and incomplete fermentation, the inability for the yeast to reproduce to a sufficient number due to lack of trace minerals etc. From one of my books, there is a nice explanation of some outcomes as follows:

 

Q: What is the best way to cut down on yeast off-flavors?

A: I will answer this question assuming that you have

selected an appropriate yeast strain for the style and

that no contaminating organisms exist in the yeast slurry.

The best advice I can offer on reducing yeast off-flavors is to

begin with well-aerated wort, add enough yeast so that you

are not underpitching, control fermentation temperature,

and rack the beer off the yeast after primary fermentation

to avoid autolysis.

Aeration is very important because growing yeast cells

require oxygen to synthesize cell wall components. Yeast

health can be compromised if wort oxygen is too low, and

beer flavor can be affected by changes in how metabolic

intermediates flow through biochemical pathways. The

most notable thing about beers made from under-aerated

worts is that they tend to be very estery. Wort oxygen level

also influences fermentation speed. Starting off with well­

aerated wort is just good practice; the ideal level is about 8

mg/L, which is the maximum amount of oxygen wort can

hold if aerated with air (as opposed to pure oxygen).

One mistake that many brewers make is not pitching

enough yeast. Underpitching causes some of the same prob­

lems as under-aerating because the growing yeast cells run

short of oxygen, resulting in many of the same off-flavors

and fermentation behavior. Lagging and stuck fermen­

tations are common problems when insufficient yeast is

added, causing problems other than yeast related off-flavors.

When using liquid yeast, I always like to make a starter so

that I am pitching 1 to 2 quarts (about 1 L) of active yeast

slurry into a 5-gallon (19 L) batch. If you harvest yeast for

subsequent reuse, you will need about a quart (250 mL) to

get a good pitching rate. Rules for dry yeast vary, because

not all yeast sachets contain the same weight.

Controlling fermentation temperature is another key

to cutting down on yeast off-flavors. I am not suggesting

buying elaborate and expensive temperature-control sys­

tems, unless you are at that stage of the hobby where you

really want that type of control. Most homebrewers can do

a pretty good job controlling temperature simply by select­

ing a cool part of the house to conduct ale fermentations. I

suggest keeping most ales below 72F (22C) to get the best

results. When it comes to lagers, most homes are not cool

enough; a garage corner in the fall or winter or a refrigerator

is required to ferment and age lagers.

Finally, racking beer off yeast after fermentation reduces

the chances that your beer will pick up autolyzed flavors. I

suggest racking no later than 2 weeks after primary fermen­

tation is complete and most of the yeast has settled to the

bottom of the fermenter. If you are using a conical fermen­

ter, you can simply remove the yeast from the bottom of the

cone without transferring the beer to another fermenter .

 

I know this doesn't specifically relate to your situation (making an ale rather than a lager), and you're question was more concerned with fermentation aggressiveness rather than off flavours etc, but the same probles are likely to rise as a result of so severely underpitching the yeast.

 

Irrespective, good luck and I hope you have an enjoyable tipple for next year's winter.

[PhilboBaggins]

Are you planning on making an IPA or APA with this Philbo?

 

Also' date=' whilst on the subject (sort of) of IPA's, how did your home grown Chinook IPA turn out? I've been anxiously awaiting some sort of report from you on it. (My apologies if you have posted something, & I have missed it!)

 

Cheers,

 

Anthony.[/quote']

 

Hey Lusty. I'm making an IPA for this one.

 

My home grown Chinook APA was a bit of a flop, and if it weren't for the 25g Citra dry hop I put in to save it, it'd probably be a tipper. Very grassy, not much Chinook flavour, and nowhere near bitter enough. My guess is I've picked them early, and/or dried/stored them incorrectly.

 

Not giving up though, and I'm expecting a Victoria rhizome from Dr. Smurto this week, so I'm planning to get it right eventually.

[PhilboBaggins]

The project at the moment is a Russian Imperial - basically as per Coopers standard. It's a toucan (Stout and Dark Ale)' date=' with 2 kg sugar, Coopers cultured yeast and a spoonful of coffee and chocolate topping. I'm just breaking into the batch I made last year and it's a nice drop on a cold evening.

 

Brewing this time of year is probably wrong for this type but I need consistently low temperatures to prevent it turning into a volcano. I've been doing the old Coolgardie safe routine on it for the first week, brewing around 18 Celsius. Plus I used a half dose of yeast so that it doesn't fire up so quickly.

 

Trouble is that it takes a long time in the primary fermentation, so I'll have to do some catching up on my IPA once this is through!

 

Cheers,

 

Mike[/quote']

 

Keeping temps down to avoid volcano? Go nuts!

 

Pitching half the yeast? Nooooooooooooo!

 

In a bigger beer, you need MORE yeast than normal. A 1.070 beer I would chuck 2 x 11.5g sachets into.

 

Use Fermcap or attach a blow off tube. Piece of cake.

[Hairy]

Another option with kits and extract beers is to reduce the amount of the top up water to increase the headspace in the FV.

 

Then, after the explosiveness has died down, top it up with cool boiled water.

[antiphile]

Hi again Mike

 

Even after a full night's sleep and lots of coffee I was still brain-dead, and have only noticed you've already put the brew down. After doing the figures, the OG is 1.081. If its only been fermenting for up to, say, 3 days or so, I'd be tempted to pitch more yeast to make it up to at least a total of two and half sachets (if they are 7 g coopers yeast), doing it immediately as per P1 and Hairy's recommendations.

 

I'm pretty sure that PB2s recipe for Russian Imperial Stout (it's a three can) which has a similar OG advises to pitch all three yeasts that come with the kits.

 

Edited: I incorrectly said above the Mr Sinister was a three can. This is wrong, so I've corrected it to the Russian Imperial Stout. Sorry 'bout that.

[Beerlust]

My home grown Chinook APA was a bit of a flop' date=' and if it weren't for the 25g Citra dry hop I put in to save it, it'd probably be a tipper. Very grassy, not much Chinook flavour, and nowhere near bitter enough. My guess is I've picked them early, and/or dried/stored them incorrectly.

 

Not giving up though, and I'm expecting a Victoria rhizome from Dr. Smurto this week, so I'm planning to get it right eventually. [img']lol[/img]

Sorry to hear that your home grown Chinook beer didn't turn out as you had hoped. I do admire your courage at having a crack it though!

I remember suggesting that you use a commercial hop for your bittering addition so that the uncertainty of what alpha acids were available from the home grown hops would not potentially ruin the beer. Maybe a safer option next time?

 

Another option with kits and extract beers is to reduce the amount of the top up water to increase the headspace in the FV.

 

Then' date=' after the explosiveness has died down, top it up with cool boiled water.[/quote']

I've often wondered about this technique. By doing this, aren't you pitching the yeast into a noticeably higher OG wort prior to adding the top up cooled boiled water? For example, if your full brew wort (for say a stout) of 23 litres has an OG of 1.070, removing 3 litres of top up water from that equation has this same brew wort at 20 litres producing an approx. OG of 1.080 when pitching the yeast (10 points higher).

 

Are there any primary fermentation related problems that can occur by doing this (i.e. increased chance of stalling)? Do you inherently need to pitch more yeast to begin with?

 

Cheers,

 

Anthony.

[Hairy]

Another option with kits and extract beers is to reduce the amount of the top up water to increase the headspace in the FV.

 

Then' date=' after the explosiveness has died down, top it up with cool boiled water.[/quote']

I've often wondered about this technique. By doing this, aren't you pitching the yeast into a noticeably higher OG wort prior to adding the top up cooled boiled water? For example, if your full brew wort (for say a stout) of 23 litres has an OG of 1.070, removing 3 litres of top up water from that equation has this same brew wort at 20 litres producing an approx. OG of 1.080 when pitching the yeast (10 points higher).

 

Are there any primary fermentation related problems that can occur by doing this (i.e. increased chance of stalling)? Do you inherently need to pitch more yeast to begin with?

 

Cheers,

 

Anthony.

Yeast pitching rates are based on OG and volume. So a high OG / Low volume wort may require the same amount of yeast as a low OG / high volume wort.

 

Mr Malty suggests that you need 16g dry yeast for 23 litres of 1070 OG wort and also for 20 litres of 1080 OG wort.

 

So it should be fine but it is still always a good idea to make sure you are pitching the correct amount of yeast.

[Beerlust]

Cheers Hairy.

[PhilboBaggins]

I remember suggesting that you use a commercial hop for your bittering addition so that the uncertainty of what alpha acids were available from the home grown hops would not potentially ruin the beer. Maybe a safer option next time?

 

Yeah, but only slightly. Most of my hoppier recipes get around 75% of their IBUs from the lates. This recipe was supposed to be 35-40 but tastes about 20.

[MikeM16]

AntiPhile, Philbo

 

Thanks guys - I'll definitely boost the yeast up and keep the temperatures down for this batch. (Trying to keep the esters at bay.) Brewing rate is pretty slow so far, and I guess that the lower temperature is one of the factors. (It's well below 20 C at the moment.)

 

The saving grace with one is the powerful flavour - it might not be too subtle! And aeration is something I'll work on in the future.

 

This brewing business is a bit of a black art.

 

Cheers,

 

MikeM

 

 

[MikeM16]

Hairy

 

Thanks for your help.

 

I've left 3 litres headroom and will do the top-up next week when I top it up. Given the comments by Philbo and AntiPhile, maybe I should rack off the lees and aerate the brew at the same time? Or is this too much of an infection risk?

 

Cheers,

 

MikeM

[PhilboBaggins]

It's actually going to be a bit of a brew day for me when I get home.

 

I am pitching my APA from Saturday's brew day' date=' but I will also be making a kit beer for my brother in law based on the Real Ale kit. I have about 90g each of Centennial and Citra to put in, along with 1.5kg DME and some BRY-97 yeast. Maybe some Crystal malt too.

 

Will play with exact additions and stuff as I'm mixing it up I guess. [img']biggrin[/img]

 

Ended up putting this one down last night.

 

1 x Can Coopers Real Ale

1.5kg Light DME

300g Sugar

250g Medium Crystal

 

20g Centennial & 20g Mosaic @ 10 min, 5 min, 0 min

 

All done after work and before dinner time! I've got to say, while I can certainly pick the difference in the end result from a kit beer to an all grain beer and prefer the latter, getting brew day done in 1 hr is pretty sweet.

 

P.S. - BRY-97 pitched at 6:00pm yesterday @ 21C - krausen when I woke up today.

[Beerlust]

Hi Philbo.

...getting brew day done in 1 hr is pretty sweet.

+1

 

Yup after a few long 3-4 hour grain mash brews in a row' date=' a short 'Kits & Bits' brew day is a nice change! [img']smile[/img]

 

P.S. - BRY-97 pitched at 6:00pm yesterday @ 21C - krausen when I woke up today.

I wonder whose benefit that was posted for?

 

You're a cruel man Philbo!

 

That's ok though. BRY-97 is my yeast demon' date=' Reusing CCA yeast is yours! [img']lol[/img]

 

It looks like a nice drop, good luck with the brew.

 

Cheers,

 

Anthony.

[Hairy]

Hey Hairy.

 

How did your red IPA turn out in the end?

It turned out red

 

Not the 'just opened an artery' red but a nice red nonetheless.