How To Gain The Most From Your Hops

[Beerlust]

Hi Clint.

3 hours ago, Clinto73 said:

I am pretty new to HB but am keen to start using hops more..

For the dry hopping i saw a you tube clip (american) where he put marbles in with the hops to sink it to the bottom of FV

What's your take on that technique ? I was just going to use the chux (floating on the top) as per the Coopers advice.

There's nothing wrong with adding marbles (that are sanitised first) into a dry hop baggy to weigh it down, I've just never understood the need. Hop pellets or dried whole hop cones will absorb liquid that draws them under the surface as does the chux cloth they are contained in. I just give the hop bag a short dunking up & down (without splashing) initially when adding.

The key is to make sure there is enough room in the bag for the hops to expand & not clump together when they absorb liquid. Don't forget to squeeze the liquid from the hop bag on removing it, as this liquid is often highly aromatic & beneficial to retain in the beer.

3 hours ago, Clinto73 said:

Secondly i brought a bag of the Morgans finishing hope (goldings) for my upcoming brown ale. How do you rate the finishing hops against just dry hopping ?

The term "finishing hop" often refers to a late flavour/aroma addition added either for a short boil, or in a "hop tea" (hot steep).

Given you're making a brown ale, I'm guessing this is what the recipe is asking you to do with the Golding hops.

A hop that is late boiled or hot steeped will add flavour & some aroma. A hop that is dry hopped is generally used to boost aroma only.

I hope that helps, & good luck with the brew.

Lusty.

[MitchellScott]

On 6/19/2020 at 10:20 PM, Norris! said:

@MitchellScott

You have a S&W recipe don't you. It would be basically 60/40 base malt and wheat. I would bitter it with a flameout addition to 21 to 25 IBUs with galaxy and call it a day, but I have not tried to clone it, I think Mitchell said he got pretty close. Hope he sees this and can provide the recipe.

Mine was extract using unhopped liquid malts and doing a 10L boil. Was pretty spot on, but a little bit more bitter than the original.

If you are using kits, I would probably go the Cerveza and get yourself a tin of wheat malt extract and go something along the lines of:

Coopers Mexican Cerveza kit
1.5kg liquid wheat malt
40g Galaxy hop stand (below 75C) - optional and will require a boil with the wheat malt.
50g Galaxy Dry Hop day 7
US-05 yeast.

Start with that hop schedule then if its not enough hoppage for you, you can up the amounts next time you make it.

Mitch.

[Clinto73]

6 hours ago, Beerlust said:

Hi Clint.

There's nothing wrong with adding marbles (that are sanitised first) into a dry hop baggy to weigh it down, I've just never understood the need. Hop pellets or dried whole hop cones will absorb liquid that draws them under the surface as does the chux cloth they are contained in. I just give the hop bag a short dunking up & down (without splashing) initially when adding.

The key is to make sure there is enough room in the bag for the hops to expand & not clump together when they absorb liquid. Don't forget to squeeze the liquid from the hop bag on removing it, as this liquid is often highly aromatic & beneficial to retain in the beer.

The term "finishing hop" often refers to a late flavour/aroma addition added either for a short boil, or in a "hop tea" (hot steep).

Given you're making a brown ale, I'm guessing this is what the recipe is asking you to do with the Golding hops.

A hop that is late boiled or hot steeped will add flavour & some aroma. A hop that is dry hopped is generally used to boost aroma only.

I hope that helps, & good luck with the brew.

Lusty.

 

That helps a lot & thanks for taking the time 

Cheers

Clint 

 

[Goldcoast Crow]

Thank guys, should get me started here

[RDT2]

On 6/21/2020 at 10:09 AM, Beerlust said:

Hi Clint.

There's nothing wrong with adding marbles (that are sanitised first) into a dry hop baggy to weigh it down, I've just never understood the need. Hop pellets or dried whole hop cones will absorb liquid that draws them under the surface as does the chux cloth they are contained in. I just give the hop bag a short dunking up & down (without splashing) initially when adding.

Just a query Lusty wouldn’t this depend on what temp you are dry hopping if you dry hop at say 20degrees I have found the hops float and yes there is plenty of room in the bag. But when I have cold crashed the hops sink.(obviously reason for cold crash) So if someone didn’t have the means to cold crash they may need weights which I have used stainless steel rings (easy to clean no corners or crevices for bad crap to hide) from Bunnings  don’t use cheap bearings from China/ ebay they rust and marbles be careful if sterilising by boiling cause they can shatter if the heat change is too rapid. 

cheers

[Beerlust]

Hi RDT2.

7 hours ago, RDT2 said:

Just a query Lusty wouldn’t this depend on what temp you are dry hopping if you dry hop at say 20degrees I have found the hops float and yes there is plenty of room in the bag. But when I have cold crashed the hops sink.(obviously reason for cold crash) So if someone didn’t have the means to cold crash they may need weights which I have used stainless steel rings (easy to clean no corners or crevices for bad crap to hide) from Bunnings  don’t use cheap bearings from China/ ebay they rust and marbles be careful if sterilising by boiling cause they can shatter if the heat change is too rapid.

The key is for all the hop matter to come in contact with the wort/beer, draw in liquid & release the aromatic oils into solution. As long as all the hop matter comes in contact with the wort/beer it doesn't matter whether the hops are sitting on the surface, or at the bottom of the FV. Containing them in something that also absorbs liquid (such as a chux cloth) will also help to keep them in contact with the wort/beer. Hoist them out after a few days & give the bag a good squeeze to release all the very aromatic liquid now contained in the hop matter back into the beer.

My dry hops are actually removed before cold crash. Never had a problem with lack of aroma from dry hopping this way.

As far as using marbles goes, you don't need to hurl them into boiling water, you can actually steep them at much lower pasteurisation temperatures that will kill any potential bacteria or germs etc. on them. Or even quicker, just give them a good blast with StarSan & let them dry before adding into your hop baggy. 

Cheers,

Lusty.

[RDT2]

1 hour ago, Beerlust said:

Hi RDT2.

The key is for all the hop matter to come in contact with the wort/beer, draw in liquid & release the aromatic oils into solution. As long as all the hop matter comes in contact with the wort/beer it doesn't matter whether the hops are sitting on the surface, or at the bottom of the FV. Containing them in something that also absorbs liquid (such as a chux cloth) will also help to keep them in contact with the wort/beer. Hoist them out after a few days & give the bag a good squeeze to release all the very aromatic liquid now contained in the hop matter back into the beer.

My dry hops are actually removed before cold crash. Never had a problem with lack of aroma from dry hopping this way.

As far as using marbles goes, you don't need to hurl them into boiling water, you can actually steep them at much lower pasteurisation temperatures that will kill any potential bacteria or germs etc. on them. Or even quicker, just give them a good blast with StarSan & let them dry before adding into your hop baggy. 

Cheers,

Lusty.

Mine sink initially then float after a few hours, just surfacing I seem to be getting plenty of aroma so all good

[James Lao]

When doing a big dry hop in a hop bag I found half the hops didn’t contact with the wort until cold crash, ( like a little hop island).

So I tried a few sinking methods and settled on a Pyrex bowl inside the hop bag.

Just got to make sure the top knot is below the top of the wort otherwise it doesn’t work because hops float!

Works a treat for me  and I reckon I can Defo taste the extra flavour and aroma from doing it.

I’m all about the bang for buck with hops!

Cheers

James

 

Edited June 24, 2020 by James Lao

[Clinto73]

My Brigalow Cider comes in at gravity 1000 today after one week in the FV, which was surprising as i heard these take around two weeks normally ?.(temps steady 19-20C) 

I will of course check tomorrow but it's looking finished..must have been the S-04 yeast which i know is quite fast 

Just checking in with the brew brains trust on here as to when i should bottle ... ?

As i only dry hopped yesterday, is there much to be gained by leaving the dry hops in for another couple of days and it does look a fair bit cloudy in there..

Cheers

Clint 

[Shamus O'Sean]

8 hours ago, James Lao said:

When doing a big dry hop in a hop bag I found half the hops didn’t contact with the wort until cold crash, ( like a little hop island).

So I tried a few sinking methods and settled on a Pyrex bowl inside the hop bag.

Just got to make sure the top knot is below the top of the wort otherwise it doesn’t work because hops float!

Works a treat for me  and I reckon I can Defo taste the extra flavour and aroma from doing it.

I’m all about the bang for buck with hops!

Cheers

James

 

Looks like that idea would keep most of the hops out of the yeast cake too

[James Lao]

I like it mate.

I can see the top knot floating on the surface so I know that the hops are just below that making full contact with the beer.

I dry hop pretty much at FG so most of the Krausen has dropped already.

2 days at about 21 degC, then at least a few days CCing  and I have been really happy with the results.

Used to give me the shits when I would dry hop 100+ grams of hops and half of them were getting a sun tan so to speak!

Cheers

James

[Beerlust]

12 hours ago, James Lao said:

When doing a big dry hop in a hop bag I found half the hops didn’t contact with the wort until cold crash, ( like a little hop island).

So I tried a few sinking methods and settled on a Pyrex bowl inside the hop bag.

Just got to make sure the top knot is below the top of the wort otherwise it doesn’t work because hops float!

Works a treat for me  and I reckon I can Defo taste the extra flavour and aroma from doing it.

I’m all about the bang for buck with hops!

Cheers

James

 

Overkill James IMHO.

Your hop bag looks to be made of nylon , no wonder your hops may have floated above the surface in this bag as nylon does not absorb liquid thus won't force itself down to the surface like an absorbent material will.

As I previously mentioned, use an absorbent material to house your hops in, then there will be no need to create hanging pot plant type scenarios to force your dry hops under water.

Just my 20 cents,

Lusty.

[James Lao]

In my experience it is worth it at the glass especially when doing big dry hops.

Have tried chux and cotton hop bags previously but can’t say for sure whether the hops floated as much as when using a nylon bag.? 

Pretty sure they still floated, that’s what led me to trying to submerge the hops

I do prefer the nylon as it is easier to clean compared to cotton and doesn’t soak up as much beer as Chux or cotton (I don’t normally  remove or squeeze the bag).

To submerge or not to submerge?

Whatever works for the individual I suppose.

Cheers

James

Edited June 24, 2020 by James Lao

[MitchellScott]

1 hour ago, James Lao said:

In my experience it is worth it at the glass especially when doing big dry hops.

Have tried chux and cotton hop bags previously but can’t say for sure whether the hops floated as much as when using a nylon bag.? 

Pretty sure they still floated, that’s what led me to trying to submerge the hops

I do prefer the nylon as it is easier to clean compared to cotton and doesn’t soak up as much beer as Chux or cotton (I don’t normally  remove or squeeze the bag).

To submerge or not to submerge?

Whatever works for the individual I suppose.

Cheers

James

Although lately I have just been throwing in my hops commando, when I used a bag I found great success with a few marbles. They are heavy enough to weigh the bag down and nice and small plus easy to sanitise (just boil them with the bag).

Mitch.

[iBooz2]

I dry hop commando style in the fermzilla as the hop matter seems to settle to the bottom of the collection container leaving enough relative clean yeast to harvest above it at the end of the cold crash.  I harvest the yeast I want out through the red port in pic after kegging is done and dusted whilst there is still some pressure in the Fermzilla.  Have dry hopped commando style a few times using the Cooper's FV and not had any problems with hop matter getting into the kegs.  I do cold crash for 1 week minimum usually so pretty well compacted by then.

Just think dry hopping commando gives me more bang for my buck IMO and also still allows more bang for my buck by reusing that yeast.

Hop bags are useful and always used in the hop boil side of things, just keep them moving and submerged with the spoon.  I have some SS hop ball jiggers but find they seem to open themselves up at times in the boil so their sieving purpose is lost on those occasions.

Cheers - AL

Edited June 25, 2020 by iBooz2

[Amarillo Armadillo]

I like Brewdog Punk IPA or Shipyard IPA sort of flavours.

First time using hops so here’s the brew I’ve just put down (it’s my 5th ever brew so I’m a total noob).

• Coopers Pale Ale kit
• 1kg light DME
• 30g Amarillo
• 30g Cascade

1. Added DME to 2l pre-steaming water
2. Cascade @20mins
3. Amarillo @10 mins 
4. Left both in at flame out for 5 mins (Double-muslin-bagged each and gave them a squeeze when took out of solution)
5. Added solution to FV
6. Added kit
7. Made up to 21l
8. Pitched kit yeast at 24C
9. OG 1.037

Questions (you did ask for questions!):

1. Is it better to steep hops in off-boiled water rather than in DME solution?
2. Tried to keep at 24C with wet towel around and a fan pointed at the FV but temperature got up to 26C at times during bubble phase. Is that a problem?
3. Bubble phase only lasted 24 hours. Why?
4. I couldn’t taste any tropical/fruity flavours when sampled wort. Should they come through later or have I not used enough or boiled the flavours out?
5. Shall I dry hop 25g Citra in muslin 3 days before bottling?
6. If adding the hops means I’ve got to expose the beer to air, isn’t that a really bad idea?
7. Should I have used US-05 instead/as well as the kit yeast?

Thanks for this thread!

AA

[Goldcoast Crow]

So this at sound lazy, but the only way to add hops,or that hoppy flavour is to boil em pre wort insertion.... as I am learning this next stage of experimentation, obviously just adding malt extract or brew enhancer doesn't require anything other than cut n pour into the wort, but hopping requires a bit more technique, am I reading this right?

[Lettucegrove]

So what the most efficient way to increase aroma when kegging, dry hopping the FV or making a hop tea and adding to the keg? I stopped dry hopping a fair while ago due to the lack luster results plus i'm a tightarse. 

[Clinto73]

4 hours ago, Amarillo Armadillo said:

I like Brewdog Punk IPA or Shipyard IPA sort of flavours.

First time using hops so here’s the brew I’ve just put down (it’s my 5th ever brew so I’m a total noob).

• Coopers Pale Ale kit
• 1kg light DME
• 30g Amarillo
• 30g Cascade

1. Added DME to 2l pre-steaming water
2. Cascade @20mins
3. Amarillo @10 mins 
4. Left both in at flame out for 5 mins (Double-muslin-bagged each and gave them a squeeze when took out of solution)
5. Added solution to FV
6. Added kit
7. Made up to 21l
8. Pitched kit yeast at 24C
9. OG 1.037

Questions (you did ask for questions!):

1. Is it better to steep hops in off-boiled water rather than in DME solution?
2. Tried to keep at 24C with wet towel around and a fan pointed at the FV but temperature got up to 26C at times during bubble phase. Is that a problem?
3. Bubble phase only lasted 24 hours. Why?
4. I couldn’t taste any tropical/fruity flavours when sampled wort. Should they come through later or have I not used enough or boiled the flavours out?
5. Shall I dry hop 25g Citra in muslin 3 days before bottling?
6. If adding the hops means I’ve got to expose the beer to air, isn’t that a really bad idea?
7. Should I have used US-05 instead/as well as the kit yeast?

Thanks for this thread!

AA

Hey AA 

I am newb also but have something to add on your recipe as i knocked up something very similar a month ago, 1st time using hops and totally worth it.

I used Aust Pale Ale kit , Ikg BE2 plus 500g LME. 15g Amarillo and 25g Cascade (15 min and 1 min boil ) Used two packets of Coopers Ale yeast.

I think i would go up to 30g of each hop next brew just to amp it up but this hop combo just works. Very easy drinking brew.

In answer to a couple of your hop questions. Yes the boiled flavours will come out later and i think you've used enough hops definitely.

Up to you of course whether you dry hop but i would see how you like Cascade/Amarillo combo as is and maybe try Citra dry hop next brew.

Enjoy the brew

Cheers 

Clint

 

 

[Shamus O'Sean]

5 hours ago, Amarillo Armadillo said:

1. Is it better to steep hops in off-boiled water rather than in DME solution?
2. Tried to keep at 24C with wet towel around and a fan pointed at the FV but temperature got up to 26C at times during bubble phase. Is that a problem?
3. Bubble phase only lasted 24 hours. Why?
4. I couldn’t taste any tropical/fruity flavours when sampled wort. Should they come through later or have I not used enough or boiled the flavours out?
5. Shall I dry hop 25g Citra in muslin 3 days before bottling?
6. If adding the hops means I’ve got to expose the beer to air, isn’t that a really bad idea?
7. Should I have used US-05 instead/as well as the kit yeast?

1. Not sure that one is better than the other for steeping hops.  A DME solution is better for bitterness extraction in a hop boil (about 100g of DME per litre water)
2. You might get some not so desirable fruity flavours in the beer with the higher temperature.  Will still be beer though.
3. Maybe because of the higher temperature.  It was probably still fermenting.
4. So you boiled the DME solution.  I would still think you should get some nice fruity flavours.
5. If you want some fruity aromas, a dry hop is a good idea.  Citra would be ideal.
6. Just open the lid for long enough to get the hops in.  Be gentle to try to minimise exposure to the air, but some exposure is unavoidable.
7. The kit yeast is generally enough for a kit n kilo of fermentables.  If you used US-05, you can keep the kit yeast in the fridge for later.

[Beerlust]

14 hours ago, James Lao said:

I do prefer the nylon as it is easier to clean compared to cotton and doesn’t soak up as much beer as Chux or cotton (I don’t normally  remove or squeeze the bag).

I don't clean & re-use the Chux cloths. At approx. 25c a cloth, they just go straight in the bin hops & all.

14 hours ago, James Lao said:

...To submerge or not to submerge?

Whatever works for the individual I suppose.

That we do agree on. 

The fact you didn't/don't squeeze the hop bag is a significant factor that has led you to this stage & process (IMHO).

Cheers & good brewing,

Lusty.

[James Lao]

Hi Lusty,

I think from memory I did try your squeezing the Hop bag Method once with really good results, noticeable at the glass!

But that was before I started cold crashing, and I am overly paranoid about fishing around in the FV for the hop bag!!
 

But that’s just me!

Cheers and have a good weekend you legends!

YNWA!!!

James

 

[The Barwon Brewer]

Team I am thinking of using a finishing hops tea bag (one of Morgans) in my European Larger once primary fermenting has concluded.  However what i thought i might do is bottle half the batch, then introduce the tea bag for a further 4-7 days then bottle the balance giving me effectively two cases with a difference.... Does this sound like a fair proposal?  

[Shamus O'Sean]

7 hours ago, The Barwon Brewer said:

Team I am thinking of using a finishing hops tea bag (one of Morgans) in my European Larger once primary fermenting has concluded.  However what i thought i might do is bottle half the batch, then introduce the tea bag for a further 4-7 days then bottle the balance giving me effectively two cases with a difference.... Does this sound like a fair proposal?  

Welcome to the Forum.  Although you are probably not new to the Forum, having been lurking for a while before dipping in your toe.

Your proposal sounds like a great plan.  I always like to split a batch and do something different with basically the same beer.  Currently got one half of a batch fermented with Coopers Commercial Yeast at 18°C and the other half of the batch fermented with the same yeast at 24°C.  The warmer one is supposed to be more fruity.  Time will tell.

What hops are you planning to use?

[Goldcoast Crow]

Hahaha just checked my dates on my first hop bag trial, it's been in the fv for 15days so it's getting a good going over.... hopefully I can get them in the bottles in the next few days..... is there an issue with leaving the wort in the fv for too long?