It's Kegging Time 2019

[Pale Man]

G'day guys, I have a couple of newbie questions. I expect to be kegging within the next couple of months and there's a couple of blanks I need filling in. Apologies if they've been answered here but I can't find anything.

1 - If I naturally condition my beer in a keg as I would a bottle, when it's ready is it just a matter of adding gas for pouring?

2 - What are the benifits of conditioning in the keg as opposed to force carbing, are there any? 

Cheers!!

[Shamus O'Sean]

4 hours ago, Pale Man said:

G'day guys, I have a couple of newbie questions. I expect to be kegging within the next couple of months and there's a couple of blanks I need filling in. Apologies if they've been answered here but I can't find anything.

1 - If I naturally condition my beer in a keg as I would a bottle, when it's ready is it just a matter of adding gas for pouring?

2 - What are the benifits of conditioning in the keg as opposed to force carbing, are there any? 

Cheers!!

I am very new to kegging so apologies if my advice is off.  Others will correct me anyway.

1. Yes.  You just have to make sure you add enough sugar at kegging time.  A Pale Ale I did with 100g of sugar was fine to hook-up like you say.  A Light Stout with 100g needed a bit of help with a forced carbonation (for about 20 hours)
2. You get some extra ABV.  The time to condition will mean the beer is not "green".

Dis-benefits with conditioning in the keg as opposed to force carbing

• Time
• Aroma, esp in dry hopped beers

In both of the times I naturally conditioned, it was because I did not have a spot free in the kegerator.

[Otto Von Blotto]

That's pretty much the answer. 

I've never naturally carbonated a keg, I prefer the flavour without the small secondary fermentation. If there's no room in the kegerator I just purge the headspace as normal then put them on the spare gas line for a couple of hours to get some pressure in them. The porter I kegged in February still had pressure in it when I pulled the PRV before connecting it to the tap. 

[Pezzza]

13 hours ago, Shamus O'Sean said:

Dis-benefits with conditioning in the keg as opposed to force carbing

And I think too with secondary fermentation in the keg, that you can generate a bigger yeast population in the bottom of the keg - which in one  of my 'naturally carbed' kegs caused problems with blockage of the liquid post and getting the beer out of there... since that time I have been force carbing.  I realise some punters find naturally carbing a good way to go... and it might be more so with Hefeweizen and maybe something like Coopers Sparkling where you want the extra yeast input to the flavour package - but for clear beers - I think that force carbing makes life easier.

[Pezzza]

6 hours ago, Otto Von Blotto said:

The porter I kegged in February still had pressure in it when I pulled the PRV before connecting it to the tap. 

And Kelsey did you just store the keg at ambient (not in fridge/kegerator) for a few months of conditioning then?

[Otto Von Blotto]

2 hours ago, Bearded Burbler said:

And Kelsey did you just store the keg at ambient (not in fridge/kegerator) for a few months of conditioning then?

Yeah it just sat behind the bar. Don't have any fridge space other than the kegerator to chill them in, except for this latest pilsner as I'm only running one FV until it goes on tap.

[Shamus O'Sean]

4 hours ago, Bearded Burbler said:

And I think too with secondary fermentation in the keg, that you can generate a bigger yeast population in the bottom of the keg

I did notice this in the bottom of one of the kegs I naturally conditioned.  I could see a defined layer of yeast on the bottom.  Whereas the force carbed kegs had no noticeable yeast (maybe a dusting of yeast, but you could not see it)

[Pezzza]

4 hours ago, Otto Von Blotto said:

Yeah it just sat behind the bar. Don't have any fridge space other than the kegerator to chill them in, except for this latest pilsner as I'm only running one FV until it goes on tap.

So gas up fairly strongly like 40PSI overnight - and then is pretty much ok to store - given that the keg is sealing nicely?

[Pezzza]

1 hour ago, Shamus O'Sean said:

I could see a defined layer of yeast on the bottom. 

Yes Shamus - I had some really nice Golden Ale last year - ended up with more volume than planned... so put down one 19L and then a smaller keg - 9Lkeg...

And added plenty fermentables for the secondary ferment - as had no fridge capacity and though I should do the secondary carb to get rid of any Oxygen - it was summer ish too....

Maybe the smaller keg probably also got a little more yeast in out of the FV too as it was filled last?

Anyway - the 19L keg was fine - but the little keg was an unending clog-fest... after that I sorta got turned off the natural carb thing.

I think that the liquid post was submerged under yeast and just kept sucking up yeast and clogging.

[Otto Von Blotto]

2 hours ago, Bearded Burbler said:

So gas up fairly strongly like 40PSI overnight - and then is pretty much ok to store - given that the keg is sealing nicely?

I don't even bother with that. Just whatever serving pressure it's on for an hour or two was all I did, like I wrote in the above post . The lids seal properly without pressure anyway, I often pick them up and shake them when I'm cleaning them, no pressure inside and no leakage. 

Edited June 8, 2020 by Otto Von Blotto

[Pezzza]

On 6/8/2020 at 6:29 AM, Otto Von Blotto said:

then put them on the spare gas line for a couple of hours to get some pressure in them

well played ha ha!

ah well thanks for the reiteration... 

I whacked my Pils on 40 overnight after kegging yesterday and will just now store it at 2 degC for a while off the gas but cold to give it some time to think ha ha ; )

[Naughty Corner Brewing]

So I got given a fridge which I picked up yesterday. It’s in pretty good condition, and has been a guys beer fridge for a few months, after he got given it by his son.

I also got approval from the minister for war and finance to order what I need to start off some kegging.

Once approval has been obtained, I see no need to wait so I’ll be pressing go on the following from my LHBS shortly:

2.6kg gas bottle

Harris Regulator

2 kegs (1 x 19l and 1 x 9.5l - I split quite a few brews with my brother-in-law)

Picnic taps to start with

And all the other crap that goes along with it!

Look out Rabbit Hole, were coming in hard!

[Journeyman]

2 minutes ago, NewBrews said:

2.6kg gas bottle

1. I'd go for the 6kg bottle - less filling up issues and possibilities of running out of gas just when you need it.

2. Check online. I really want to support my LHBS but his prices are far too high for my limited income. I got my keg stuff from cheekypeakbrewery and beerbelly - even with freight they were FAR below local costs. As an example, if I buy 5kg of LDME, the price difference from here to Adelaide pays for my petrol there and back, just on that 1 item.

3. 1 keg ain't gonna cut it, even with the half size one. It will take some MIGHTY FINE fiddling of schedules to make sure you have the keg empty when you're ready with the next brew. And in spite of what is common online, fast carbing a keg might make the beer drinkable but it still matures across a week or more to show off its talent. i.e. if you're fast carbing because you're out of beer and need the keg, you will find your best beers happen just as you run out.

Fast carbing is a great idea for emergency but to really get the best from your brews, you need enough kegs to give them TIME in the fridge.

[Otto Von Blotto]

I'm sure he will build on the one larger keg over time. It's nowhere near enough kegs obviously but yeah. 

As for my own kegging I still haven't bothered to keg the pilsner. I was gonna do it this arvo after golf but I got stuffed around getting home due to some moron having a crash on the freeway I had to use. Ended up taking a detour that probably took as long as just sitting in the traffic would have. I'll keg it tomorrow on my work break, this arvo is just smoking bacon now while watching the footy on a small TV I've got out here. The stupid volume isn't working for some reason but at least I can see it

[Naughty Corner Brewing]

1 minute ago, Journeyman said:

I'd go for the 6kg bottle

One step ahead of you....

The 2.6 is an initial size and going to be used to bed everything in. I plan on renting the 6kg one soonish and keep the 2.6 for emergencies, priming etc.

I do intend getting some more kegs, I’ll just pick them up as I go. We’re considering a move in the next 6 months or so, the less I have to move the happier I will be.

I weighed it up, buying online from some of these guys will save me the grand total of $36 by the time I take freight into account of a few $100 purchase. Also, there’s a lot of stock unavailable at some of them, and these guys actually have everything there now.

They've been a great help in my brewing journey to date, so I’ll continue to support them where I can.

[Pezzza]

38 minutes ago, Otto Von Blotto said:

but at least I can see it

Or whack on a radio as well if you have one to hand?

[Otto Von Blotto]

20 minutes ago, Bearded Burbler said:

Or whack on a radio as well if you have one to hand?

Not on any stations up here and the live stream on the AFL site is delayed somewhat. Picture quality is perfect so no worries there, just got a rabbit ears antenna that amplifies the signal. When I first turned on the TV earlier there was sound and then it just stopped a few minutes later. Might just get another TV

Edited June 14, 2020 by Otto Von Blotto

[Journeyman]

1 hour ago, NewBrews said:

I weighed it up, buying online from some of these guys will save me the grand total of $36 by the time I take freight into account of a few $100 purchase. Also, there’s a lot of stock unavailable at some of them, and these guys actually have everything there now.

They've been a great help in my brewing journey to date, so I’ll continue to support them where I can.

You've got a good one - Name and praise them.

[Naughty Corner Brewing]

1 hour ago, Journeyman said:

You've got a good one - Name and praise them.

Hoppy Days at Virginia. They are online as well, and while I have a closer LHBS they tend to be more focused on kits and spirits, so the drive to Virginia is well worth it.

Also, the 30 minute drive still doesn’t mean much to me considering we used to drive 4 hours for a hamburger when we were young and crazy.

[Pezzza]

1 hour ago, NewBrews said:

drive 4 hours

Drove 5 hours return to pick up some of me malt bags the other day that had travelled 2 hrs 45 closer to me ha ha thanks to the "LHBS" fella needing to go to the olds' farm : )

But I did manage to do a few other useful things on the way which was good 

[Pezzza]

4 hours ago, NewBrews said:

They've been a great help in my brewing journey to date, so I’ll continue to support them where I can.

And if some hardware shitttttts itself or is not up to scratch you can head over to resolve and not have to send stuff back to Wodonga or Melb...

[NicolasW]

On 6/7/2020 at 6:22 PM, Pale Man said:

G'day guys, I have a couple of newbie questions. I expect to be kegging within the next couple of months and there's a couple of blanks I need filling in. Apologies if they've been answered here but I can't find anything.

1 - If I naturally condition my beer in a keg as I would a bottle, when it's ready is it just a matter of adding gas for pouring?

2 - What are the benifits of conditioning in the keg as opposed to force carbing, are there any? 

Cheers!!

What everyone else has said but another added benefit of naturally carbing is you won't use any of your gas for carbonating your beer. If you want to do it consistently it would make sense to install a floating dip tube or cut the beer dip tube down slightly. FYI I force carb all of mine.

Edited June 14, 2020 by NicolasW

[Naughty Corner Brewing]

12 hours ago, Bearded Burbler said:

Drove 5 hours return

It's not a competition, but drove 7 hours return to pick up the fridge. Did catch up with people though and had a real nice lunch, but it was real nice drive actually.

Lucky the fridge made it home. Snapped a tie down strap about 2 hours in, so threw the spare on. Got home and the spare was just about worn through as well! Probably should have taken the big ones! 

[Journeyman]

15 hours ago, NewBrews said:

Hoppy Days at Virginia. They are online as well, and while I have a closer LHBS they tend to be more focused on kits and spirits, so the drive to Virginia is well worth it.

Also, the 30 minute drive still doesn’t mean much to me considering we used to drive 4 hours for a hamburger when we were young and crazy.

They are a bit OUCH! on the gas cylinder prices. But if my LHBS was like them where some things are high and other low I'd support them - but they have everything high priced.

And just to enter the fray, back in the day we did 9 hours round trip for hamburgers. Every town we got to the shops had closed and we ended up in Melb.

Edited June 15, 2020 by Journeyman

[Otto Von Blotto]

Finally kegged the pilsner today. Taste test was quite good so I expect it will improve a bit more before it goes on tap. It's currently sitting in the second brew fridge (old kegerator) after being on gas for 3 hours to get a bit of pressure in it. Once the pale ale on tap runs out it'll be going in, so probably another couple of weeks or so which will be a bit over a month of lagering including the time in the fermenter.