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Pellicle infected beer, and final gravity


Franham

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So i'm certain i've got my first infected beer (pellicles floating and filming on the surface of the beer), but the annoying thing it's happened on day 6, and i've basically reached expected final gravity.

I've tasted it and tastes fine. Alright so my question is, what should i do from here?

I'm thinking of doing a 3 day gravity test (today will be 2) then bottling in PET bottles and storing them in a container to minimise any explosions that may occur.

Also it's a plastic fermenter, i don't need to throw this out now right? i can just give it an especially good clean and off we go again?

Just don't want to prematurely throw the beer and the fermenter out.

Thanks guys 🙂

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Having no clue what Pellicle means I googled. The last line may help.. or not.

A pellicle (pronounced “PELL-uh-kull”) is the gooey, slimy, bubbly, fuzzy layer of nastiness that may appear on the surface of beers fermented with Brettanomyces, Lactobacillus, or Pediococcus. ... Whether a beer develops a pellicle or not has little to no bearing on the nature or quality of the end product.

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47 minutes ago, DavidM said:

Having no clue what Pellicle means I googled. The last line may help.. or not.

A pellicle (pronounced “PELL-uh-kull”) is the gooey, slimy, bubbly, fuzzy layer of nastiness that may appear on the surface of beers fermented with Brettanomyces, Lactobacillus, or Pediococcus. ... Whether a beer develops a pellicle or not has little to no bearing on the nature or quality of the end product.

Yeah i saw this quote, it made me feel a little better lol. And it's at least to a degree true, the beer tasted fine. It's a coopers real ale, and although i've never made one before, it tastes how i'd imagine it too. Plus i did a reading yesterday before the growth started, and the two samples tasted the same give or take.

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50 minutes ago, Franham said:

So i'm certain i've got my first infected beer (pellicles floating and filming on the surface of the beer), but the annoying thing it's happened on day 6, and i've basically reached expected final gravity.

I've tasted it and tastes fine. Alright so my question is, what should i do from here?

I'm thinking of doing a 3 day gravity test (today will be 2) then bottling in PET bottles and storing them in a container to minimise any explosions that may occur.

Also it's a plastic fermenter, i don't need to throw this out now right? i can just give it an especially good clean and off we go again?

Just don't want to prematurely throw the beer and the fermenter out.

Thanks guys 🙂

Nah, don't tip! I'm sure the others here would agree - you need to post a few pics so that the more experienced brewers here can have a look at your issue. 

I'm a relative new comer Franham, but if your beer tastes fine then maybe I'd just hang off doing anything in haste. Don't disturb the top of the FV either until you've heard back from others here -  that would be my advice for now.

I wouldn't imagine you'd have to throw your FV out either - just a decent soaking with non scented bleach and water for a couple of days..... and then a bit of SP soaking and a no rinse sanitiser.

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6 minutes ago, Mickep said:

Nah, don't tip! I'm sure the others here would agree - you need to post a few pics so that the more experienced brewers here can have a look at your issue. 

I'm a relative new comer Franham, but if your beer tastes fine then maybe I'd just hang off doing anything in haste. Don't disturb the top of the FV either until you've heard back from others here -  that would be my advice for now.

I wouldn't imagine you'd have to throw your FV out either - just a decent soaking with non scented bleach and water for a couple of days..... and then a bit of SP soaking and a no rinse sanitiser.

Sorry too late 😞, but if you can imagine this image, with a dry hop bag in the middle, than that's what i looked like last night. It had began growth very quickly, i would within an hour of the last time i checked it.

First hunch i had was to remove the dry hop bag, as a potential source of infection.

Overnight, it hasn't developed anymore growth actually, and to the naked eye, you wouldn't think anything of it, APART from the icy white looking ring around the fermenter, at the top of the surface.

Did first FG reading yesterday of 1.006, and will plan to do another reading today as normal. Unless advised otherwise? lol...

Really appreciate your thoughts.

images.jpg

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4 minutes ago, Pickles Jones said:

I think the best test for "bad beer" that is still in the FV, is the taste test which you have done and if it tastes OK. Keep going as you would for "a normal beer"

I'm glad to hear that 🙂

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I guess my concern too is bottling and overcarbonation, as apparently the new bacteria can eat up sugars that the yeasties can't get too.

however i can't see this being as much of an issue if i've reached final gravity. to be on the safe side, i'm bottling in pet bottles as opposed to my lovely new glass bottles i just bought lol.

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Just now, Aussiekraut said:

Bottle it, just make sure you don't get any of the layer into the bottles.

I've had the occasional batch with the bubbly film on it but the beer always appeared ok. I haven't had this in a while though. 

i know that finings won't get rid of the infection, but the presence of the infection, will the finings still do its normal job?

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10 minutes ago, Franham said:

i know that finings won't get rid of the infection, but the presence of the infection, will the finings still do its normal job?

I've never had this problem before, Franham, but I'd be reluctant to add finings as I reckon it might sink some of the nasties into the beer. If it was me, on bottling day I'd be skimming the scum off the top and then bottling but as I said I haven't had to deal with a problem like this before.

Edited by MUZZY
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10 minutes ago, MUZZY said:

I've never had this problem before, Franham, but I'd be reluctant to add finings as I reckon it might sink some of the nasties into the beer. If it was me, on bottling day I'd be skimming the scum off the top and then bottling but as I said I haven't had to deal with a problem like this before.

yeah, see last night i took the hop bag out and skimmed some of the bubbles out on a sanitised spoon, so hopefully i didn't mix it in too much.

yeah and the finings point you made is sensible, i'll bottle it tomorrow after it's third straight reading, just to be safe. cheers 🙂

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44 minutes ago, Franham said:

i know that finings won't get rid of the infection, but the presence of the infection, will the finings still do its normal job?

If the finings were in it beforehand, they should still do the job but do not put anything in now. You do not want to disturb the top layer and mix it into the beer.

 

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On 1/20/2022 at 7:34 AM, Franham said:

I guess my concern too is bottling and overcarbonation, as apparently the new bacteria can eat up sugars that the yeasties can't get too.

however i can't see this being as much of an issue if i've reached final gravity. to be on the safe side, i'm bottling in pet bottles as opposed to my lovely new glass bottles i just bought lol.

Interestingly having reached' Final Gravity" as in this instance doesn't necessarily mean that the fermentation has finished.  When you add carbonation drops to the bottle the yeast will restart the fermentation process however, this time the CO2 will be contained in the bottle resulting carbonated beer.

If there is an infection in the beer, and this can be only one cell, which will multiply rapidly,  it will aggressively attack the residual sugars in the bottle that don't readily breakdown in the FV.

As there no where for the CO2 it produces to escape, the pressure builds up rapidly to a point that causes the bottle to fracture or create gushers when opened.

The beer is usually tainted by the infection which also produces off flavours and makes the beer undrinkable.🍻

 

Edited by Pickles Jones
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Looks a little like the start of acetobacter infection to me.

As others have said bottle it being careful not to disturb the top. Leave the last inch or so of beer and tip that.

Acetobacter infection happens when the layer of CO2 on top of the beer is gone and oxygen is getting at the beer. The organism requires oxygen to grow and reproduce. It eats alcohol and turns it into acetic acid ( vinegar ) 

If it tastes alright and not like vinegar you should be ok. The secondary fermentation in the bottle will eat whatever oxygen is there and create co2 on the top of every single bottle and stymi the acetobacter from taking over and turning it all into vinegar. 

 

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On 1/20/2022 at 9:34 AM, Aussiekraut said:

Bottle it, just make sure you don't get any of the layer into the bottles.

What the German said. He should know, he comes from the land of bacteria infected beer, that's why he likes them so much!

1 hour ago, Greenyinthewestofsydney said:

If it tastes alright ... you should be ok.

Yes, what Greeeeeeeeeeeeeeny said

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Something similar has happened to me. I bottled it and drank it. Only problem was a slight sour taste which gets worse as it ages so drink early! Also might give u a bit of extra gas ! Other than that drink up 👍

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13 minutes ago, disgruntled said:

What the German said. He should know, he comes from the land of bacteria infected beer, that's why he likes them so much!

Gonna take a gravity reading of the Catharina Sour today and will add the fruit tomorrow or on Sunday. It better be good 🙂 

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