Buy in bulk and save

[Malter White]

This has been touched on before but with recent inflation issues it's worth reminding.

I just bought 6 Coopers tins at Dan Murphy and received a discounted carton price like they do with wines. It's a saving of around 24%. Even cheaper than Coopers member pricing. Granted you only get 6 of the same variant but if you have a regular go-to tin it's worth doing. I got Aust Pale Ales for $14.50 per tin. Cha-chinggg $$

[DavidM]

Yes, it's the way to go. 

Once when I was in the store, they were short on Pale Ale and let me take two different cans to make up the six!

Add in some bulk Light Dry Malt and brewing becomes a lot cheaper. 

[Classic Brewing Co]

2 hours ago, Malter White said:

This has been touched on before but with recent inflation issues it's worth reminding.

I just bought 6 Coopers tins at Dan Murphy and received a discounted carton price like they do with wines. It's a saving of around 24%. Even cheaper than Coopers member pricing. Granted you only get 6 of the same variant but if you have a regular go-to tin it's worth doing. I got Aust Pale Ales for $14.50 per tin. Cha-chinggg $$

I certainly would agree with that, that is a good saving. I have done it in the past but now I am discovering that AG Brewing is also far cheaper than buying tins & boxes, however there is nothing wrong with that, I did it for decades & still make the odd one just for a quick fridge filler.

As an example, I bought the ingredients for a 23l Pale Ale yesterday - a 5kg bag of Coopers Pilsner Grain mixed with Wheat Malt & Dark Crystal for $19.95.

I also purchased 200gms of POR for $13.00 & 100gms of Eclipse for $9.50.

This means the brew will be the bag of malt & 40gms of POR, so it works out cheaper than a standard k & k brew & tastes a whole lot better especially from the keg.

[Malter White]

@Classic Brewing Co There's no doubting the benefits of all grain brewing but I'm unlikely to take it up. I enjoy the simplicity of kit brewing and it's only marginally more expensive because I get my dextrose and LDM in bulk nowadays. A typical APA for me is:

Coopers APA tin $14.50

1kg dex $2.50

300g LDM $4

TOTAL $21.

I don't add hops to Coopers International or TC range any more because they're already prehopped. I save my hops experimentation for the basic range and Woolies "Larger" tins.

 

 

[Coopers DIY Beer Team]

Don't forget to keep the entire kit, not just the yeast, refrigerated if you're buying up in bulk. Liquid malt extract will darken and change flavour through Maillard Reactions.  This is probably the most common source of "homebrew twang" that many all-grain brewers love to talk about, although I'm not entirely sure what "home brew twang" is. Cheers, Frank.

[Malter White]

4 minutes ago, Coopers DIY Beer Team said:

Don't forget to keep the entire kit, not just the yeast, refrigerated if you're buying up in bulk. Liquid malt extract will darken and change flavour through Maillard Reactions.  This is probably the most common source of "homebrew twang" that many all-grain brewers love to talk about, although I'm not entirely sure what "home brew twang" is. Cheers, Frank.

Thanks, Frank.
This is not a brag but 6 tins aren't going to sit idle for too long at my place.
I'm not sure what "twang" is either but since I don't all grain brew I haven't ever drank "twangless" beer to compare it with. 

[Classic Brewing Co]

25 minutes ago, Coopers DIY Beer Team said:

Don't forget to keep the entire kit, not just the yeast, refrigerated if you're buying up in bulk. Liquid malt extract will darken and change flavour through Maillard Reactions.  This is probably the most common source of "homebrew twang" that many all-grain brewers love to talk about, although I'm not entirely sure what "home brew twang" is. Cheers, Frank.

Good advice Frank.

I personally do notice the 'twang' in the AG brews that are bottled that I can't fit in the keg, there is a distinct difference between CO2 gassed beers that carbonated with sugar.

Whenever I do a k & k beer there is even more of the of the 'twang'. This is what I found on the subject.

Homebrew twang is a common off-flavor in homebrewed beer. Causes of homebrew twang include¹²:

• Poor water chemistry
• Poor temperature control during fermentation
• Stale liquid extract
• Poor sanitation practices
• Liquid extract that is "pre-hopped"
• Oxidation
• Partial boils/kettle caramelization
• Old/low quality extract
• Lack of fermentation temperature control

[Classic Brewing Co]

1 hour ago, Malter White said:

@Classic Brewing Co There's no doubting the benefits of all grain brewing but I'm unlikely to take it up. I enjoy the simplicity of kit brewing and it's only marginally more expensive because I get my dextrose and LDM in bulk nowadays. A typical APA for me is:

Coopers APA tin $14.50

1kg dex $2.50

300g LDM $4

TOTAL $21.

I don't add hops to Coopers International or TC range any more because they're already prehopped. I save my hops experimentation for the basic range and Woolies "Larger" tins.

 

 

Yes mate, I totally understand, if you are happy with your format, stick to it.

I liked the challenge of AG Brewing & now I really enjoy it despite all of the extra equipment.

[Triple B Brewing]

40 minutes ago, Coopers DIY Beer Team said:

Don't forget to keep the entire kit, not just the yeast, refrigerated if you're buying up in bulk. Liquid malt extract will darken and change flavour through Maillard Reactions.  This is probably the most common source of "homebrew twang" that many all-grain brewers love to talk about, although I'm not entirely sure what "home brew twang" is. Cheers, Frank.

Hey Frank @Coopers DIY Beer Team, thanks for that advice as it is absolutely pertinent and timely for me as I am working my way through each of the Coopers 20+ litre recipes (I'm 35 brews in to date) and I typically place one very large order approximately every 4 to 6 months (eg; my order just placed was for 16 brews which should do me about 6 months). Yeast, hops and grains were the only items I would store in airtight containers in my Keezer, the boxes of adjuncts and tins of extracts I would store in my home. 

Looks like I am going to have to chuck out some food to made way for the delivery scheduled to arrive by week's end 

[Triple B Brewing]

35 minutes ago, Classic Brewing Co said:

Good advice Frank.

I personally do notice the 'twang' in the AG brews that are bottled that I can't fit in the keg, there is a distinct difference between CO2 gassed beers that carbonated with sugar.

Whenever I do a k & k beer there is even more of the of the 'twang'. This is what I found on the subject.

Homebrew twang is a common off-flavor in homebrewed beer. Causes of homebrew twang include¹²:

• Poor water chemistry
• Poor temperature control during fermentation
• Stale liquid extract
• Poor sanitation practices
• Liquid extract that is "pre-hopped"
• Oxidation
• Partial boils/kettle caramelization
• Old/low quality extract
• Lack of fermentation temperature control

Thanks @Classic Brewing Co, there appears to be a couple of repeats in that dot point list above (eg: Poor temperature control during fermentation & Lack of fermentation temperature control), but regardless, the references above to "Stale liquid extract and Old/low quality extract" is exactly what Frank is referring to (Maillard Reactions) I guess eh

Here's to good, clean, cold & tasty beers and plenty of Maillard Reaction on our BBQ'd steaks 

[Greenyinthewestofsydney]

Liquid extract that is "pre-hopped"

In my humble opinion this is the predominant reason for "twang". Reason being is I have done many an unhopped extract beer from tins and boiled my own hops and never got the same twang. You can still tell its not all grain but the twang is not there.

[Oldbloke]

13 hours ago, Malter White said:

This has been touched on before but with recent inflation issues it's worth reminding.

I just bought 6 Coopers tins at Dan Murphy and received a discounted carton price like they do with wines. It's a saving of around 24%. Even cheaper than Coopers member pricing. Granted you only get 6 of the same variant but if you have a regular go-to tin it's worth doing. I got Aust Pale Ales for $14.50 per tin. Cha-chinggg $$

Yes, i posted it about 3 months ago. However i check my local Dans about once a week and they never have 6 dark ales in stock. 2 or 3 at most. Very annoying as they are only abt 3 or 4k down the rd. Just about given up on them.

So i just keep going to the LHBS. 

 

P.S. how long will a can last in a shed in an esky?

Edited October 18, 2023 by Oldbloke
Spelling

[Classic Brewing Co]

23 minutes ago, Greenyinthewestofsydney said:

Liquid extract that is "pre-hopped"

In my humble opinion this is the predominant reason for "twang". Reason being is I have done many an unhopped extract beer from tins and boiled my own hops and never got the same twang. You can still tell its not all grain but the twang is not there.

I totally agree Greeny, an AG brew is far superior to any beer made from cans.

[Oldbloke]

49 minutes ago, Classic Brewing Co said:

I totally agree Greeny, an AG brew is far superior to any beer made from cans.

That is entirely in the eye of the beholder.

[Malter White]

2 hours ago, Oldbloke said:

Yes, i posted it about 3 months ago. However i check my local Dans about once a week and they never have 6 dark ales in stock. 2 or 3 at most. Very annoying as they are only abt 3 or 4k down the rd. Just about given up on them.

So i just keep going to the LHBS. 

 

P.S. how long will a can last in a shed in an esky?

I understand your frustration, OB. I had to search a few stores on the www to find one with enough stock. It was on my travels so it wasn't an imposition going there but there were stores closer that didn't have enough. I'm sure it could be pre-ordered if you cared to do so.

[Classic Brewing Co]

1 hour ago, Oldbloke said:

That is entirely in the eye of the beholder.

It is simply a fact. I am not saying that for any other reason.  I brewed k & k for centuries & since I stepped up to  AG it is a whole new ball game,  you won't know until you try it.

[Oldbloke]

5 hours ago, Classic Brewing Co said:

It is simply a fact. I am not saying that for any other reason.  I brewed k & k for centuries & since I stepped up to  AG it is a whole new ball game,  you won't know until you try it.

Nope, its your opinion. And thats a fact.

[Kegory]

10 hours ago, Oldbloke said:

Yes, i posted it about 3 months ago. However i check my local Dans about once a week and they never have 6 dark ales in stock. 2 or 3 at most. Very annoying as they are only abt 3 or 4k down the rd. Just about given up on them.

So i just keep going to the LHBS. 

 

P.S. how long will a can last in a shed in an esky?

How long is a piece of string?

[Classic Brewing Co]

5 hours ago, Oldbloke said:

Nope, its your opinion. And thats a fact.

Nah, you're wrong, like I said before unless you made an AG brew & compared it to your other, you wouldn't know.

[Coopers DIY Beer Team]

15 hours ago, Classic Brewing Co said:

• Poor water chemistry
• Poor temperature control during fermentation
• Stale liquid extract
• Poor sanitation practices
• Liquid extract that is "pre-hopped"
• Oxidation
• Partial boils/kettle caramelization
• Old/low quality extract
• Lack of fermentation temperature control

Dot points 3, 7 & 8 are variations on what I referred to in my previous response (Maillard) and our instructions specifically tell the brewer not to boil the contents of can for this reason.

I don't know what "pre-hopped" is referring to but it is possible they're talking about Isomerized Kettle Extract (IKE). We don't use IKE in our DIY brews, we use Pride of Ringwood pellets for bittering across our whole range, the same as we do for our ales and stouts (excluding the blue and purple cans). Everything else on that list is a potential source of fault that can occur in any beer, regardless of whether it is brewed from grain, malt extract or angels tears and fairy dust.  

Most of you would remember the Master of the Brewniverse competition that we ran a few years back. Chris Woods was a very deserving winner with his Fruit of the Woods IPA, but there were at least another dozen beers amongst the finalists that were as good as or better than most commercially brewed beers in Australia, and I'm including the "Craft" breweries. One of the rules of that competition was that you had to use at least one can of Coopers DIY malt extract. Chris's winning beer used a can of Australian Pale Ale as its base. 

 https://www.diybeer.com/au/recipe/chris-woods-fruit-of-the-woods-ipa.html

My final point is this. The bagging of beer brewed with hopped malt extract (our core DIY product) is getting boring. Gentlemen, please keep these opinions to yourself or take them to another forum. Cheers, Frank.

 

[Oldbloke]

Well the above comments from Frank prompted me to check out the Kits Coopers sells.

24.

5 of which are in the craft series, (1.3kg) 19 are 1.7kg.

 

If you follow the instructions, sanitise, have half decent temperature control and add some dried malt extract you just cant go wrong.  And if you cant find an ale, lager, whatever that you love out of the 24 there is something wrong with you.

 

And ive just discovered 3 that im going to now try.

[Classic Brewing Co]

I have been having another look at buying Bulk Grain, I always knew it was cheaper, but the more I dig into it the more it makes sense.

I can get 25kg of Coopers Ale/Pilsner/Premium Ale/Wheat etc. for around $65-$75 unmilled, Joe White is about the same but Gladfield, Simpsons are dearer.

This grain store charges $4.00 per kilo to mill it so there is a reason to re-think buying a Grain Mill as you would pay through the nose to have it milled.

Given that I would get around 5 brews per bag I guess it is a no-brainer to buy a grain mill.

For those of you who have the Keg Land/Keg King models which would you rate the best for the job.

Cheers

Phil

[Back Brewing]

4 hours ago, Classic Brewing Co said:

I have been having another look at buying Bulk Grain, I always knew it was cheaper, but the more I dig into it the more it makes sense.

I can get 25kg of Coopers Ale/Pilsner/Premium Ale/Wheat etc. for around $65-$75 unmilled, Joe White is about the same but Gladfield, Simpsons are dearer.

This grain store charges $4.00 per kilo to mill it so there is a reason to re-think buying a Grain Mill as you would pay through the nose to have it milled.

Given that I would get around 5 brews per bag I guess it is a no-brainer to buy a grain mill.

For those of you who have the Keg Land/Keg King models which would you rate the best for the job.

Cheers

Phil

40 cents per kilo milled so $10/bag

Edited October 20, 2023 by Back Brewing

[Popo the Reprobate]

3 hours ago, Classic Brewing Co said:

This grain store charges $4.00 per kilo to mill it so there is a reason to re-think buying a Grain Mill as you would pay through the nose to have it milled.

Wow. That's expensive - though I have no idea what the going rate is. You'd be 2/3 of the way to a (cheap) full mill setup paying that.

I've got the KegLand one. It's been fine for what I use it for. I haven't used any others though so can't offer a comparison.

[Classic Brewing Co]

2 minutes ago, Back Brewing said:

40 cents per kilo milled so $10/bag

Should have read;

Malted Grain in 25 kg sacks unmilled.
Can be milled for you, but as they are sold at wholesale rate a milling charge of 40 cents a kg applies ($10 per 25kg sack)

Yes, it is, but over time it would add up.

Also, the cost of driving to Pooraka & back from Glenelg.

They also deliver up to 25kg for $6.50 with APD so either way it is still cheaper to buy a grain mill.