James Lao Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 Have recently switched to kegging and using Wyeast 1469 for my PA and IPA. The beer does not seem to clear as fast compared to when I was bottling and using Nottingham. Been doing a bit of reading on the Net and the Brulosophy website in particular has prompted me to try Gelatin on my next couple of brews. Was reading on several different threads, can't remember but seems there is a particular brand that smells a bit funny? Anyway, anyone using Gelatin out there to suggest a good brand, whether to get the stuff from the supermarkets or LHBS etc? Cheers James Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenyinthewestofsydney Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 Yeah Nottingham is one of the good flocculators. S-04 is the best I have seen. I just use the missus Gelatin powder from Woolies. Think its Mckenzies from memory. Works the same as any other. I have found Gelatin to be partly successful in clearing up a beer and helping with chill haze but you can't get commercial clear without filtering in my opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Lao Posted May 20, 2017 Author Share Posted May 20, 2017 Cheers for the reply. Will give it a go next time round, maybe CC for an extra day before packaging as well might help. Really enjoy the flavour of the 1469, but would like to clear a bit more. Clearing more of the yeast might reduce the unwanted gas releases as well!! Cheers James Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChristinaS1 Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 I have never used gelatin to clear beer but, because I know quite a few home brewers use the Knox gelatin that you can get at the grocery store, I bought some with the intention of using it to clear a cider I made. Before I got around to using it I read something that said that it was not appropriate for clearing cider and one should only use the gelatin you can get at the wine kit shop, so I did not end up using it. The advice did make me wonder why there should be a difference between beer and wine. Maybe the reason for haze in cider is different than the reason for haze in beer? With cider the cause is most likely pectins, whereas in beer it is what, starch? Protein? Cheers, Christina. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gag Halfrunt Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 I've tried it a couple of times and it didn't seem to make much difference to not using at all. Haven't tried any other sort of fining agent. Just cold crash for a couple of days then let it settle in the keg seems to work for me. I reckon too much fuss is made about beer clarity, it still tastes as good a little cloudy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 Visual appearance can alter the perception of flavour. Muddy looking beers to me seem to taste muddy, like the flavour is being muted, while the same beer cleared seems to taste more clean and the flavours are more prominent. Too much yeast in suspension can change the flavour too, and it's not really of any benefit having it there except in wheat beers that are meant to be full of yeast haze. I tried gelatine a couple of times but didn't like it very much. I might have mucked up the amount or whatever but it always left a jelly like sludgy sediment in bottles that was very easily stirred up, and that completely defeated the purpose of it to me. After that, I decided to give isinglass a go for dropping out the yeast prior to kegging the beer, and it has been a hell of a lot better. It works just as well for dropping yeast but the sediment is very compacted and does not shift easily. I haven't used gelatine since. I use Polyclar to remove chill haze as isinglass has little effect on that. Cheers Kelsey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gag Halfrunt Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 Yeah, I see your point Kelsey, however I'm not really talking about "muddy" beer as such, just beer not as crystal clear as sold commercially. I dont use finings and it seems to clear up enough for me after a week or so in the keg by itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 Yeah, mine aren't ever muddy in appearance either although they did all suffer from varying degrees of chill haze until I started using Polyclar. I find the yeast settles out completely (enough that there's no visible yeast haze) in a few weeks in the keg on average, so slower than bottles but not forever either. I've also found the more times I re-use a yeast strain the better it flocculates. The last batch of pilsner I kegged was almost crystal clear out of the FV because the yeast flocced so well, a strain that had been re-used since April 2015. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quokka Posted May 21, 2017 Share Posted May 21, 2017 I use the Dr. Oetker from the supermarket, not because I think it is any better - it just lasts so long I like that it is split into 3 sachets. 1/2 teaspoon in 100ml heated to 70C, settles out any flaky bits, hop crumbs, persistent yeast. My regular ales come out crystal clear, I haven't found anything that can completely clear an American hop-smash with several ounces of dry hops, nor a good whitbier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Lao Posted June 22, 2017 Author Share Posted June 22, 2017 First kegged brew using McKenzies Gelatine powder from the supermarket. Tried to follow the instructions from Brulosophy but only managed 60degC (instead of 70degC),and put into the FV at 14degC (instead of 10degC). All the lumps were out and it was turning gel - like. 2 days in the keg and it is looking like the last glass of the Keg. That's pretty clear considering the Coopers Real Ale can used as the base for the recipe. No massive farting episodes post consumption as well! So looks like it's a winner on both fronts for me! Cheers James Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quokka Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 That's why gelatin has been used for a couple hundred years for fining beer. Be aware it is usually made from pig trotters, so you can't share your beer with Jews, hipsters and a couple of others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 The commercial breweries used and still use isinglass rather than gelatine. As I mentioned I tried isinglass after being disappointed with gelatine and never looked back. I've also found Polyclar to be very effective at clearing hop bomb beers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Lao Posted June 24, 2017 Author Share Posted June 24, 2017 The ingredients of gelatine do sound a bit gruesome eh! But it's the Collagen in it that makes it work. Anyway the only people drinking the beer are close family, with no issues with beef, pork, lamb or anything. I like the simplicity of the Gelatin, it is dead easy to do. Maybe one day will try some of the other fining products out there like the fish / seaweed derived ones. Cheers James Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted June 26, 2017 Share Posted June 26, 2017 Isinglass and gelatine are about as simple to use as each other. The only difference with (powdered) isinglass is that it goes into cold water rather than hot. The seaweed derived finings are kettle finings that are used late in the boil to coagulate and drop out hot break (unwanted proteins and other crap) so it can be separated from the wort, they're not used in the fermenter post fermentation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty_G Posted August 26, 2019 Share Posted August 26, 2019 (edited) so with adding finings to the keg ... I assume that the results would be very good as the amount of suspended solids is dramatically reduced during the CC so adding finings in the keg would result is very clear beers ... albeit still with chill haze present ... Edited August 26, 2019 by MartyG1525230263 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSands Posted August 26, 2019 Share Posted August 26, 2019 1 hour ago, MartyG1525230263 said: so with adding finings to the keg ... I assume that the results would be very good as the amount of suspended solids is dramatically reduced during the CC so adding finings in the keg would result is very clear beers ... albeit still with chill haze present ... One of the reasons for CC'ing alomg with finings is to reduce chill haze. However this works best if the finings is added during CC. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty_G Posted August 26, 2019 Share Posted August 26, 2019 2 minutes ago, BlackSands said: One of the reasons for CC'ing alomg with finings is to reduce chill haze. However this works best if the finings is added during CC. interesting, I would have thought that racking into the keg then placing the keg straight into the kegger would just continue the CC. So would the finings still not work a treat or logically better as the racked beer would have less solids in suspension. Or is my logic sort of fuzzy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSands Posted August 26, 2019 Share Posted August 26, 2019 2 minutes ago, MartyG1525230263 said: interesting, I would have thought that racking into the keg then placing the keg straight into the kegger would just continue the CC. So would the finings still not work a treat or logically better as the racked beer would have less solids in suspension. Or is my logic sort of fuzzy. Depends on the temperature but your kegger is presumably at fridge temp so yeah, gelatine will work in that case. The beer just needs to be cold enough to throw up a chill haze for the gelatine to 'grab' hold of. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty_G Posted August 26, 2019 Share Posted August 26, 2019 gottcha @BlackSands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 Personally I wouldn't use gelatine in kegs, I don't even like it in fermenters to be honest. It will still work the same way as it does in the fermenter, but if it results in that jelly like, fluffy sediment, then your first glass would be wasted on sludge, and any movement of the keg will just stir it all up and you'll have to wait a day or two for it to settle down again. I'd be trying biofine clear in kegs, and might even do it myself some time. It gets decent reviews, and drops yeast as well as chill haze. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty_G Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, Otto Von Blotto said: biofine clear in kegs, any idea where i can pick some up from ... quick look on the ebay only has it coming in from USA price is Ok at $9.00 a bottle but don't think it is worth $75 postage ... all good found it at Craft Brewer at Capalaba or where ever it is on the South side Edited August 27, 2019 by MartyG1525230263 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 Yep Capalaba is where they are. Polyclar is another one that's really effective against chill haze, but no effect on yeast. I use a regime in the fermenter of isinglass first for yeast then polyclar a day or two later for chill haze but in a keg a one dose thing would be better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSands Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 (edited) 4 hours ago, Otto Von Blotto said: .... but if it results in that jelly like, fluffy sediment, then your first glass would be wasted on sludge, and any movement of the keg will just stir it all up and you'll have to wait a day or two for it to settle down again. . I think you are the only person in the history of the universe to have this problem! Never had such an issue with gelatine... Edited August 27, 2019 by BlackSands 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 It's been mentioned as an issue on other forums I'm on, especially in kegs themselves. Maybe not in those exact words but the same issue. Besides, there are better products available that don't require as much preparation. Even if it's just for yeast, isinglass is a better product to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSands Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 1 minute ago, Otto Von Blotto said: It's been mentioned as an issue on other forums I'm on, especially in kegs themselves. Maybe not in those exact words but the same issue. Besides, there are better products available that don't require as much preparation. Even if it's just for yeast, isinglass is a better product to me. Well, the big advantage of gelatine of course is price. Cheapest option by far. As for 'preparation' - dissolve in hot water and add to fermenter. Simple. I know there's a lot of wanky processes out there that talk about letting it 'bloom' first in cold water then gradually, and incrementally increasing the temp in a microwave up to whatever ºC... but I think all that faffing about is total nonsence. Maybe it's that process that actually leads to jelly-like floaties! I and countless others have fined many many brews with gelatine... never had the issue, and in combination with a CC (even a very short CC) it works every time, the beers clear up brilliantly. Each to their own I guess. I personally like quick, easy and very affordable solutions. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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