King Ruddager Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 On Monday night I built a dark ale according to the "Old Spiced" recipe on this page (old spice + cinnamon). Two days later and there's no sign of activity, so I took a sample and sure enough the gravity hasn't changed - it's stable at 0.040. So, what's wrong and how do I fix it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 What temperature is it sitting at? What sort of yeast did you use? I haven't experienced this personally but I have seen comments on other threads about brews not showing signs of any activity for up to 72 hours after pitching the yeast. Seems a bit strange that the gravity wouldn't change after 3 nights though. [unsure] Someone who knows more than I do about the mysteries of brewing should be able to help though. Cheers, Kelsey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coxy Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 I'd be wondering if it's dead yeast. Was it a dry yeast packet with the kit? I'm sure some of the more knowledgeable guys will have some advice. I'd wonder if getting another yeast packet and giving that a crack might be worth trying...but wait until one of the more experienced contributors advises. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne (Captain Yobbo) Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 Is there any sign of condensation in the FV? if so it is beginning to ferment I had a brew take a couple of days before I seen krausen is there any foam on top if yes it is most likely starting but i would say if you don't see anything by say day 4 buy another pack of yeast Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne (Captain Yobbo) Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 also forgot to mention with the foam it can also be small bubbles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gash Slugg Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 Has the Temp. been ok? what temp did you pitch at? If your worried and have another packet of yeast, throw it in, wont hurt. Should be doing something by now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Ruddager Posted June 15, 2012 Author Share Posted June 15, 2012 Okie dokie, first up, a couple of corrections to my first post ... 1. I accidentally said that I brewed on Monday, but actually it was Tuesday night so it had been sitting there for two days at the time as my post, not three 2. I also said that I used "old spice" in the ingredients. I meant to say "OS Dark Ale" - no deoderants were used. Now, to answer your questions ... KelseyS: It's been sitting between 18 and 22 since I built it Coxy: Yep, dry yeast from the kit Wayne: After you posted this I noticed that there was indeed some condensation, however only maybe a 1mm layer of foam, if that GavinE: Temperature has been fine (I think) - between 18 and 22. I pitched the yeast at 22 So, it is now a bit more than 60 hours since I brewed it. Last night I went to bed expecting the worst, but this morning I got up and KABOOM! It's come to life!! Two and a half days ... bloody hell. I was really starting to wonder what I'd done wrong. So what happens from here? Are there any characteristics of a beer that behaves like this which I should know about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamH1525226084 Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 Hey Ruddager I've learnt a lot from Yob about this... Yeast is a living organism so it doesn't always behave the way you expect it to. Some brews will take off straight away, some after a few days. I've used dry yeast, re-hydrated dry yeast and also liquid yeasts and I've had the range with all of them. Little to no krausen, small layers of foam, and volcano's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Eh!L Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 Hey Ruddager, My guess is that the yeast packet was a little on the old side and you underpitch. The older the yeast is the less viable (not as many living cells) it is. UseMr. Malty before you pitch. If there is condensation on the lid then there is activity. Just wait for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gash Slugg Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 I think you'll be just fine, I wouldn't bother taking another reading for a week or more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Ruddager Posted June 15, 2012 Author Share Posted June 15, 2012 What does "under-pitching" yeast mean? Not using enough? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gash Slugg Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 yep thats what it means, its a little hard to judge your yeast packets viability without doing a 'yeast starter'. I never use them but some people swear by them, saying that I never use the yeast packets that come with the tin unless I have no option. I buy fresh yeast packets from my LHBS, it adds a little more expense, but I reuse it , wash the yeast, a few times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Eh!L Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 its a little hard to judge your yeast packets viability without doing a 'yeast starter'. I never use them but some people swear by them. Making a starter is one way of ensuring that you has enough viable yeast cells. This is a slightly more advanced step than just sprinkling dry. I wouldn't recommend doing this with the Cooper's kit yeast (too much of a pain in the ass for the end result). Starters are normally reserved for liquid yeast or rinsed yeast. When using dry yeast if one packet is not enough throw in another. YOU MUST CONSULT MR. MALTY to know how much to pitch. It's not a hard program to figure out(just fill in the blanks). Make sure you fill in the packaging date for the yeast(this is important!) Cooper's kit yeast is a good all purpose yeast that work OK under many situations. I find it is best at brewing stouts and use it all the time for this style. It is also the best option for a quick brew as it comes with the kit and is dead easy. Once you start using fancier yeasts (not the kit yeast) you will find you build up quite a collection of kit yeast packets. Keep these in the fridge and you will find that they come in handy someday. Good Luck.[cool] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamB8 Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 90% of the time I make a starter 2 days prior to brewing, I have a home made stir plate and a heat proof flask, its the best way to ensure a fast start to fermentation and plenty of active healthy yeast cells. I dont find it a PITA but I have easy access to DME and have all the accessories. If your making a stronger ale or a rinsed/old yeast then you definately should make one. The biggest problem I have with kit yeast is that when you buy a good quality dry yeast from the LHBS its in the fridge which is impossible for a kit yeast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Eh!L Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 Hi Ruddager, I just ran your recipe through Mr. Malty. If the yeast was packaged today (which it wasn't[annoyed] ) you would need 10g of dry yeast to pitch the correct amount of living cells. The Cooper's yeast packets are only 7g so you should always need to pitch more that the one packet for this recipe.[pinched] Another calculator you need to check out is this one. This in combination with Mr.Malty and you're away![cool] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 7g coopers yeast packet is enough yeast to ferment 23L of a normal gravity wort (1.035-1.050) successfully. I agree that a little more won't hurt but the 7g packets are perfectly fine. I recommend getting some 'specialty' yeast and use that instead and just use the coopers that come with the kits as either a nutrient or to have one or two spare packs for the 'just in case' factor. Too many people over react too quickly when their wort hasn't started to ferment. If no sign by day 4 (including no gravity movement) then do something about it. I have had worts that has taken 3 days to start krausening. The other issue is that more often than not the brews have started it is the inexperience of one that does not know all the tell tail signs of fermentation. Sit back, relax and have a brewski. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gash Slugg Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 Safale etc package their yeast at 11.5g , closer to the correct pitching for 20 odd litres, even so many people brew successfully using the Coopers yeasts, on the very rare occasion I use the Coopers yeast I'll use 1.5 packets roughly. Another handy reason for saving the Coopers yeast packets in the fridge. Although I never brew anything that light. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Eh!L Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 I have seen Cooper's ale yeast come in 10g packets but these are sold seperatly from the kit yeast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 Snip.... The quantity - 7g - is sufficient to create a strong and thorough fermentation. If 7g is not enough for a recipe, promoted by Coopers, it should include a suggested yeast in the list of ingredients. http://www.coopers.com.au/the-brewers-guild/talk-brewing?g=posts&t=816 We supply a 7g sachet with our beer kits because 7g' date=' in most instances, is sufficient to make an acceptable brew. Up to the late 90s, Coopers supplied just 5g of yeast in a non-insulative sachet. Although the best available at the time, this yeast was poor quality and we affectionately remember it by the term 'floor sweepings' [lol'] We recognise that many brewers, particularly those who shop at specialist stores, buy a different yeast. They may toss the enclosed sachet, use it as a source of yeast hulls (nutrient) or use it to make excellent bread and pizza dough [biggrin] http://www.coopers.com.au/inside-the-order/talk-coopers?g=posts&m=22085 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gash Slugg Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 I agree 7g is enough, but a little lower then other people recommend. Mr.Malty - You would need about 9.5 grams of dry yeast if you were pitching into 5.5 gallons of 1.048 wort to get the proper cell counts. http://www.mrmalty.com/pitching.php#s3 5.5 gallons = 20.8 Litres. and that's if the yeast has been stored correctly which usually isn't the case for many of the kits. Hence why I think the 11gms or so is a little closer. @ 23 L. But as I said before I never brew light ales alcohol or colour wise and always are adding other extra ingredients. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne (Captain Yobbo) Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 7g coopers yeast packet is enough yeast to ferment 23L of a normal gravity wort (1.035-1.050) successfully. I agree that a little more won't hurt but the 7g packets are perfectly fine. I made a Sparkling ale which I am drinking at the moment it had a OG of 1056 all I used was the 7g of the TCS yeast turned out great but I do know about how important having enough viable yeasts are I didn't expect the gravity to be so high it worked but in future I will ensure I will have some spare yeast this weekend I am bottling another batch of Sparkling ale gravity was 1045 i cut back on the tin malt used dry instead however I will be washing the yeast for use In a hard apple cider and also keep some for emergencies [cool] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Ruddager Posted June 20, 2012 Author Share Posted June 20, 2012 I think you'll be just fine' date=' I wouldn't bother taking another reading for a week or more.[/quote'] Well, I couldn't wait a whole week and I took a second reading just then - 8 days after I built it and 5 to 6 days after the foam took off. Current gravity is already down to 1.008!! That's the most thoroughly fermented beer I've made yet ... unless my hydrometer is out of whack. Either way, should be ready to bottle pretty soon I reckon, and then it's on to the amber ale [smile] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 Gavin is right, you should leave it longer in the FV, albeit I agree is not necessary but it will improve your final beer 10 fold. I usually only take a reading at the start and then 2 readings after about day 10. I am a tight a*se though and don't like wasting that 100ml or so for any extra readings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muddy Waters Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 I am a tight a*se though and don't like wasting that 100ml or so for any extra readings. I'm worse Bill I usually only take 1 reading - I don't take an initial reading any more. I just take one after a week at which time I am usually happy FG has been achieved and then I leave it for another week. I want as much as possible to get into the bottles [biggrin] ...Of course if I'm not happy fermentation is going to plan I will take more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trusty1 Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Ditto (what Muddy said) I am a tight a*se though and don't like wasting that 100ml or so for any extra readings. I'm worse Bill I usually only take 1 reading - I don't take an initial reading any more. I just take one after a week at which time I am usually happy FG has been achieved and then I leave it for another week. I want as much as possible to get into the bottles [biggrin] ...Of course if I'm not happy fermentation is going to plan I will take more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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