Lack of carbonation?

[Moul I mean]

Beers been going well, since Sour Apple rubbish , but lately last two batches, very little carbonation. 3 weeks storage and piss poor carbonated. Any suggestions, remember I am a basic user only.

Edited March 9 by Moul I mean

[Moul I mean]

And have been using two carbonation drops per bottle, as instructions require.

[Beerdo]

1 minute ago, Moul I mean said:

Beers been going well, since Sour Apple rubbish , but lately last two batches, very little carbonation. 3 weeks storage and piss poor carbonated. Any suggestions, am remember basic user only.

Hi mate.
We'll need a bit more info to be able to help you. eg. what size bottles you're using, how much sugar or carb drops used to prime the bottles.

[Moul I mean]

Basic , pet bottles, 750ml, following instructions 2 coopers drops per bottle when bottling.  Specific about cleaning processes between and before fermenting and bottling,  storage temp good, and prior to last two batches, been good carbonation.

[Moul I mean]

Lids good too

[Beerdo]

Thanks for the extra info.
OK, I used to find 2 carb drops was a little less carbonation than I liked so you can use more. Try 3 carb drops or 1 carb drop (3grams) + 1 CSR sugar cube (4.5g) if you can get them.
Keep in mind carbonation will increase over time if your beer is kept out of refrigeration. 3 weeks is still quite young beer.
It's a matter of trial and error until you get the carbonation level you like. As you are using PET bottles, like myself, you won't have too much to worry about in terms of bottles exploding if primed too heavily.

[Beerdo]

I am a little puzzled why it's only the recent brews that have been less fizzy.

[iBooz2]

3 hours ago, Moul I mean said:

Basic , pet bottles, 750ml, following instructions 2 coopers drops per bottle when bottling.  Specific about cleaning processes between and before fermenting and bottling,  storage temp good, and prior to last two batches, been good carbonation.

@Moul I mean , the difference could have been the different yeast used in the previous brews i.e. a lager / ale blend as against a pure ale yeast.

This topic has been discussed at quite some length on several threads.  I will see if I can find them and link the here for you.

You have to think of PET bottles as ballons, they have a lot of stretch in them and some of this needs to be taken up before CO2 is forced into the beer.  IMO two Coopers carb drops is nowhere near enough sugars to prime PET bottles particularly if you are going to drink them early and, in this case, always use four carb drops or use the famous and trademarked MUZZY method that has been mentioned above, that is carb drops and a CSR sugar cube.  Careful @Beerdo ya could be getting a call from his lawyers.  

You could do two things:

Wait and extra couple of weeks or I suggest the better option is to sanitise the lids and bottle tops of the unopened PET bottles and drop at least one more carb drop into them (if not two) and re-seal quickly as they will foam up.  Then leave them for another two weeks then try one or two after chilling them down for a couple of days.  That way they will definitely have fizz in two weeks whereas the wait and see option may just end up more of the same i.e. not enough fizz still.

I have used four carb drops to get the desired carbonation in some beers and that is the answer if you like well carbonated beers.

You have no fear of exploding the PET bottles because as shown in this pic is a Ginger Beer I made, this one batch got a diastaticus infection and generated 100 times the fizz of a normal GB.  The bottle top was so pushed up it rounded like a bullet nose, so it had massive pressure in there.

Edited March 10 by iBooz2

[ChairmanDrew]

I've gone off using bottles with screw lids. Sometimes, even if I screw them on so tight I have a hard time getting them off, I will open them and there will be no fizz. Never had this problem with crown seals or pop tops.

[iBooz2]

29 minutes ago, ChairmanDrew said:

I've gone off using bottles with screw lids. Sometimes, even if I screw them on so tight I have a hard time getting them off, I will open them and there will be no fizz. Never had this problem with crown seals or pop tops.

@ChairmanDrew, I have never had a problem with the screw top Coopers PET bottles, well nothing that more priming sugar did not fix.  I used to use a tea towel for grip or pair of multigrips to nip them tight.

@Moul I mean, here are some threads to read just to re-iterate what the solutions are to low carbonation.  Hope that helps.

 

 

 

 

 

[Moul I mean]

Thanks guys, I did put another drop in a batch a couple of weeks ago, tried it in 10 bottles, amazing difference. just hoping I was not stuffing it up, so thanks I think it’s minimum 3 from now on.
 

cheers  to all for the advice. 

[ChairmanDrew]

1 hour ago, iBooz2 said:

@ChairmanDrew, I have never had a problem with the screw top Coopers PET bottles, well nothing that more priming sugar did not fix.  I used to use a tea towel for grip or pair of multigrips to nip them tight.

Oh yeah, I don't know about the PET bottles. I just meant the glass ones I've been using with metal lids.

[Oldbloke]

Just use table sugar. 6 grams per 750ml bottle. Make or buy a scoop.

 

But as mentioned, pet bottles may need more,,,7grams??

Edited March 10 by Oldbloke

[Beerdo]

17 hours ago, iBooz2 said:

You have to think of PET bottles as ballons, they have a lot of stretch in them and some of this needs to be taken up before CO2 is forced into the beer.  IMO two Coopers carb drops is nowhere near enough sugars to prime PET bottles particularly if you are going to drink them early and, in this case, always use four carb drops or use the famous and trademarked MUZZY method that has been mentioned above, that is carb drops and a CSR sugar cube.  Careful @Beerdo ya could be getting a call from his lawyers.  

I have nothing to worry about. I use Muzzy method under a licensed agreement.

[iBooz2]

7 hours ago, Beerdo said:

I have nothing to worry about. I use Muzzy method under a licensed agreement.

Mmmmm....      and there is a rumour getting about on this forum that you are sleeping with him too.   

[Beerdo]

On 3/11/2024 at 3:19 PM, iBooz2 said:

Mmmmm....      and there is a rumour getting about on this forum that you are sleeping with him too.   

I cannot confirm or deny this.

[Triple B Brewing]

13 hours ago, Beerdo said:

I cannot confirm or deny this.

Mate - take a good look at yaself

[jackgym]

I never have a carb problem if I use BE2 with the tin of goo.

Enlarging on that: can of APA, 1kg of BE2, 500g of LDM to boil the hops in, US-05 yeast, 2 carb drops in PET bottle, leave for a month if you can.

[jennyss]

14 hours ago, jackgym said:

500g of LDM to boil the hops in

How do you do this @jackgym?

[glivo]

Carbonation should be good after 2 weeks.  If not, then something has gone wrong.  If PET bottles haven't firmed up hard within a few days, then your lids are probably loose.   You should be able to notice the difference in firmness of the bottles after only a day or 2.  Simply squeeze them with your fingers.  If they're hard they're good.  You can pick a flat PET bottle out of a batch as soon as you touch it.

Another thing you can do with PETs is to squeeze the bottle a little with your thumb after you've filled it, so the beer level is up close to the top rim before putting the lid on and tightening it.  It will stay there if it's sealed properly.  You can then see the bottle carbonating as it expands and pushes the top of the beer back down to the normal level over a few days.

I bulk prime at 6 grams / bottle or 180 grams of plain white sugar for 23 litres.   I've not had carbonation issues with this method and to be honest I used to use 150 grams.  I only upped it to 180 g when my mate commented that the first batch of Dark Old Beer I bottled for him was a bit flat for his liking at 150 g.  I'd never had a problem with lighter beer, but I now use 180 g every time.  I dissolve 180 grams of white sugar in boiling water in a 500 ml Pyrex glass jug, pour it into the bottling drum and then run the beer in from the FV.   A little stir with the long stirring spoon, put the lid on and your good to go.

I hate the fluffing about with scoops of sugar or drops into individual bottles and the carbonation drops aren't worth it (IMO).  I have a 25 litre, wide mouth water storage drum from Bunnings dedicated to bulk priming and bottling.  I rinse it out immediately upon emptying and sterilise everything with Stellar San before filling it up.  I transfer from the FV via a length of vinyl tube that push fits over the standard drum tap.  For the Cooper's FV snap taps I have to use a length of bottling wand tube poked into the tap and the hose goes up over that.  The good thing about this method is that I can use 750 ml PET or glass, 650 ml glass, 450 ml Grolsch flip tops or 375 ml stubbies without needing to change amounts of sugar / bottle.

All of the transfer and bottling gear goes into the bulk priming drum with 1 litre of mixed Stellar San, the lid goes on and give it all a good swish around to sterilise everything in one quick procedure.

Some brands of PET bottles can and do fail, although I have some original Cooper's brand bottles that are now 20 years old, and they are still good.  The ones that do fail usually split at the bottom.  I lost about 6 on a recent Apple Cider batch, but they were old bottles and not Cooper's.

[Graculus]

I had a beer that didn't carbonate at all well recently.
It was a FWK brewed with Saflager w-34/70. I bulk primed it with 180 grams of sugar.
It wasn't as if some were gushers and some still. In the end I put about 20 bottles in the fridge.
When they were cold I opened them. Put a bit of dextrose in and recapped them.
Let them sit for a while and they were better, but not great.

I've just used the yeast I saved from brew to make a Coopers APA with. I generally bottle in glass, but used one PET bottle. It's rock hard.

[Aussiekraut]

2 hours ago, Graculus said:

I had a beer that didn't carbonate at all well recently.
It was a FWK brewed with Saflager w-34/70. I bulk primed it with 180 grams of sugar.
It wasn't as if some were gushers and some still. In the end I put about 20 bottles in the fridge.
When they were cold I opened them. Put a bit of dextrose in and recapped them.
Let them sit for a while and they were better, but not great.

I've just used the yeast I saved from brew to make a Coopers APA with. I generally bottle in glass, but used one PET bottle. It's rock hard.

180g dextrose for a 23l bulk prime is perfectly fine. I never had any dramas with this mix. It may not have been stirred through properly. If it has pockets of concentrated sugar and some with none, you can get those inconsistencies. But generally, bulk priming is the way to go IMHO.

 

[Graculus]

2 hours ago, Aussiekraut said:

180g dextrose for a 23l bulk prime is perfectly fine. I never had any dramas with this mix. It may not have been stirred through properly. If it has pockets of concentrated sugar and some with none, you can get those inconsistencies. But generally, bulk priming is the way to go IMHO.

 

Yeah, I don't really know why it didn't carbonate.
There were no gushers, so it's not as if some bottles had way more sugar than others.
And it was hot at the time, so when I bottled the brew I put the bottles back in the fridge at a constant temperature.