Guest Posted December 6, 2012 Share Posted December 6, 2012 Hi guys. This process is currently like a splinter in my mind, trying to understand the value of it. Hops aren't cheap, & using them efficiently to me is paramount when I brew. When I see recipes with large quantities of hops thrown into a boil at this junction, I just start shaking my head. I have copied recipes that ask that you do this, & I follow those recipes to the letter when that is the case. However, when I am making my own recipes & get down to that point after say a 5 minute hop addition & I have say 20-40gms of hops left that I'm willing to use, I'd rather use it as a dry hop. In a technical sense, you've added the hop at flameout, taken the pot off the heat, given it a quick stir, & then attempted to cool the wort as fast as possible so that you can strain it into the FV along with any other LDM's/Kit tins etc & pitch your yeast. Most of that late hope addition ends up being sludge collected in your strainer. Depending on your cool time of your finished boiled wort, that hop addition has barely had any real time to infuse it's flavour into the wort. Has it? Dry hop vs flameout addition with 30gms of hops in my hand, I'll dry hop everytime. Anthony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reuben Posted December 6, 2012 Share Posted December 6, 2012 I'm a big fan of adding hops at flameout. I made an IPA recently with 140 grams of hops at flameout. There is a TON of hop flavor in the beer. It's not like the boiling wort gets cooled to 20 degrees right away. Think of it like cup of tea. You put a teabag in water that has just finished boiling, and let it steep for five minutes. The water will cool over that time, but there is still a lot of tea flavor extracted. Personally I like to do both a flameout addition and dry hop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted December 6, 2012 Share Posted December 6, 2012 Every time I've done flameout hop additions I've let it steep for about half an hour, rather than instantly trying to cool it down. That's what all the recipes I've made which have flameout additions have instructed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 6, 2012 Author Share Posted December 6, 2012 Hi Reuben. [happy] I'm a big fan of adding hops at flameout. I made an IPA recently with 140 grams of hops at flameout. There is a TON of hop flavor in the beer. It's not like the boiling wort gets cooled to 20 degrees right away. Think of it like cup of tea. You put a teabag in water that has just finished boiling, and let it steep for five minutes. The water will cool over that time, but there is still a lot of tea flavor extracted. Personally I like to do both a flameout addition and dry hop. Holy @#$% 140gms at flameout??!! Man'O'man. What a waste IMHO. I love hop flavour as being the dominant factor of a brew. I would expect very good flavour over a typical boil with a total of 140gms of hops added at accepted intervals throughout the boil. Your "Cup of Tea" theory does make for a good comparison to a point. However it sort of falls over when factually tea naturally begins to release increasing amounts of bitterness after about 3-4mins when exposed to boiling water. I do concede that the wort cooldown time will definitely play a factor in the flavour produced by a late hop addition at this junction. Anthony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne (Captain Yobbo) Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 Flameout addition mainly contributes aroma does impart some flavour if you steep it. If you want hop flavour then a 15 min boil is the answer and another 5 min addition for more aroma. Dry hopping the crap out of the beer also imparts some flavour but gives it a lovely hop aroma that can't be beat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 7, 2012 Author Share Posted December 7, 2012 What a waste IMHO. I love hop flavour as being the dominant factor of a brew. I would expect very good flavour over a typical boil with a total of 140gms of hops added at accepted intervals throughout the boil. Try it before you dis it. For the correct Malt profile this is perfectly acceptable and Id suggest desirable for the right Hop/s. Buy hops in bulk and use with abandon especially in big AIPA styles etc. Cheaper than you think. Big beers I make have about a minimum of about 225g Hops (and up to about a Pound in some cases) and the hop additions get bigger as the boil time reduces with 0 min additions being the largest. Massive single dry hop additions are not desirable as they can tend to add a grassiness which I personally do not like. Im with Ruben and at the end of the day it's all about balance. The correct recipe will be in balance regardless of the "weight' of any addition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 7, 2012 Author Share Posted December 7, 2012 Fair enough call. Especially on the IPA front. I have no problem(s) throwing any amount of hops at a boil right down to the last 5 mins or so. I'm just not entirely convinced about the flameout addition. It's just my opinion, nothing more. Anthony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muddy Waters Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 Opinions are good but experimentation is better [rightful] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reuben Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 Cheers Yob, if anyone here knows about using insane amounts of hops it's certainly you. The whole IPA recipe I was talking about actually called for 210 grams of various NZ hops in an 18 litre batch. It's certainly the biggest amount of hops I've used in a beer, and I did feel a bit nervous using 140 grams at flameout. But I'm convinced it works for the style. It's a homebrew of a commercial beer done by Yeastie Boys. I'm not sure if you guys can get many of their beers in Australia, but they're good dudes, and even shared their recipe for Digital IPA online. It's a great IPA, have a look here if you're interested ---> http://yeastieboys.posterous.com/private/yCmgJxeHrs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 7, 2012 Author Share Posted December 7, 2012 Ive had it and it's a fantastic example of a beer of that style. Well worth the effort to make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 Another reason to add a heap of hops: Article: Beer could cure illness Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne (Captain Yobbo) Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 Another reason to add a heap of hops: Article: Beer could cure illness I had a discussion with Kelsey on Facebook we have both noticed since drinking hoppy beers that we haven't had colds or flu's. I also discussed this with my doctor the other day and she said I didn't have a cold/flu or chest infection this year and she was going to read more into hops. She also went on to mention the benefits of brewers yeast of vitamins etc Only brewers yeast will give you vitamins some strains of yeast can cause infections etc (not brewers yeast of course). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wal Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 Another reason to add a heap of hops: Article: Beer could cure illness I had a discussion with Kelsey on Facebook we have both noticed since drinking hoppy beers that we haven't had colds or flu's. I also discussed this with my doctor the other day and she said I didn't have a cold/flu or chest infection this year and she was going to read more into hops. She also went on to mention the benefits of brewers yeast of vitamins etc Only brewers yeast will give you vitamins some strains of yeast can cause infections etc (not brewers yeast of course). This is great news....I can't wait to get home so I can tell SWMBO how healthy I am..!!![bandit] [biggrin] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotm Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 So what would be the difference between a flameout addition to the wort and steeping the same amount of hops for the same duration in water then adding it to the wort? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordEoin Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 This is great news....I can't wait to get home so I can tell SWMBO how healthy I am..!!![bandit] [biggrin] I tell SWMBO that it's probiotic because of the live yeast and I must have at least one a day. Flawless logic [biggrin] Regarding the flameout vs tea, i suppose that it's just easier to do everything in one pot and with the larger volume of water it will keep the heat longer and give more flavor. That's just a guess though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyBycrikey Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 Hops aren't cheap I disagree yakimavalleyhops.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damien E1 Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 Hops aren't cheap I disagree yakimavalleyhops.com Woah, that is cheap. Be nice if they had more of the hops I use though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 Yeah I buy my hops from there. 1.6kg or near enough for $55-$60, much better value than buying 50g bags for $5. Unfortunately one of the vacuum sealed packs got damaged on my latest shipment, the hops look a little stale so I'm not sure what to do with them. [pinched] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 10, 2012 Author Share Posted December 10, 2012 the hops look a little stale so I'm not sure what to do with them. [pinched] Look or smell stale? Cheezey? If cheezey do not use them in a traditional brew, leave the packet out and open and brew a lambic. IF you are buying in bulk I assume you have a Vac Sealer? Just split it up and re-seal them, they shouldnt have lost "too" much over the post. Tell me though, clear bags (textured or plain?) or Mylar? Yob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 10, 2012 Author Share Posted December 10, 2012 Hi MBC. Hops aren't cheap I disagree yakimavalleyhops.com Damn that is cheap! [pinched] I'm moving to WA! [lol] Anthony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 10, 2012 Author Share Posted December 10, 2012 I'm moving to WA! [lol] Yakima Valley is in the USA [pinched] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 Hi Yob, They look sort of off color a bit, like instead of being that fresh green color they're a tad browned/yellowed. They don't smell too bad though, I wouldn't say cheesy. I don't have a vac sealer yet but I will be looking on Ebay tomorrow.. or maybe even today, I don't start work til 3pm. Any that you would recommend? I'm not sure what Mylar is.. the bags are clear, one side is plain and the other side is sort of ribbed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordEoin Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 Your hops sound fine. just keep them dry and cold. If you want to cheaply vacuum them, stick then in a plastic bag, suck all the air out and tie it up with a wire tie. That'll keep things 2 or 3 tmes longer. Otherwise, just stick it in the freezer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 Yeah, I keep them all in the freezer, I've tried squeezing the air out of it and wrapping it up, it's not the best but it's not the worst. I won't be making any new batches for at least a month or two, so plenty of time to get a vac sealer for when I open these new packets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 I'm moving to WA! [lol] Yakima Valley is in the USA [pinched] Perhaps he meant Washington USA [innocent] (just trying to give you an out Lusty) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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