How long do you keep cubed wort?

[Aussiekraut]

I've always wondered how long I can keep wort in a cube. I got a little anxious when I had a cube sit on the side for a week or so but then I thought the FWKs that still come in cubes, probably sit in the shops for a while. Somewhere I read you can keep them for years but wouldn't want to go that far. I'd just like to utilise the 65l system a little more and do bigger batches and then have a cube for later use. It saves time and money. 

What's your take on storing cubes? Do you let them cool and process them the next day? Store them until needed? If you have larger brewing systems, what do you do with double batches? 

[Red devil 44]

I make both single & double batches in my Grainfather, cube overnight to naturally cool, then usually transfer to fermenter within the next day or 2. 
Can’t see any harm with leaving it for a month or two, like you say the LHBS does. 

[Classic Brewing Co]

3 minutes ago, Red devil 44 said:

I make both single & double batches in my Grainfather, cube overnight to naturally cool, then usually transfer to fermenter within the next day or 2. 
Can’t see any harm with leaving it for a month or two, like you say the LHBS does. 

I have read that you can keep them stored for about 2 months but the longest I have left them is only 4-5 days waiting for the fermenting fridge to become available.

[Popo the Reprobate]

I haven't brewed in a while but in the past I've kept them for several months, probably up to 6 - or even longer now that I am thinking about it, with no perceived problems. I fill right to the top and try to get every bit of air out before sealing.

I brew and cube when I've got time and then ferment when I need to. I usually have a stack of cubes waiting. Bigger batches with your 65l and having an extra cube would be a good move I reckon. You open up the possibility of experimentation with exactly the same base beer then too.

[Tricky Micky]

And maybe slightly off topic  (so I apologise) - but I've also seen posts here at the forum where the cubes haven't been filled with wort to the top of the container leaving in some cases substantial headspace between wort and the cap in the cube. Most who practice this say it matters not - where I've read elsewhere that practice is not such a great idea. Would this also be a factor as to how long you might store a cube? 

[iBooz2]

1 hour ago, Aussiekraut said:

I've always wondered how long I can keep wort in a cube. I got a little anxious when I had a cube sit on the side for a week or so but then I thought the FWKs that still come in cubes, probably sit in the shops for a while. Somewhere I read you can keep them for years but wouldn't want to go that far. I'd just like to utilise the 65l system a little more and do bigger batches and then have a cube for later use. It saves time and money. 

What's your take on storing cubes? Do you let them cool and process them the next day? Store them until needed? If you have larger brewing systems, what do you do with double batches? 

AK, I have kept them for three months or a little more (due to travelling etc.) without any problems.  Note that I also fill mine (20 L cubes) to the max, max max - no air at all and the cubes are sanitised within an inch of their lives.  I use a 70 L Nano system and regularly pump out 50 L of ready to ferment wort in a brew session on a brew day (1/2 a brew day) and if I do a double banger brew day that gives me 100 L of wort in cubes (usually two different beers).  I could (and have been thinking about) doing high concentrate wort so maybe I could do 2 x 20 L cubes of concentrate and split each one of the cubes into four 23 L fermenters and add water to get to my desired gravity.  If I can get the mash water to grain bill ration right, then this will give me 100 L of beer for half a brew day.

[Greenyinthewestofsydney]

3 hours ago, Aussiekraut said:

I've always wondered how long I can keep wort in a cube. I got a little anxious when I had a cube sit on the side for a week or so but then I thought the FWKs that still come in cubes, probably sit in the shops for a while. Somewhere I read you can keep them for years but wouldn't want to go that far. I'd just like to utilise the 65l system a little more and do bigger batches and then have a cube for later use. It saves time and money. 

What's your take on storing cubes? Do you let them cool and process them the next day? Store them until needed? If you have larger brewing systems, what do you do with double batches? 

I only do it overnight and pitch the next day and on the odd occasion the day after that. Never anything more. 

[Greenyinthewestofsydney]

1 hour ago, Tricky Micky said:

And maybe slightly off topic  (so I apologise) - but I've also seen posts here at the forum where the cubes haven't been filled with wort to the top of the container leaving in some cases substantial headspace between wort and the cap in the cube. Most who practice this say it matters not - where I've read elsewhere that practice is not such a great idea. Would this also be a factor as to how long you might store a cube? 

It matters if you are storing IMO. Exposure to the hot wort with no air sterilises the entire cube. Leaving air in it while its still very hot might sterilise it and it might not. Better to immerse any nasties in hot fluid rather than air. 

I never bother with the headspace as i am pitching next day 9 out of 10 and 10 out of 10 within 2 days

[Aussiekraut]

1 hour ago, iBooz2 said:

AK, I have kept them for three months or a little more (due to travelling etc.) without any problems.  Note that I also fill mine (20 L cubes) to the max, max max - no air at all and the cubes are sanitised within an inch of their lives.  I use a 70 L Nano system and regularly pump out 50 L of ready to ferment wort in a brew session on a brew day (1/2 a brew day) and if I do a double banger brew day that gives me 100 L of wort in cubes (usually two different beers).  I could (and have been thinking about) doing high concentrate wort so maybe I could do 2 x 20 L cubes of concentrate and split each one of the cubes into four 23 L fermenters and add water to get to my desired gravity.  If I can get the mash water to grain bill ration right, then this will give me 100 L of beer for half a brew day.

Do you keep them at ambient temp or refrigerated? I usually fill mine up to the brim as well, so I can compensate for the FV loss. I often would like to sit out in the brewery and knock out a batch or two but if I have no fridge space, I don't bother. If I can keep them around, I can get another couple of cubes and do double batches of those beers I brew frequently and keep a cube around for the next lot. That frees up more time to experiment.

[Aussiekraut]

34 minutes ago, Greenyinthewestofsydney said:

I only do it overnight and pitch the next day and on the odd occasion the day after that. Never anything more. 

That's what I do atm but sometimes I run into logistics issues and then I can still brew even if there is no immediate fridge space. I just enjoy sitting out in the brewery with music blaring, brewing beer and having a few cold ones. 

[Classic Brewing Co]

1 hour ago, Greenyinthewestofsydney said:

It matters if you are storing IMO. Exposure to the hot wort with no air sterilises the entire cube. Leaving air in it while its still very hot might sterilise it and it might not. Better to immerse any nasties in hot fluid rather than air. 

I never bother with the headspace as i am pitching next day 9 out of 10 and 10 out of 10 within 2 days

I have seen Gash stress the importance of filling to the brim, rotating the hot wort through the cube & finally lying it on its side to completely sterlise the cube & around the tap area.

I think the last one I cubed I didn't let it cool down enough before I cubed it which somewhat distorted the cube. The brew was OK, but I binned the cube.

[iBooz2]

1 hour ago, Aussiekraut said:

Do you keep them at ambient temp or refrigerated? I usually fill mine up to the brim as well, so I can compensate for the FV loss. I often would like to sit out in the brewery and knock out a batch or two but if I have no fridge space, I don't bother. If I can keep them around, I can get another couple of cubes and do double batches of those beers I brew frequently and keep a cube around for the next lot. That frees up more time to experiment.

I just store the cubes at ambient temp in my brewery, which is solid brick and fully insulated roof.  The longer-term storage ones are usually in the cooler months here in Melbourne as I travel a lot then.  They don't get stored for longer than say one month at ambient in the hotter months as I have a much higher turnover of beer drinking during those times  so have to keep up supplies.  Only refrigerate them a day or two before dumping then in the FV and this is just so I can have the wort at pitching temps - 17 C for non-pressure fermented ales and 18 C for pressure fermented lagers.  

Edited January 3 by iBooz2

[iBooz2]

4 minutes ago, Classic Brewing Co said:

I have seen Gash stress the importance of filling to the brim, rotating the hot wort through the cube & finally lying it on its side to completely sterlise the cube & around the tap area.

I think the last one I cubed I didn't let it cool down enough before I cubed it which somewhat distorted the cube. The brew was OK, but I binned the cube.

Yes, tipping the cube over as soon as cap is fastened on is the go.  Gets the hot wort up in the handle etc.  and any fine little air bubbles somewhere else on say a side of the cube rather than in the handle.

Because I do a lot of Aroma hopping by letting the wort cool to say 80 C and putting in the aroma hops and holding it at 80 C for say 20 minutes the wort is usually down around 70 C by the time it goes into the cube.  I like to leave the wort cool to the 70 C mark as I find with my system the wort has cleared up much more than it was at 90 or 80 C.  More crud has dropped out at 70 C.

[Classic Brewing Co]

1 minute ago, iBooz2 said:

Yes, tipping the cube over as soon as cap is fastened on is the go.  Gets the hot wort up in the handle etc.  and any fine little air bubbles somewhere else on say a side of the cube rather than in the handle.

Because I do a lot of Aroma hopping by letting the wort cool to say 80 C and putting in the aroma hops and holding it at 80 C for say 20 minutes the wort is usually down around 70 C by the time it goes into the cube.  I like to leave the wort cool to the 70 C mark as I find with my system the wort has cleared up much more than it was at 90 or 80 C.  More crud has dropped out at 70 C.

Yeah, I would agree with that, the last time I didn't let it cool enough as I was in a hurry to go out & cubed it too hot.

[Back Brewing]

1 hour ago, Classic Brewing Co said:

Yeah, I would agree with that, the last time I didn't let it cool enough as I was in a hurry to go out & cubed it too hot.

If you cube too hot it does suck the sides in but when you clean it with really hot water it pops the sides out again

[Classic Brewing Co]

6 minutes ago, Back Brewing said:

If you cube too hot it does suck the sides in but when you clean it with really hot water it pops the sides out again

I imagine that could be possible, but I wasn't happy with the way it had ended up, so I chucked it, they are only $10 from KegLand anyway, besides I had used it a dozen times or more,

[Back Brewing]

I've read you can store them for months but this guy took it to the next level

 

[Classic Brewing Co]

54 minutes ago, Back Brewing said:

I've read you can store them for months but this guy took it to the next level

 

Well I suppose stored in the absolute perfect environment it's actually possible,  but I wouldn't think the average home Brewer should try it.

[Aussiekraut]

20 hours ago, Tricky Micky said:

And maybe slightly off topic  (so I apologise) - but I've also seen posts here at the forum where the cubes haven't been filled with wort to the top of the container leaving in some cases substantial headspace between wort and the cap in the cube. Most who practice this say it matters not - where I've read elsewhere that practice is not such a great idea. Would this also be a factor as to how long you might store a cube? 

If you only keep it in the cube to cool off and put it into the FV the next day, it's not an issue but if you store it for longer, you may get wild yeasts starting to ferment or other nasties taking over. 

[NBillett09]

What temperature range is hot enough to sterilize the cube yet not so hot as to warp it?
I would’ve thought to sterilize adequately you’d want it as close to boiling as possible  

[Classic Brewing Co]

44 minutes ago, NBillett09 said:

What temperature range is hot enough to sterilize the cube yet not so hot as to warp it?
I would’ve thought to sterilize adequately you’d want it as close to boiling as possible  

Around 80c is the normal, as I said earlier, I did it too hot last time & it warped the cube, but of course as it has been stated it needs to be as full as possible with no headspace to be safer.