MattC10 Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Hi all\u2014I'd love to get your opinions on this. I have been using the original single fermenter that came with my Cooper's kit since I statrted brewing\u2014to date every batch has turned out very well! As friends have gotten into brewing (inspired by me) they are buying kits that use two buckets, or a bucket and a carboy\u2014one for fermenting and the other for bottling I believe. What are the benefits of this system? I am getting more interested in experimenting with my extract kits, adding ingredients, dry hopping, etc... would this setup be the logical next step? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Matt, I don't think it will make any difference to the quality of the beer. I will make an assumption here and say that most homebrewers in Australia use the barrel/bucket type fermenter (like the coopers FV). From there they may do various things: 1. Bottle straight from the primary FV 2. Rack to another FV for bulk priming & bottling 3. Rack to another FV for conditioning (to get the beer off the trub) US homebrewers seem to like their carboys and use a bucket for priming and bottling. It is pretty much the same as what happens above but with a different shaped container. Personally, I don't bother with point 3 above but I would consider it if I wanted to lager a beer over an extended period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattC10 Posted January 20, 2012 Author Share Posted January 20, 2012 Hi Hairy \u2014 thanks for explaining this. About step 3:in your estimation, about how long would the brew have to be in contact with the trub for it to impart an off-taste? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 I have no idea Matt. I assume lots of variables are at play there. The longest I have kept a beer in primary is just over 3 weeks and had no problems. I have read where people have kept it for much longer than that without dramas (months even). Some people lager it for several weeks whilst still on the trub. If you are only planning on leaving it for less than 3-4 weeks then it shouldn't be a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChristopherZ Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 The longest I have kept a beer in primary is just over 3 weeks and had no problems. Can someone explain to me why the Coopers documentation (including Paul Mercurio) says to keep the primary for about 6 days, whereas the internet says closer to 2 weeks? My SG readings tend to level off by about day 7, and I've read enough about yeast autolysis to make me very nervous about keeping the batch in the primary after that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rossm Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 ....does Paul Mercurio work for Coopers?.....[cool] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyG4 Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 he at least did a video - my first coopers kit 8-9 years ago featured an instruction video with the strictly ballroom superstar... and home brewer, as he so fakely adds :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChristopherZ Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Sorry, I guess the Paul Mercurio reference wasn't really relevant. Here is an example: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeonardC2 Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 We've discussed these things many times on homebrewtalk.com. There's still an ongoing debate over carboy vs better bottle vs plastic fermenters over here. And the old autolysis demon is pretty much put to rest. They used to think that the yeast were settling to the bottom because they were dead. WRONG! If the yeast were dead,we couldn't wash & reuse them. I've had my ales on the yeast cake for 5 weeks with no ill effects whatsoever. Some over here have had beers on the yeast for some 5 months,all good. So autolysis in the home brwing field is pretty much a myth. I use my cooper's micro brew fermenter,& a Brewer's Best ale pale for fermenter's,& a 7.9 gallon pale with an Italian spigot fopr a bottling bucket. Bulk priming is a very good way to customize carbonation levels to style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChristopherZ Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Thanks Leonard, and apologies for hijacking the thread. Can I just confirm that the reason to let the primary sit for 2 weeks is so more of the fermentation product drops into the yeast cake via gravity, leaving a purer brew? Is that correct? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muddy Waters Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 That is correct Christopher [biggrin] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 and home brewer' date=' as he so fakely adds [/quote'] It wasn't fake. Paul Mecurio has been a homebrewer for many, many years. Although, by the look on her face as she tasted, I think the girl that assisted him hadn't tasted a beer in her life. [biggrin] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Mud Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 I read something John Palmer wrote where he explained why he recommended secondary fermentation in the first edition of "How to Brew". Firstly, he said it was the thinking at the time, but also that the yeast strains that used to be available to brewers were far less advanced than those commercially available today, and autolysis was a very present danger if a brew was left on the yeast for too long. With today's yeasts this is no longer a common problem and John writes that the risk of infection/aeration present in racking the beer to a secondary is far greater than the risk of autolysis if the beer is left in the primary. I think he outlined some examples of beers that would still need to be racked, but the explanation was good enough for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 says to keep the primary for about 6 days' date=' [/quote'] I can't remember now but are you sure it didn't say "at least 6 days" or to "bottle after 6 days"? I must dig it out and have another look sometime. Paul Merc has been a home brewer for many moons now. I also recommend his book, "Cooking With Beer". [love] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weggl Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Yea, well i've now am fermenting No 1 fermenter 12-14 days, 2nd fermenter to bulk condition with Wostop system for 14 days, 50g Sugar to No 2, to drive the air out of the space on top of the beer so as to stop oxidisation. 3rd bucket for bulk priming. The reason I an bulk conditioning is because i have read, if it is true on not I don't know, that a week bulk priming is equivalent to a month in the bottle. I have only done one brew this way which was Tony's Irish Ale and i must say that after 8 days in the bottle it was very good. On the matter of the Woztop system i have had other thoughts. The Wostop does keep C02 over the beer under some pressure. But is this pressure needed? On second thoughts an air lock would do the same. The Co2 produced by the 50g of sugar would drive the air out and maintain it over the beer. Glass carboys are normally used but as I don't have one i use the normal plastic fermenters. I don't know if glass carboys are made in 23L. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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