GrahamB8 Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 Running some numbers for a cheap allgrain setup and wanted your opinions, critiques and suggestions. Since theres a couple of people on here thinking about something similar I thought it would be nice to start a healthy discussion on the subject and have listed what I think I need and the costs associated. All parts and prices are Australian im afraid, 31.5 MJ/h burner from BCF $54.95 43L Esky from BCF (I already own one but for this estimation I thought this was good value) $59 Brass ball valve ebay $11 Plate chiller from Craftbrewer $129.50 30L stockpot from ebay $99 Total outlay very approximately $353.45 I would push that figure up to $400 after additional fittings and hoses Fire away [cool] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smithy Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 Having space constraints I plan to just go BIAB. Pretty much the same as Bill's setup which seems pretty cool. I expect that to hit around the $400 mark as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 Running some numbers for a cheap allgrain setup and wanted your opinions, critiques and suggestions. Since theres a couple of people on here thinking about something similar I thought it would be nice to start a healthy discussion on the subject and have listed what I think I need and the costs associated. All parts and prices are Australian im afraid, 31.5 MJ/h burner from BCF $54.95 43L Esky from BCF (I already own one but for this estimation I thought this was good value) $59 Brass ball valve ebay $11 Plate chiller from Craftbrewer $129.50 30L stockpot from ebay $99 Total outlay very approximately $353.45 I would push that figure up to $400 after additional fittings and hoses Fire away [cool] 3V baby!!.. If you have the space dont feck about with bags.. I use a 45ly esky, 3 ring burner and a converted keggle (on a home made stand) and a rubberised converted keg with an immersion element hooked up to the STC1000 for the HLT... is a good system that has cost me only a few hunderd dollars I'd guess.. dont forget a mill.... get a good one and never look back. Yob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 Graham, what will you use in the esky? A braid, manifold, false bottom or bag? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonB18 Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 My setup will be something like this,, Propane Burner, http://www.amazon.com/Bayou-Classic-SQ14-Single-Outdoor/dp/B0009JXYQ4/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1334630128&sr=8-2 My boil Kettle, http://www.amazon.com/Polarware-Economy-Stainless-Kettle-Bazooka/dp/B006J7L6LA/ref=pd_sim_sbs_k_10 Hot Liquor tank, ( I will build my own it is cheaper) http://www.amazon.com/10-Gallon-Hot-Liquor-Tank/dp/B0064OEJLM/ref=pd_sim_sbs_misc_1 Mash Tun, (Again build my own saves money) http://www.amazon.com/Single-Infusion-Mash-Tun/dp/B0064OEI4U/ref=pd_sim_sbs_misc_2 Sparge arm, http://www.amazon.com/Stainless-Steel-Sparge-Arm/dp/B0064OF1QO/ref=pd_sim_sbs_misc_5 you will also want a grain mill kinda like this, http://www.amazon.com/Barley-Crusher-MaltMill-Hopper/dp/B0064OF1LY/ref=sr_1_6?s=kitchen&ie=UTF8&qid=1334630863&sr=1-6 some type of wart chiller kinda like this, http://astore.amazon.com/wwwallhomebre-20/detail/B004D4QPQW I will need to build a table kinda thing for this gravity feed system. The prices for this setup is a bit more, I can save some money shopping around ( don't forget shipping prices) sometimes you can find free shipping, even if the price is a bit higher with free shipping you can save a bunch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamB8 Posted April 17, 2012 Author Share Posted April 17, 2012 Graham, what will you use in the esky? A braid, manifold, false bottom or bag? Manifold, either plastic or copper is my current stance. Hey Yob just been in Anaconda, 3 ring 31.5 MJ are $49.99 and 4 ring 57 MJ are $89.99, what do you reckon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamB8 Posted April 17, 2012 Author Share Posted April 17, 2012 Nice kit Jason, I have left the grain mill out for now as Craftbrew mill to order at no extra charge, it would be on the cards though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewF111 Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 So cool im keen to make one as well. Thanks for starting this thread. Hairy love your quote. an ol skool favourite. st st stutter rap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamB8 Posted April 17, 2012 Author Share Posted April 17, 2012 Still not sure of, 31.5 or 57 MJ/h burner: I still cant figure out which would be in the long term more efficient, 57 is only $40 more. Copper or plastic manifold in the mash tun: Pro's and cons, copper would mean I have to buy a torch. Counterflow or immersion chiller: I've read immersion is more efficient and easier to clean but Im struggling to find them in Australia and they are expensive to build. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 copper would mean I have to buy a torch Will you be making it in the dark? [innocent] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 No need to buy a torch, the maifolds fit together without welding and indeed are better for it as they are easily pulled apart for cleaning, you lightly centre punch the end joins so they will hold easier... can post photo's of mine if you like.. I also use a 3 ring burner, though TBH I only use the 2 outer rings.. here's my converted Ford Mag I picked up off the side of the road.. though the mag has also been cut to fit a 4 ring burner we needed to use at a case swap I find that I can get a VERY decent boil with the 3 ring... in fact on the weekend I had a boilover (my first) in a keggle [lol] and I get great efficiency from the 9kg gas bottle.. better (more) than most others.. doing fly sparging is great for gas efficiency as you can have it coming to the boil as you are still running off from the mash tun.. I also No Chill which Ive found to be great.. easy option while waiting to get the funds/desire for a chiller.. [lol] [bandit] [ninja] my Rig.. 3V HLT with pump recirc (better temp control) Esky with copper manifold and keggle Pot on a Ford rim Burner stand.. (working on pump recirc [HERMS] system for the mash tun) ghetto as feck... but it's a work in progress [lol] Yob edit: and I also have no hop screen [lol] just a little pick up tube (V2) mostly free stuff [lol] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamB8 Posted April 17, 2012 Author Share Posted April 17, 2012 Bloody awesome mate, I would love to find some of those keggles but there like rocking horse and the ones you do find on ebay ect are that highly sought after there impossible to get hold of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 My setup will be something like this,, Propane Burner, http://www.amazon.com/Bayou-Classic-SQ14-Single-Outdoor/dp/B0009JXYQ4/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1334630128&sr=8-2 My boil Kettle, http://www.amazon.com/Polarware-Economy-Stainless-Kettle-Bazooka/dp/B006J7L6LA/ref=pd_sim_sbs_k_10 Hot Liquor tank, ( I will build my own it is cheaper) http://www.amazon.com/10-Gallon-Hot-Liquor-Tank/dp/B0064OEJLM/ref=pd_sim_sbs_misc_1 Mash Tun, (Again build my own saves money) http://www.amazon.com/Single-Infusion-Mash-Tun/dp/B0064OEI4U/ref=pd_sim_sbs_misc_2 Sparge arm, http://www.amazon.com/Stainless-Steel-Sparge-Arm/dp/B0064OF1QO/ref=pd_sim_sbs_misc_5 you will also want a grain mill kinda like this, http://www.amazon.com/Barley-Crusher-MaltMill-Hopper/dp/B0064OF1LY/ref=sr_1_6?s=kitchen&ie=UTF8&qid=1334630863&sr=1-6 some type of wart chiller kinda like this, http://astore.amazon.com/wwwallhomebre-20/detail/B004D4QPQW I will need to build a table kinda thing for this gravity feed system. The prices for this setup is a bit more, I can save some money shopping around ( don't forget shipping prices) sometimes you can find free shipping, even if the price is a bit higher with free shipping you can save a bunch. MoreBeer, and others, I find are a good place to purchasenear you Jason. Also a copper wort chiller is far superior than a SS one. Graham, an Urn and a bag is a lot easier to find and only takes minutes to clean. I personally love a system like Don Bourke (AHB) has [love] but now we are talking big biccies there and better still for a little bit more something like the Blichmann is only a dream. Even a Beerbelly turn key system would be great. Oh one can only dream for now. [love] Just happy I can get away with BIAB + Urn for now until the pennies are saved and the kids are a bit older. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamB8 Posted April 18, 2012 Author Share Posted April 18, 2012 I hear ya Bill and did seriously consider it but the end goal would be the 3V so why not start with a basic version and build on it? I believe I can get the same end product for similar cost but a basic 3V can be continually upgraded until you have something that looks like a BTK (well I dont think it would ever be as nice but you know what Im saying) Very interesting read guys: http://www.popularmechanics.com/home/how-to-plans/metalworking/4323694 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamB8 Posted April 26, 2012 Author Share Posted April 26, 2012 Update: Found two 50L Aluminium pots for $60, will only initially use one as a boil kettle as Im bidding on a 100L esky ($50 so far), felt I needed a new one to get me started. Bought a stainless steel outlet set including stainless grain mesh, ball valve, barb ect ect, a bit extravagant but should last forever. This weekend I will be collecting a 110mj HP burner and stand from BCF ($169) again a little extravagant but I like the fact it comes with a nice sturdy stand and should do the job a little faster particulary if I try and do double batches. it looks a lot like this I also bought the ingredients for an American pale and an English IPA. I'm aiming to make my next two brews my first AG's (Have to open the fridge when I open the freezer or the door hits my beer taps and opens beer into my drip tray [lol] ) All up the break down in cost is: $60 - Pots $80 - Stainless fittings $50 - Esky $169 - Burner and stand (you can buy a 31mj for $50) $17 - No-chill cube $376 spent I plan to batch sparge, cube and my grain is pre-crushed so theres more to spend in the future but I should be able to make beer with what I have. By the way for those wanting to do a wort cost comparison the grains alone for 2 batches of beer (Guessed OG's of 1.062 (Approx 7kg) and 1.050 (approx 6.3kg) came to $54.20, after which you have to factor in hops and yeast. To be continued Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 27, 2012 Share Posted April 27, 2012 you may need bigger than a 50lt pot for doubles... you may squeeze it in but I wouldnt like to.. 2 cubes = 44-46lt not really leaving you much room for evap.. Heading in the right direction though mate [bandit] Maybe use the 50lt pots for HLT and MT and find somethiong bigger for the kettle? Yob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamB8 Posted April 27, 2012 Author Share Posted April 27, 2012 Yeh the pots wont be big enough but when i get to that stage I will probably buy a new 70L stainless from Craftbrewer. I thought about insulating one of the pots for a MT but they didn't come with lids, I also understand it would be difficult/expensive to insulate them to the efficiency level of an esky. The end goal is a recirculating mash system so the spare 50L will be used. I have a 20L which should suffice for the HLT and the idea is it will be brought up to mash/sparge temp in the kitchen to save gas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 you may want to consider an immersion element so you dont have to carry round many litres of potentially scalding water.. I have an over the side element Im currently using for my HERMS rig but am going to get a kettle element and fit it to my Big W pot Not complete yet.. a work in progress Those Over the Side elements rock [rightful] Yob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamB8 Posted April 28, 2012 Author Share Posted April 28, 2012 looking good Yob, have you modifed the esky to enclose the sparge arm inside it when its closed? Which pump do you use those march pumps are bloody expensive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 looking good Yob, have you modifed the esky to enclose the sparge arm inside it when its closed? Which pump do you use those march pumps are bloody expensive Nope.. You can have it open the whole time with a herms setup as you get your heat from the herms container this is sparge arm MKIII The pump I use is the "Little Brown Pump" from Gryphon Brewing (WA) as seen here on my HLT.. I use one to recirc the HLT to get even temps throughout I tell ya... theres wires and hoses going everywhere on brewday [lol] a shet load of fun though [lol] [bandit] [ninja] Yob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamB8 Posted April 28, 2012 Author Share Posted April 28, 2012 you know I nearly bought one when he advertised his sale on them last week on AHB but they went out of stock before I got a look in. I'll need to get a couple of simple brews in the bag first before I pimp my system so I can figure out my limitations and iron out any issues Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonB18 Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 Built my Mash Tun and Hot Liqueur tank today, cost about $150. It is all brass and stainless, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamB8 Posted April 29, 2012 Author Share Posted April 29, 2012 Looking good Jason, I was just outbid higher than I would like to go on my ebay esky so need to source another one before next weekend when I plan to do the first brew. There a new 47Litre one for sale at a local store but Im wondering now I have seen yours whether its more efficient having less head space in the mash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilboBaggins Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 Wow. I'm really happy with the results I get from extract brews, but like most brewers, I would like to give all grain a go some time in the future. I just need to ask, is it possible to achieve good results without it being so complicated and requiring so much equipment? I have to confess, I'm not even sure what some of these pics are of and what I'm looking at?!?!? As far as resources go, can anyone recommend a starting point for the aspiring grainist (it's a word now dammit) ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamB8 Posted April 29, 2012 Author Share Posted April 29, 2012 Very simplified all grain vid with basic equipment. You dont even have to use his chilling method you can simply pour the wort after the boil into a container and ferment it when your ready (called the no chill method) Also the John Palmer 'how to brew' All grain section is a good start http://www.howtobrew.com/section3/index.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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