New to brewing and have a few question...

[Stevodevo]

Hi All,

 

Just getting back into brewing here and have a few beginner questions. I've just got myself a DIY beer kit and put the Coopers Lager kit on. It's looking good after 4 days and I'm looking forward to bottling soon. My questions are:

 

1/ I've read lots about it generally being best to keep primary fermentation temps at around 18C to reduce fruity esters and fusel alcohol etc. The yeast that comes with the DIY kit says the range for that yeast is 21-27C. Is it OK to sit the brew at 18C, or should I really stick between 21-27 for "best" results with that particular yeast variety? I don't mind fermentation taking longer at lower temps if that's the only difference.

 

2/ further to my last question, is the main concern for constant low temps mainly during the primary fermentation? I\u2019m planning on leaving my brew for up to a week after FG has settled before bottling, so just wondering if I need to keep temperature down during that period as well. I\u2019m not talking about letting it go over say, 26C but just wondering what\u2019s best in a perfect world scenario.

 

3/ is racking into a secondary vessel mainly for clarifying or does leaving the beer sitting on the trub eventually affect the taste of the final product?

 

4/ I'm thinking my next brew will be the Fruit Salad Ale from the recipe on this website. The favoured method on this forum seems to be to culture yeast from bottled Coopers. Would the result be heaps different if I just used the yeast that comes withe Pale Ale can?

 

5/ Is the Krausen Kollar removal after 3-4 days just for aesthetic reasons, or does it make a difference to the end result if I just leave it (and the Krausen) in place until bottling?

 

Sorry if these questions have been addressed previously, but I couldn\u2019t for life of me find the search button.

 

 

Thanks,

Steve.

 

[Guest]

Hiya Stevodevo.

 

Welcome to the forum.

 

I'm certainly not the most experienced home brewer on this forum, but I believe I can help answer most of what you have asked.

 

1/ Purely from the advice I have received since joining this forum, I would say to you, if you want to brew "good" beer, brew between 21\xb0-27\xb0C over the recommended 7 day cycle. If you want to brew "great" beer, look towards brewing at sub 20\xb0C temperatures (for most styles) over a 2 week (minimum) cycle using more advanced yeasts & fridging equipment that can maintain those lower temperatures.

 

2/ See above, or "Hairy" or "Muddy" or "AdamH" or "Otto". [biggrin]

 

3/ I personally don't use a secondary fermentation device, as I am a bottler, not a kegger. If you are bottling your brews I would only suggest you bottle down to within 1 litre of your fermenter base unless you like your beer in a milkshake format. [lol]

 

4/ Fruit Salad Pale Recipe (Speak with the recipe creator?)

 

5/ I assume the krausen is waste product expelled by the fermentation process. Thus I believe the Krausen Kollar's purpose is to remove that buildup away from the final brew you intend to bottle. Yes use it if you have one. [cool]

 

Hope that helps.

 

Beer.

[Silverthorn]

Sitting on the Trub for too long may eventually introduce off flavours to your beer but it's not something you need to be overly concerned about. From personal experience sitting for an extra week or two or even more has no effect. I only ever lost a batch in the DIY FV after keging was delayed by three weeks due to me being interstate but it became infected and turned vinegary.

 

From that experience I think it is far more likely that sitting too long will introduce infection due to the breakdown of the CO2 barrier before you start to have off flavours from the trub. This wasn't as much a problem with an older style FV I think because the Air Lock maintained a better seal after CO2 production had ceased. The DIY FV needs some CO2 production to maintain a positive pressure inside the FV to keep air out.

 

That said the batch I lost was left under a veranda exposed to the elements without temperature control. So it had the wind blowing over it constantly and was dealing with Qld summer temperatures. It was really up against it to start with and probably had more to do with the other factors than with sitting on the trub.

 

Using a secondary does assist with clarification particularly for pale beers and also is useful to allow you to mix in a bulk prime of fermentables prior to bottling or kegging without siring up the trub. Bulk priming gives a more even distribution of fermentables throughout the batch particularly for those who bottle and creates a more controlled carbonation throughout the batch.

 

I do believe that the main reason for the Krausen Collar is purely for simplicity of cleaning. We made great Coopers beer for years before they came out with the DIY kit. It also creates a self expanding chamber that can accommodate a hyperactive brew if you happen to get a batch of over excited yeast.

 

The Krausen ring is above and not in contact with the liquid and does not impart any flavours of it's own. If the Krausen ring stays in place for the entire fermentation process it becomes hard and crusty by the time you are ready to clean and is a PITA to get rid of particularly in a FV with limited access. When you take the Collar out while the Krausian ring is still moist it wipes off easily with a paper towel or a rinse under cold water.

 

If you don't have a Collar it makes no difference to your final product but if you do it does make cleaning a snap!!

 

I don't take mine out normally. I do put it on but don't get to take out only because I am not usually home on day 3-4 and my brew has to look after it's self. If I'm at home I do take it out at day 3-4 because it makes life easy. Even if you don't take it out having easy access to both sides of the collar for cleaning still makes it an easy task.

 

The only down side to using one (and it is minimal) is that by opening the FV you are increasing the chances of introducing infection into the FV. Again it's never been an issue to me but I guess it could happen. Personally I love the DIY kit because of the collar and the ability to see what is going on during fermentation and cleaning.

 

Many seasoned brewers once they have their routine down simply use cling wrap with a couple of pin holes over their plastic container of choice and abandon air locks, collars, taps etc. Probably not the best method for a beginner but once you have the nack of getting a good brew it's amazing how simple your setup can become without ANY impact on quality.

 

Most important is to relax and enjoy. It's way easier now than when our fathers made home brew. The quality of the kits and the ease that products like Starsan provide make it almost fool proof. If you have a read through the forum you'll find lots of "Is it going to be crap" posts but very, very few that actually turn out undrinkable.

[Hairy]

Leaving the beer on the trub may affect the taste of the beer due to yeast autolysis. But not in a few weeks, more likely months.

 

I leave my beer in the FV for a minimum of 2 weeks and I have pushed it out to 4 weeks. Others have left it much longer.

 

If you have a proper sanitation program then you shouldn't have any problems with infections either (no guarantees though, you can just minimise risk).

 

Stevodevo, regarding the fermentation temps, it is most important to maintain the correct temps during the primary fermentation period. If the temp creeps up a little after that it isn't the biggest deal. But I wouldn't leave it in the high 20's either.

 

Also, using the Coopers recultured yeast will give a different flavour to the kit yeast. A lot of flavour is derived from the Coopers yeast and it will make it a little fruitier. I have only ever made the fruit salad recipe using US-05 and it was fine.

[Stevodevo]

Thanks for the comprehensive replies!

 

That answers everything, but if it's OK I'd still like to drill down on the subject of temperatures using the supplied Cooper's yeast. To put it more simply... I have my batch on the go now, and using wet towels, frozen 2litre water bottles and a fan I've been able to get my brew down to 18C without too much effort.

 

So my question is, what would you do right now with this batch that's sitting at 18 using the supplied yeast? Should I be letting the temp get up to 21C or am I better off taking advantage of the cooler weather and keeping it down at 18? Just not sure if the poor little buggers go into hibernation or something if it gets too cold in there? I acknowledge there may not be much real world difference, but I'm just trying to get the theory of it right in my head...

 

Thanks again,

Steve.

[Guest]

Leave it at 18C until it is finished.

[Stevodevo]

Thanks everyone. Thinking about it now I suppose I could've answered that last questions myself. Cooler = better (within reason) and while the hydrometer readings are still dropping, the yeast is still doing its job right?

[AdamH1525226084]

PB2 said on another thread earlier in the year that he Krausen collar was initially just to create extra head space in the FV, but they found the making it easier to clean part as an added bonus.

 

Regarding the Fruit Salad Ale - if you are a hoppy bear lover, increase the hops. I made this and it was great compared to the first beer - the OS lager - but not hoppy enough IMO. It was a very slight hop aroma. But I am mad for hops [love]

 

For yeast - I follow the manufacturers guidelines. For example, Safale US-05 says 15C-24C. I can't remember if there is information like that on the yeast in the kits.

[Guest]

Cooler = better (within reason) and while the hydrometer readings are still dropping' date=' the yeast is still doing its job right?[/quote']

This depends on what you are making. Cooler is not always better but is most of the time.

 

Yes, if the Hydrometer reading is dropping then the yeast are chomping.

[Lotm]

A great thread for all new brewers! [biggrin]