Mike - Hoosier Daddy Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Received a can of Traditional Draught I had ordered by mail though a third party retailer and noticed it expired last February. I can have it replaced by them but Im sure if they sent one expired can what are the chances on receiving a second expired can. Anyway, how sensitive is the stuff to expiration? Is three months out too long or would it be safe to go ahead and mix this stuff up? Thanks, Mike! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike - Hoosier Daddy Posted May 11, 2011 Author Share Posted May 11, 2011 I contacted Coopers here in the States and they are sending me a new can of Draught, and an extra yeast packet so I can use the expired can. Apparently the yeast is what expires in the kit? Im very impressed with the level of customer service. They resolved this by email with me in less than 15 minutes. That girl deserves a pay raise [biggrin] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muddy Waters Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Nice one! let us know how the old can stacks up against the new one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike - Hoosier Daddy Posted May 11, 2011 Author Share Posted May 11, 2011 Will do Muddy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike - Hoosier Daddy Posted May 11, 2011 Author Share Posted May 11, 2011 Apparently from what Im being told, the malt flavor will change slightly over time and you'll only be able to tell a slight difference if brewed with fresh yeast. Thinking of doing a special brew with the expired can since I'll have a second fresh one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Do the expired can first with the freshest yeast to achieve the best possible result for it. Then you should have the "non" expired can to use when you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PB2 Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Mike, don't expect fantastic results with the out-of-date beer kit. You have removed one side of the beer triangle [pinched] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matty A Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 I actually stole the beer triangle from your signature Paul and stuck it on my brewing gear. Now everytime I brew I find myself making sure that I do every step and I haven't had any problem with my beers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike - Hoosier Daddy Posted May 11, 2011 Author Share Posted May 11, 2011 Mike, don't expect fantastic results with the out-of-date beer kit. You have removed one side of the beer triangle [pinched] Should I risk even using it, or give it a toss? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matty A Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Should I risk even using it, or give it a toss? Whats the risk, you have fresh yeast and already have the can. At most you will waste a couple of weeks of fermenter time and bottle time. Who knows I used an out of date can of sparkling ale (with recultured yeast) not realising it was out of date until too late. It was fairly dark, didn't taste as good as all of my other Sparkling Ales, but my mates and I still enjoyed them very much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muddy Waters Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 I say go for it! You may be have lost one side of PB2's Beer triangle but with remaining parts you still have a jump ramp to enlightenment [biggrin] Who knows, the beer may be great [cool] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 I would suggest using the kit yeast as nutrient and get yourslf a good attenuating uyeast like US-05 for American or Nottingham for english, depending on what if any, hops you may be adding. one thing that always bugs me about the kit yeast, it only comes in 7g lots.. according to MR MALTY pitching rates for a 1040 wort are more like 9-11 grams. Ive never understood why. I believe this means that using Kit Yeast it will be underpitched. My kit yeasts (for many reasons) always end up as nutrient. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matty A Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 How do you use the kit yeast as a nutrient Iamozziyob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muddy Waters Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 You put it in the boil Matty [cool] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matty A Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Thanks Muddy, That makes 10 times more sense then what I was thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muddy Waters Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Care to share what you were thinking Matty? [roll] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matty A Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Care to share what you were thinking Matty? [roll] I was just thinking he pitched it with the other yeast and the other yeast would kill it and then use it as a nutrient. I thought they might have a fight and the winner reaps the spoils. Obviously that isn't the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 I was just thinking he pitched it with the other yeast and the other yeast would kill it and then use it as a nutrient. I thought they might have a fight and the winner reaps the spoils. lol.. not quite mate but that would be fun to watch under a microscope[lol] I might elaborate a little.. when dry yeast is packaged up the yeast cells also come with, I guess you could say, travel luggage, its enough for them, when they land, to open the suitcase and find it full of their favorite foods, so they get right into it and when they finish the food from the case, they look around and find they have landed in an ocean of their 2nd favorite food.. and then they have a massive orgy and miltiply like the begeesus then go to work making our beer. Sooo.. if mix the little 7g packet kit yeast in a) for kits - when you add the boiling water and do the hot mix or b) extract / ag - when you are doing the last 5min hop addition or when you turn the heat off. This is where I generally do it. also.. Though it kills the yeast it does not however destroy their luggage. When you have done this and then got the wort to pitching temps and put in say a rehydrated and proofed US-05, slurry, or just about any other type of yeast pitching, the first thing they find is all the luggage floating about... chomp chomp.. massive orgy.. go to work making the beer. Its a bit long winded I know but I hope this helps you to understand a bit better. Yob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeonardC2 Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 I made the "pale ale" in the thread of that name in the recipe resource. The OS lager can/yeast were from June '09! I made a starter out of 1.5C of 150F water,& 1 1/4C cup of plain extra light DME I'd purchased for the brew. It sat for 3.5 hours with the old yeast sachet mixed in. I used the old cooper's OS lager can,3lbs of plain extra light Munton's DME,with a 15min Kent Golding hop tea. Dry hopped with 1oz of Willamette for 7 days. By the time I had it ready to pitch,the starter was stirred & dumped in. It was at high krausen,& creamy texture when stirred up to pitch. That old yeast in the starter made my micro brew fermenter creak like an old wooden ship for 4 days! There's a pic of it in the glass in the mentioned "pale ale" thread. It took on the color of a Salvator doppel bock,good English ale flavor. A buiscotti like sweetness,with ripe fruit/earthy flavor. Lemon grass,spicy floweriness under that. Got those flavors at 3 weeks in the bottle,6 days in the fridge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike - Hoosier Daddy Posted May 12, 2011 Author Share Posted May 12, 2011 Im glad this conversation has moved to yeast. I learned today about rehydrating the yeast before adding it to the mix. I've never done this, just added the dry straight in. Should I be rehydrating or is the method Ive used ok too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike - Hoosier Daddy Posted May 12, 2011 Author Share Posted May 12, 2011 I would suggest using the kit yeast as nutrient and get yourslf a good attenuating uyeast like US-05 for American or Nottingham for english' date=' depending on what if any, hops you may be adding. one thing that always bugs me about the kit yeast, it only comes in 7g lots.. according to MR MALTY pitching rates for a 1040 wort are more like 9-11 grams. Ive never understood why. I believe this means that using Kit Yeast it will be underpitched. My kit yeasts (for many reasons) always end up as nutrient. Can I ask you to explain this a little more? I understand the kit yeast is added to the boil and t kills the yeast, but the new yeast will eat on it's luggage [happy]. However, you said to add US-05 for American or Nottingham yeast for English. My next two brews will be the traditional draught and a Irish stout. Which of these two yeast would be recommended? Sorry for the basic questions, my brain is like a sponge right now soaking up all this knowledge [unsure] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 Im glad this conversation has moved to yeast. I learned today about rehydrating the yeast before adding it to the mix. I've never done this' date=' just added the dry straight in. Should I be rehydrating or is the method Ive used ok too?[/quote'] regydrating and proofing is a good way to ensure oyu have an active bunch of yeasties prior to pitching, Ive found that with rehydrating and proofing I get an active fermentation quicker, 1-2 days to krausen with a dry sprinkle and overnight with rehydrated and proofed. Some will say that this is dangerous and a possible source of infection, I say rubbish, if you are careful about sanitation and your methods are sound the risk is minimal. This method ensures you have a fully multipling colony of yeast "when you add it" as apposed to pitching dry where they have to wake up, eat their luggage and then get started. The sooner you have an active fermentation under way htsafer you are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muddy Waters Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 US-05 is perfect for American Pale Ales (or American Ales in general) - I'd probabl use that for the traditional draught if I wasn't going to use the kit yeast. Whereas for English Ales something like nottingham or S-04 would be more appropriate. I wouldn't get too hung up on yeasts at the moment - the kit yeasts will be fine. Concentrate on temp control and the basice of brewing. Yeast nutrient isn't generally required as the malt is nutrient enough to send the yeast on a feeding frenzy. For your Irish Stout I'd suggest the kit yeast. Go to a website such as: Craftbrewer Fermentis White Labs (Liquid Yeast) Wyeast (Liquid Yeast) Read up on the differnet styles and what they add to the brewing equation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike - Hoosier Daddy Posted May 12, 2011 Author Share Posted May 12, 2011 Thaks guys...a wealth of knowledge! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 lol.. not quite mate but that would be fun to watch under a microscope[lol] I might elaborate a little.. when dry yeast is packaged up the yeast cells also come with, I guess you could say, travel luggage, its enough for them, when they land, to open the suitcase and find it full of their favorite foods, so they get right into it and when they finish the food from the case, they look around and find they have landed in an ocean of their 2nd favorite food.. and then they have a massive orgy and miltiply like the begeesus then go to work making our beer. Sooo.. if mix the little 7g packet kit yeast in a) for kits - when you add the boiling water and do the hot mix or b) extract / ag - when you are doing the last 5min hop addition or when you turn the heat off. This is where I generally do it. also.. Though it kills the yeast it does not however destroy their luggage. When you have done this and then got the wort to pitching temps and put in say a rehydrated and proofed US-05, slurry, or just about any other type of yeast pitching, the first thing they find is all the luggage floating about... chomp chomp.. massive orgy.. go to work making the beer. Its a bit long winded I know but I hope this helps you to understand a bit better. Yob LMFAO!!! love that explaination...... what a cracker!![lol] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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