Jay Posted January 27, 2016 Author Share Posted January 27, 2016 Cheers Kelsey. Going to look into this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headmaster Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 I've brewed that Urquell recipe all saaz and also using magnum for bittering, because I ran low on saaz. For whatever reason, the all saaz one was much nicer, smoother and more genuine. I've only ever used Sydney tap water, with an acid malt addition to hit a mash ph of around 5.2 to 5.3. Seems to taste fine to me and very close to the real Urquell and certainly good enough for me. If I was up the central coast of NSW however, I'd buy an RO filter, as the water smells like swamp water a tad at my parents place and other family members who live there. Have spent a lot of time at North Avoca on the central coast, same story there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 I have some acid malt and also some Melanoidin malt to try on my next batch. There is nothing wrong with the Brisbane tap water either really, but the batch done with it just didn't turn out quite as nice as the ones done with the water treated to be super soft. The water works well for pale ales though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headmaster Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 How would you describe the difference Kelsey? Is it more crisp, lighter mouthfeel, sweeter, smoother, brighter, all of the above?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 Sydney water is fairly soft and isn't bad for pilsners. I think Jay is based in Sydney too (we need more Sydney Brewers on this forum). But if you are at the stage where you want to perfect it then some water additions can change the profile by accentuating the malt or making the hops zing. If you are interested and could be bothered doing it then it is worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 Haha, yeah I think a bit sweeter, flavours a little muddied in the untreated water, compared to the treated water versions which were crisper and cleaner flavoured. The clarity was basically the same in both though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay Posted February 10, 2016 Author Share Posted February 10, 2016 Hey Phil, I hope you are out there looking at this post as I'm going to attempt your Pilsner recipe next. Problem I have is when I put in your figures I get an IBU of 50 not the 28ish you have in your recipe. Should I just boil less Spalt for the bittering or have I done something wrong here? Cheers jay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay Posted February 10, 2016 Author Share Posted February 10, 2016 Also as i've never used Spalt, I just did a wee bit of research. It looks like it's an aroma hop. So the question is why use it as a bittering hop? I often wonder this but I guess flavour/characteristics are still attributed when using them? The same reason that Saaz is an aroma hop but can still used for bittering. Is this correct? Cheers Jay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay Posted February 10, 2016 Author Share Posted February 10, 2016 blimey I'm losing it. I've already asked these same questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 It's probably boosted the IBUs because you've added 10 minutes to every hop addition. I just input the recipe into Beersmith, using your 72% efficiency number, and with the additions as listed (assuming a ten minute steep for the last one) it comes out at 37.3 IBU. If I increase them all by 10 minutes, it comes to 44.6IBU. It also predicts an FG of 1.010 with that mash schedule and that yeast. So now we have two different softwares predicting different outcomes... I have a lot of trust in Beersmith though, having used it exclusively for the best part of 3 and a half years. All the brews have turned out as expected when I have devised recipes in this program. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay Posted February 11, 2016 Author Share Posted February 11, 2016 Thanks Kelsey. I think the time has come to move to Beersmith. I've been finding that my FG's are consistently ending up a lot lower than I hoped for. Like my last Pilsner ended up 2004 when it was supposed to be around 2011. The fact that your calcs have come out lower FG is enough to make me think Beersmith is more accurate. I'm also wondering whether starters mean that I get a higher attenuation than the recipe software can calculate? I'm a little confused with the additional 10 minute thing. I added that to compensate for time after flameout when the wort is just 'resting' (still vey hot) while I transfer to the cube etc. So a 0 hop addition is really more like a 10 minute addition. So should I input it as a 10 minute addition in my recipe? Bit confused. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 I think it's a bloody good program. It does take a bit of getting used to but once you have all your equipment profile set up properly for your system and whatnot, it makes recipe design a breeze, and as I said the results come out as expected, or at least very close to. Are you no-chilling or using a chiller on the batch? In Beersmith with those flameout additions you can select them as "steep/whirlpool" additions. It still adds IBUs but not as many as it would if you select "boil". Personally I don't bother adding time to the boiled hops to compensate for the wort sitting for 10-15 mins post flameout. 60, 20, 10 mins etc. additions stay at that time. I don't find this results in some outlandish bitterness level; they all end up as expected. I would suggest while you're still getting used to it all, don't worry about adding time to compensate for whatever.. just do the hop additions as written. If you find they need adjustment after tasting the beer in the glass, you can do this on the next batch. There is little point in adjusting for something when you don't even know if it needs it yet. Cheers Kelsey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay Posted February 11, 2016 Author Share Posted February 11, 2016 Thanks Kelsey I'll leave out the extra 10 minute thing. I no-chilled for my first and only BIAB so far. I don't have a wort chiller yet, that could be my next DIY venture. I've just bought Beersmith. I'd tried the trial version and got a bit intimidated by it. But with a tad more experience since then it mostly seems to make sense. Well the basics anyway. Antiphiles recipe has Carahell in it but that grain isn't in the software, I just did a bit of research and people are saying its the same as Crystal 10. Is this correct do you know? cheers j Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 No idea re: Carahell but you can update the database in Beersmith to include all the Weyermann malts (I'll have a play and figure it out because I can't remember it at this point). Well, it's easier than I remembered. All you need to do is go to any screen in Beersmith, click on the Add-ons button near the top towards the right, hit the big green plus button, and when it loads them all, scroll down to Weyermann Malts and install this add-on. Carahell will then show up in the list of grain, as will all the other Weyermann grains. I also no-chill my batches, can't be arsed with active chilling because it's a lot more convenient for me to not have to have the FV empty on brew day. I haven't found a need to adjust hopping times, but this is purely my own palate. Personally I would ignore any advice or formulas that instruct to "add 15 minutes to all additions" or whatever. It might work for some people but it doesn't work for everybody. The best way to approach this is to simply work out what works best for your tastes for each beer style you brew. Or, build/buy a chiller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay Posted February 11, 2016 Author Share Posted February 11, 2016 Brilliant cheers Kelsey. Just added them. ta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headmaster Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 Here is a good resource Jay: http://www.brew.is/files/malt.html Weyermann Carahell is crystal 10 as well as, depending on the brand: Crystal 10, Caramalt Carapils CaraMalt CaraHell / (CaraBelge) Light Carastan Light Caramel Carapils Caramel Pilsen Gets confusing as for eg carapils in this list is the DWc brand whereas the weyermann carapils is something different equiv to briess dextrine malt I use the linked info in a spreadsheet I keep with various pages of info about hops as well, cntrl-F is my friend here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 This from Weyermann's website explains why Briess is allowed to market a malt called Carapils even though it's originally a Weyermann brand name. Pretty well all the Cara- grains are Weyermann brands and aren't identical to each other as that list would suggest. Malts called 'caramel' obviously don't fall under this. As Weyermann evolved from a mostly national to an international company, the need to consider trademark protections outside the German borders became an ever more pressing issue. Thus, SINAMAR became an international trademark in 1930, and Carapils, in 1926. In North America, unfortunately, Weyermann’s application for trademark protection of its Carapils arrived too late: The name had already been registered by another malting company. In North America, therefore, unlike in Germany and the rest of the word, Carapils is marketed under the name of Carafoam, but the two names stand for the same product. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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