Beerlust Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Yep, that's pretty much why the world rejects French citizens for foreign immigration, & restricts the French to stay in France. The hope from the rest of the world is that forced inbreeding of the French will eventually result in a new animal breed that science can claim is a reversal of trend defying climate warming, & is a reversal of species extinction. They'll stink & look dirty, but some scientific body will claim a positive victory for it! Lusty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porschemad911 Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 I'm all for the French staying in France if it means they keep tending their vineyards rather than selling them off to overseas buyers! My ride to work is getting too short now . Yesterday it only took 17 minutes, so this morning I think I might have to do a couple of laps of the lake before going into the office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beeblebrox Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Just to clarify my attitude to cyclists: I think all road users should be considerate of each other, whether they're cyclists, trucks, buses, cars, taxis vans, or whatever. I also think too many disregard the road rules, & the common courtesy that used to be expected of drivers. I was lucky enough to have had driving lessons before I got my license, long before there was the complicated system of 2 different P plates & multiple tests. My instructor taught me to always be considerate of other road users, no matter who they are. The road is there for everyone to use, & the road rules are supposed to be a benchmark of expectations for driver & rider behaviour. It could be my ASD talking, but when road users fail to follow the rules, it makes it harder for others, as we have to anticipate what they're going to do. I'm not saying all road rules make sense, or that anyone is more entitled than anyone else, or that cyclists should stay off the road; but the road infrastructure & road rules are clearly biased against cyclists, & there needs to be better opportunities for those that choose to cycle, whether for fitness, sport, transport, or whatever to be safe when using their bikes. If bikes are to be allowed on roads, they need to be kept in good condition, with enough lanes (bicycle or general lanes) that everyone can travel with an acceptable level of safety. Clearly governments on all levels are failing on this. If bikes are to be on dedicated cycle paths, they also need to be kept in good condition, & pedestrians shouldn't assume that they can walk where bikes are meant to be & vice versa (obviously other than shared paths). What it all boils down to, is everyone needs to be tolerant of others, on the road & otherwise, & treat others with the dignity, respect, courtesy & concern you'd wish to be treated with. It's not the bikes, cars, trucks, buses, taxis etc that are the problem. It's that some of them are ridden or driven by inconsiderate, objectionable people, that tend to tar all others from that group with the same brush by their behaviour. Be nice to everyone, & if you can't, try to stay out of their way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 It could be my ASD talking' date=' but when road users fail to follow the rules, it makes it harder for others, as we have to anticipate what they're going to do. [/quote'] Yep, and not only that, they then expect others to accommodate them for their own stupidity or ignorance or both, in the first place. Which is something I flat out refuse to do if I can avoid it without causing a crash. But, if they want to bang their car up, it's fine with me, I won't be paying the costs of repairs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graculus Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 King Ruddager' date=' are you heading for Victor?[/quote'] You bet your arse I am! Can't wait until Friday I'm thinking of taking a 5 minute head start this year though to avoid the squabble up Norton Summit. I hope you guys are going fully prepared. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Ruddager Posted January 20, 2016 Author Share Posted January 20, 2016 Sorry but IMHP there was no place on that narrow winding road for a cyclist in rainy poor light conditions. It's all about hazard identification and risk control' date=' the level of risk you were prepaired to accept on that evening was rediculous and very unfair to all the other road users.[/quote'] Like the guy last night who almost hit me and proceeded to hurl abuse after passing into this pinch point, you seem to think I am guilty of the crime of being there. I drove up that road last night incidentally and had no trouble passing six or seven cyclists, including one in the exact point on my video. It's not that hard, so to say I'm making it "unfair" is incredibly selfish. What's fair is to take care of each other so that everyone gets home safe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beeblebrox Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 It could be my ASD talking' date=' but when road users fail to follow the rules, it makes it harder for others, as we have to anticipate what they're going to do. [/quote'] Yep, and not only that, they then expect others to accommodate them for their own stupidity or ignorance or both, in the first place. Which is something I flat out refuse to do if I can avoid it without causing a crash. But, if they want to bang their car up, it's fine with me, I won't be paying the costs of repairs. That's what I expected from a bus driver! I don't have the luxury, as I've only got my Subaru Impreza. I do all I can to avoid accidents, but the one thing I won't tolerate is tailgaters. If someone tailgates me, they can expect to get splashed with water as I run the windscreen washer. It's especially effective if they have their windows or a sunroof open. It that doesn't deter them I may slow down. If that doesn't work, a quick tap on the brakes, giving them a shock when they almost hit me almost always drives them to overtake. It doesn't always solve the problem, chances are they'll tailgate someone else instead, but as long as they leave me alone that's ok with me. You obviously can't control other people's behaviour, but there's only so much you should tolerate. I've even been known to pull over if someone's tailgating me on a one lane road. Avoiding accidents is everyone's responsibility, but some people just have no consideration for others, let alone their own safety. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Ruddager Posted January 20, 2016 Author Share Posted January 20, 2016 Just kidding. I know you're joking around Beerlust, but just two days ago a person driving a car deliberately crashed a person riding a bike off the road at 60km/h on Greenhill road near the Feathers roundabout. My little sister rides her bike down that stretch once or twice a week when she rides to work so ... hearing jokes after stories like that kind of makes my blood boil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 I've always been like that though, one of my pet peeves on the road is other people totally ignoring the road rules just to get home to do nothing 5 seconds earlier, and by doing so putting me in a position where I shouldn't have even been in the first place if they just did what they should have done. I don't care if they run out of room and have to stop, or run off the road or whatever, it's their own stupid fault for trying to be a smartarse in the first place and coming off second best as a result of someone else doing what they're entitled to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Ruddager Posted January 20, 2016 Author Share Posted January 20, 2016 ... one of my pet peeves on the road is other people totally ignoring the road rules just to get home to do nothing 5 seconds earlier ... This is what gets me too - everybody seems willing to risk it all to get to the red light a few moments sooner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Ruddager Posted January 20, 2016 Author Share Posted January 20, 2016 Today in Melbourne a woman was hospitalised after two men chased her down, assaulted her with a blunt weapon and then fled. Disgraceful and completely unacceptable, right? Well, not according to the comments on this article. Methinks there's an attitude problem afoot ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerlust Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 I've always been like that though' date=' one of my pet peeves on the road is other people totally ignoring the road rules just to get home to do nothing 5 seconds earlier, and by doing so putting me in a position where I shouldn't have even been in the first place if they just did what they should have done. I don't care if they run out of room and have to stop, or run off the road or whatever, it's their own stupid fault for trying to be a smartarse in the first place and coming off second best as a result of someone else doing what they're entitled to do. [/quote']+1 There are idiots on the road everywhere. It's not necessarily the case that one is a car & one is on a pushbike, as I see it & am among it almost daily in a car vs car situation. In just the last two days... Just yesterday on my way to work, I'm in the left lane pulling away from the traffic lights when a peanut next to me in a small van in the right-hand lane decides that once he has half a car length on me it is a suitable time to begin moving into the lane I am currently in. I slam on the anchors to avoid him hitting me & give a good long blast of the horn. Barely 150-200m up the road from that traffic light intersection this same idiot slams on the brakes & makes a left-hand turn down a side street. I was fuming!! The main road we were on before his left hand turn is primarily 3 lanes wide for tens of kilometres before that traffic intersection, yet he couldn't find an earlier point in time along that stretch of road to move into the left lane knowing he would have to turn left after that set of traffic lights??!! IDIOT!! Today not more than an hour ago while driving home from my parents house I'm sitting stationary in the left lane (ironically because about 1-2kms down the road I need to turn left) on a major highway queued at an intersection crossing. To the left of me there is a parking lane/breakdown lane that is at a point where it is beginning to end & funnel into the intersection. So the lights go green & the traffic is beginning to move & suddenly from nowhere this idiot comes roaring down the parking lane (rather than queueing like the rest of us) and begins to push his way into traffic. I have to veer away to avoid hitting him. Again I'm fuming! As I pass through the intersection I get a glimpse of the idiot driving the car as he begins to turn left. A 'P' plater that just seemed totally oblivious to the fact he had done anything wrong or that he had caused any inconvenience to myself & the driver directly infront & behind me. Sometimes I wish my car was a Dodge 'Em car! Lusty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Yep, I see it every day, given I'm on the road for at least 8 hours. Most of the time it doesn't directly affect me but I do often find myself questioning what these morons have between their ears and how the hell they even got a licence in the first place. That first situation there Lusty I see very often, except I usually just keep driving at the same speed and blast them on the horn, and make them go the long way. Especially amusing to me if there is no way to turn around for ages. I do wonder if it is a direct correlation to more people using GPS navigation systems though, because they don't tell you to turn until you're only a few hundred metres away. I honestly believe those things should be banned. I did see a beauty late last year before I went on holidays while I was driving back to the depot after a shift. The road was two lanes, and the left lane ended after a traffic light intersection. I was in the right lane for obvious reasons. There was a car in the left lane beside me, who sped up to get far enough ahead to move across safely. No problems there. Unfortunately, there was a muppet behind him, who decided to speed up on the inside of this other car while it was still in the left lane, nearly running into a traffic island and the signal pole on it, overtaking this car, then cutting in front of another 4WD further up just as the dotted lines trailed off to the edge of the road, only to get stopped at a red light about 400m later. But the powers that be would have everyone believe that driving 62 in a 60 zone is gonna kill everyone, while this sort of stupidly dangerous behaviour goes unnoticed and unpunished. Not revenue raising my arse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark D Pirate Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 You'd see plenty of those muppets Otto , The nanny state has most people convinced that safety is travelling just under the posted limit , wearing seatbelt and sober .... Never mind looking and thinking further ahead than the front bumper All road users do have rights but also responsibility Driver training is just a joke in Australia , I'd like to see mandatory re testing every 5 years and make testing more comprehensive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beeblebrox Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 You'd see plenty of those muppets Otto ' date=' The nanny state has most people convinced that safety is travelling just under the posted limit , wearing seatbelt and sober .... Never mind looking and thinking further ahead than the front bumper All road users do have rights but also responsibility Driver training is just a joke in Australia , I'd like to see mandatory re testing every 5 years and make testing more comprehensive [/quote'] Indeed, not drinking, wearing a seat belt, keeping to the speed limit, & following all the road rules are a start, but there's clearly more to it that that. When I had driving lessons, I was taught to acknowledge other drivers who let you in, allow other drivers to enter the flow of traffic, or whatever, & to acknowledge silly mistakes, all of which can be done with hand gestures that are not the offensive ones you see all too often on the roads these days. There are plenty of muppets that drive whilst talking on their hand held phones, bugger around with hand held devices, & seem to be completely in their own world, oblivious to the fact they are surrounded by other vehicles who they narrowly miss, (usually due to good luck, & the observations of others, rather than driving skills) causing great frustration to others. Indeed some of the more troublesome drivers are the ones that drive too slowly, can't keep in their lane, stop just as a traffic light turns orange with others behind them having to drop anchor to avoid a collision, & frequently fail to indicate when turning or changing lanes. Some of them are older drivers, but there are some younger drivers that also do all the above. I can only speculate as to why. Driver training & testing is much more comprehensive these days that it was when I was learning to drive in the 1990's (I was actually a late starter in that regard), but the awareness & quality of driving has decreased dramatically, so I have to say, in my experience training & testing doesn't appear to be the issue; if it was newer drivers would be better than us middle aged & older folk, which I can assure you is not the case. Bad drivers are all ages, all nationalities, all religions, & all political persuasions, there is no social group that has the monopoly on bad driving! It seems to me the cause is a cultural & societal problem. With the increase in technology, people feeling the need to be online & contactable at all times, the egocentric narcissism that used to be the preserve of the wealthy, famous, & those in authority has become the norm. Rather than drivers who in my day realized that when they entered the traffic, became part of a living breathing fossil fuel powered hive mind, they now see themselves as individuals whose purpose & destination trumps that of those around them. This is not just happening to younger drivers either, the infection has seeped into the older community also. I know of at least one individual, who believed she was in the right when she cut off a van, was sideswiped by it, then got abusive. Never mind that her lane was ending, the van had given way to one vehicle & she tried to speed past behind it. In that instance, even the old school handbook tells you merging should be a scissor move, you let a car in front, the car behind you lets a car in front, one for one as you merge. This numbskull spent months pursuing an insurance claim, & sadly seems to have won, as her beaten up old Yaris was replaced by a Corolla. I'd have loved to have seen her off the road, as the one time I was foolish enough to get in the car with her, she did a U turn over a double line outside a police station! Anyway, it doesn't matter if you, or the other person is a cyclist, pedestrian, truck driver, bus driver, van driver, taxi driver, motor cyclist, car driver or whatever. We all have be considerate of each other on the road & off. Sure people will tee you off, & sure sometimes you have to get defensive, but starting out with courtesy, respect & understanding, is much better than looking at everyone else as the enemy. That sort of thinking doesn't take you anywhere you want to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porschemad911 Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 We especially need better training on country roads. There is virtually not a single time I do a country drive on a single lane 2 way road where I don't see someone nearly die because they are impatient and have no idea how to judge overtaking speeds, distances and margin for error. Often they are coming towards me for a head on collision after misjudging the overtake. A few times I've had to brake hard and swerve onto the shoulder so they can get back into their lane without killing us both and all our passengers. Or they are slowly overtaking me as traffic approaches them for a head on collision. Sometimes again I've had to brake hard so they don't die. Lucky my car's light and Mitsubishi put some pretty serious brakes on it. Personally, unless the car in front is sitting at least 10-20km/h below the limit, I won't bother overtaking. If they're going that slow, then I'll wait for a big gap and spend as little time on the other side of the road as possible. I'll sit well back from them, wait until I can see a good long distance ahead on the other side of the road with no cars in sight, drop it to 3rd and then floor it. Once the turbo gets onto boost my car accelerates fairly well, so usually I'll be at maybe 150km/h as I draw abreast with the car I'm overtaking. Then wait a couple of seconds until there's a decent gap between us so I'm not cutting them off, pull back in, change up to 5th and back off, then let my speed drop back down to the posted 100 / 110 km/h. It's fast and doesn't stress the other car about whether I'm going to make it or not. I know I'm grateful when another driver uses a similar technique to overtake me. The crazy thing is that if there was a speed camera there I'd lose my license, yet the cars that nearly kill themselves and others with crazy overtaking attempts would be deemed as 'under the limit' and therefore 'safe'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregT5 Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 Just back on the cycling theme...King Ruddy, I will see you at Victor tomorrow. I will be the one in the green & blue top!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beeblebrox Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 Today in Melbourne a woman was hospitalised after two men chased her down' date=' assaulted her with a blunt weapon and then fled. Disgraceful and completely unacceptable, right? Well, not according to the comments on this article. Methinks there's an attitude problem afoot ... Purely & simply an attitude problem, but unfortunately it seems to be the rule not the exception to too many. It's a combination of that & my lack of co-ordination that led me to donate my bike the charity. I like the feeling of the wind as you ride a bike, but the risks are so high, it's really something only an enthusiast could stick with. Bikes aren't as safe as cars at any rate but when you're sharing the road with people who have no concern for others, it's an accident waiting to happen unfortunately. I hope all bike riders are safe & manage to avoid accidents & idiots, but the statistics are against you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Ruddager Posted January 21, 2016 Author Share Posted January 21, 2016 JI will be the one in the green & blue top!! I've been saying the exact same thing. Do say "hi" if you see me though - as a tall' date=' skinny doofus with an uncontrolled beard I stand out pretty well. I'll have my Ride for a Reason knicks on too, which have a yellow stripe around the bottom, like these guys: [img']http://s.afl.com.au/staticfile/AFL%20Tenant/PortAdelaide/Images/Articles%20246x316/160108_wilbur-brandon_620_620X370.png[/img] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Ruddager Posted January 21, 2016 Author Share Posted January 21, 2016 Bikes aren't as safe as cars at any rate but when you're sharing the road with people who have no concern for others' date=' it's an accident waiting to happen unfortunately.I hope all bike riders are safe & manage to avoid accidents & idiots, but the statistics are against you.[/quote'] This is another perception that needs to be broken, starting by repealing mandatory helmet laws. If you were walking down a street and on one side everyone is dressed normally while on the other everyone is wearing bullet-proof vests, you're going to walk down the normal side, right? We need to make cycling normal again because the health benefits of cycling far outweigh the risks, but while it's perceived as a dangerous activity we're left with the image of only a handful of hardcore cyclists running the gauntlet each day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beeblebrox Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 Riding a bike is always going to be a trade off between freedom & safety, as is the case with motor bikes. It's not possible to make riding a bike as safe as driving a car in & of itself, as either the bike or the rider would end up so heavily laden with safety equipment as to not be able to power their bicycle! I don't know the answer, but I do know that so long as cyclists are seen as a fringe group, rather than a growing group of people using alternative transport or leisure activities, nothing will be done to make it safer for cyclists. Yes the roads, tracks & paths need to be better built & maintained, & motorists need to be more co-operative, accepting & courteous, but you can't legislate attitudes, & governments are more interested in doing what's seen as popular, hence the focus on freeways, highways, tollways, etc for cars whilst public transport is a poor cousin, & cyclists barely get a look in. I can't see the logic in repealing the helmet laws though, at least not when it comes to using the road. Sure you can't completely protect your entire body with a helmet, but anything you can do to reduce the risk of a traumatic brain injury has got to be worth the inconvenience & discomfort! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 I would agree, the training and testing isn't the main issue - from my nearly 9 years of driving for a living, attitude/ignorance and impatience appear to be the main causes of people driving like morons. Of course, there is always someone who has absolutely no clue what they're even doing on the road, but most of them are just inconsiderate "it's all about me" types. I and a lot of my friends when through the system before they brought in all this new 100 hours crap and what haveyou, and not to toot my own horn but I consider myself up there with the best drivers on the road, and I have been in my mates' cars plenty of times with no issues either. I'd probably be a bit insulted at having to do a mandatory test every 5 years because I know I can drive very well and safely, and so could everyone else but for their attitude. I think it mainly comes down to attitude - if everyone simply did what they should be doing, there would be far less problems on the roads than there currently are. And the impatient muppets would probably get there quicker with less stressing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beeblebrox Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 Little known fact; many successful race drivers are avid cyclists too. The next cyclist you see on the road could well be a Bathurst 1000 Champ. Plenty of people use multiple modes of transport. I usually walk wherever I can, catch the bus if it's convenient, & usually only drive if it's a long distance, or I need to carry something that is best accommodated in a car. These days I even take my dog with me on the bus sometimes, though not everyone can do that. The cyclist you cut off at the lights could well be the same guy you tailgate. It keeps coming down to the same thing. Be considerate of others. It's a real shame that that has to be said, & that it's no longer what we expect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Chop Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 Today in Melbourne a woman was hospitalised after two men chased her down' date=' assaulted her with a blunt weapon and then fled. Disgraceful and completely unacceptable, right? Well, not according to the comments on this article. Methinks there's an attitude problem afoot ... Back when I was driving trucks for a living the other drivers would tell me to use beach rd to access the south eastern suburbs as there are hardly any traffic lights along it. I used it about twice then no more because I felt one day a cyclist is gunna end up under me. There is a bike path along there but the majority won't use it. I also ride a bicycle around my neighbourhood for recreation, sometimes with my dog on a lead. I feel it's pretty scary on the roads and I'd like to be around for while yet, preferably not in a wheel chair so I ride on the footpath Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Ruddager Posted January 22, 2016 Author Share Posted January 22, 2016 So, would you guys believe Greg spotted me today among a jillion other guys dressed exactly the same. It's always funny meeting fairly anonymous internet people and putting a bit of a face and some personality to the name Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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