AdamD14 Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 Hi guys, Relatively new to this home brew idea. I recently completed my first batch of lager and to my surprise it actually is drinkable. Although currently i am using the PET bottles supplied in the kit. My plan is to get a bench capper and acquire a sufficient amount of bottles in the next 10 days before my next brew is ready to bottle. THE QUESTION IS... Which bottles here in Australia are suitable to recap? From what I have read it is recommended to stay away from twist tops (which is a shame as i have an abundance) and I have noticed in fact on some of them a clause which states "no refill" I am considering going and buying 2 cartons of budweiser and just struggling through drinking it until I have enough bottles. What are other alternatives....? I am assuming I will need dark bottles? all info will help. Adam.[biggrin] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guest1525228310 Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 Coopers 750ml are very good bottles but too big for my purpose. You do not need opaque bottles if you are sure you are able to always keep the bottled beer in the dark. If you feel confident of that then Carlsberg or Heineken green bottles are a couple of cheaper buys that would be suitable. If you go down the path of different size bottles it is even more reason to bulk prime when bottling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 This subject has come up a few times. Crown seals are better, but twist tops seal ok with a bench capper. i have mostly used twist tops and never had a problem. They are most likely thinner glass though, so take extra care that you are not bottling too soon or over priming. Search the site and you will find old threads on this topic[biggrin] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottie Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 +1 for Coopers longnecks, that's all that will be recommended here. I also use 500ml bottles from Crabbie's Ginger Beer and Rekorderlig Cider. For stubbies I have Malt Shovel and Matilda Bay 345ml, Little Creatures 330ml and some Oettinger 330ml(however you spell it). Initially when desperate I used twist tops both 750ml and 375ml all from the Cascade Brewery, you do get a really good seal with the bench capper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 Hi AdamD14 & welcome to the forum. If you are starting from scratch in terms of stock piling bottles, I would buy cartons of longnecks. Preferably Coopers Longnecks. Buy using longnecks, you will halve your bottling time & enjoy a better carbonation of your beer as a result. [cool] I already had a healthy stock pile of stubbies when I moved back to homebrewing, but am slowly (3 bottles x 3 bottles) increasing my longneck stocks to replace the bulk of the stubbies I am currently using. However, if you are wanting to bottle in twist tops, I currently primarily bottle in them, with no problems or noticeable negatives. I hope that helps. Anthony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 This subject has come up a few times. Crown seals are better' date=' but twist tops seal ok with a bench capper. i have mostly used twist tops and never had a problem. They are most likely thinner glass though, so take extra care that you are not bottling too soon or over priming. Search the site and you will find old threads on this topic[biggrin'] yes ive been capping twist tops for 8 yrs with bench capper..no hassles except for the swill i used to brew lol. cheers nedg my old mate i brewed with and i had about 2000 longneck bottles...most were twist tops but i must say the crownies were the best by far..much stronger...the old pick axe bottles are unreal but as i posted earlier we never had any troubles using the screw tops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregT5 Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 I have used the Little Creatures stubbies with a bench capper, they seem a reasonably sturdy bottle. You could try a microbrewery if there is one near you. I have picked up 2nd hand stubbies from them which are made for reusing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 enjoy a better carbonation of your beer as a result. Hows that work then? [pinched] [annoyed] [ninja] Adam, try to stay away from clear glass bottles, if you can easily lay your hands on them, the swing top bottles are great and mean you dont need a capper (check gumtree / ebay / homebrew stores etc) But yeah.. in general, longnecks of any description are the go, they also stack 14 to a milk crate for easy storage. Cheers edit EBAY EXAMPLE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guest1525228310 Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 Buy using longnecks, you will ...enjoy a better carbonation of your beer ... Anthony. Hi Anthony I am interested why you believe that carbonation will be better in a long neck than a stubby. I have never noticed any difference and would not expect to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 Neither have I. It's exactly the same principle of the yeast fermenting the sugar and producing CO2 which can't escape due to the bottle being sealed and therefore being absorbed by the beer. I can't see why bottle size would make any difference at all to this happening. Anyway, I've been using stubbies, mostly for my own convenience; both twist top and pry off ones and never had any problems or explosions. I'm not sure if that no refill thing is just for the breweries themselves to not re-use bottles or not, but in my experience they can obviously handle being re-used multiple times. They may well just be covering their arse with the no refill embossed on them. That said, the Coopers longnecks/tallies I believe are actually designed for re-use, so they're probably the safest bet. As always just make sure fermentation has completely finished before bottling and don't over prime the bottles and Robert's your mother's brother. [joyful] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 Hi John. Buy using longnecks, you will ...enjoy a better carbonation of your beer ... Anthony. Hi Anthony I am interested why you believe that carbonation will be better in a long neck than a stubby. I have never noticed any difference and would not expect to. Over the years I have had better results through individual priming by carbonation of either 2 carb drops in a 750ml bottle vs 1 carb drop in a 375ml bottle. One carb drop in a 330ml bottle seems to replicate two in a 750ml from my experiences. I have experienced the same outcome (in most cases) with manually measuring sugar amounts for secondary fermentation in the same scenarios. I believe there may be an un-written correlation that governs this percentage increase & is alleviated through bulk priming. That's another reason why I'm going to give that method a go. Anthony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 2.5 volumes of co2 = 2.5 volumes of co2 (or insert any other targeted number) Carb drops are not uniform and will give 'slightly' different results from bottle to bottle. it would be my suggestion that "volumes" should be targeted as opposed to X grams, the question really is, what volumes will X grams of Y (being dex / DME etc)give the beer. Naturally there are other factors like what maximum temperature the beer got to as well, this also affects the end result. Yob Bulk Priming Calculator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 Hi Yob. 2.5 volumes of co2 = 2.5 volumes of co2 (or insert any other targeted number) Carb drops are not uniform and will give 'slightly' different results from bottle to bottle. it would be my suggestion that "volumes" should be targeted as opposed to X grams, the question really is, what volumes will X grams of Y (being dex / DME etc)give the beer. Naturally there are other factors like what maximum temperature the beer got to as well, this also affects the end result. Yob Bulk Priming Calculator +1 Everything you stated is irrefutable, & I concur wholeheartedly. How C02 estimation(s) integrate into these calculations (for most) may require further enlightenment to fully understand though. [innocent] Anthony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guest1525228310 Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 Another variable may be the headspace in the bottles. Would too much head space result in less carbonation of the beer? Would a larger bottle be slower to fully carbonate due to the increased volume of liquid and the smaller surface area at the top to allow the CO2 back into the beer? What is the optimum amount of headspace in a bottle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 I don't know if the headspace makes much difference, at least with carb drops. It's still producing the same amount of CO2, if there's less beer in the bottle then it will absorb less OF the gas, but it may well be that for the amount of beer, it ends up being carbonated to the same level as if it was filled properly, because there's more bottle space for the excess CO2 to reside. It may be different for bulk priming because less beer = less sugar.. I don't know. Sounds like an experiment for the next batch to be bottled next weekend! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordEoin Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 I am considering going and buying 2 cartons of budweiser You just made my soul cry a little [crying] Get down to a bottling recycling center and fill your wheelybin with VB (cos there'll be more of them) longnecks. Job done! Whatever you decide, I'd recommend sticking to all the same bottles as it will make it so much easier in the longrun. It's just getting the first batch that's the hardest, the rest will follow. Build your bottle stash, and they will come! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PB2 Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 Minimising the headspace should reduce the chances of oxidised beer. I think I've mentioned this before, probably several years ago - there was occasion when the old bottle filler was throwing an overfilled bottle every revolution (no headspace at all). When I spotted this, my "layman brewing experience brain" rang alarm bells and I brought it to the attention of the Technical Brewer. He laughed it off saying, "our customers are getting a little bonus" ....but what about the lack of headspace preventing a proper secondary fermentation (as I was led to believe)?? Anyway, I pulled a few of the over-filled bottles off the line and checked the CO2 after 14 days - identical to that of the normal fill bottles. Well I'll be...[roll] If a brewer has nothing but glass bottles and they are planning to bottle when the brew is short of FG - the safest thing to do is fill them to the very top (virtually no headspace at all). A bottle with less headspace is less likely to become violent when opened or broken - less volume of gas to rapidly expand. [wink] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guest1525228310 Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 If a brewer has nothing but glass bottles and they are planning to bottle when the brew is short of FG - the safest thing to do is fill them to the very top (virtually no headspace at all). A bottle with less headspace is less likely to become violent when opened or broken - less volume of gas to rapidly expand. [wink] Very interesting Paul - a pearl of wisdom. I must remember that when bottling and pastuerising my next batch of cider. I will fill one to the top, don my kevlar suit and drop it in the hot pot and see if it explodes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PB2 Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 Keep in mind that liquid expands as the temperature increases. Liquid also has non-compressable (hydraulic) characterisics - so a bottle filled with no headspace at all, heated to the "crazy temps" you pasteurise at, is a "monty" for rupturing. I don't expect it to explode but the crown seal and/or bottle will fail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guest1525228310 Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 Damn scientists kill all the fun. Thanks Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 Minimising the headspace should reduce the chances of oxidised beer. I think I've mentioned this before, probably several years ago - there was occasion when the old bottle filler was throwing an overfilled bottle every revolution (no headspace at all). When I spotted this, my "layman brewing experience brain" rang alarm bells and I brought it to the attention of the Technical Brewer. He laughed it off saying, "our customers are getting a little bonus" ....but what about the lack of headspace preventing a proper secondary fermentation (as I was led to believe)?? Anyway, I pulled a few of the over-filled bottles off the line and checked the CO2 after 14 days - identical to that of the normal fill bottles. Well I'll be...[roll] If a brewer has nothing but glass bottles and they are planning to bottle when the brew is short of FG - the safest thing to do is fill them to the very top (virtually no headspace at all). A bottle with less headspace is less likely to become violent when opened or broken - less volume of gas to rapidly expand. [wink] wow totally the opposite i was lead to beleive...love this site....its official...i knew nothing .cheers all..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne (Captain Yobbo) Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 I use everything from 1.25l soft drink PET's I also use proper brewing PET's I use coopers long necks and stubbies. I use my megaswill mates donation of VB and Carlton long necks and stubbies. The only thing with the 1.25l soft drink bottles is they need to be kept in a really dark spot same goes for green bottles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordEoin Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 I would have thought that gren bottles would have enough light protection. Good to know :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotm Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 I too have a varied selection of bottle sizes. 1.25s, 740 PETs, 375s, 330s and imperial pints. I long for consistent bottle sizes or a keg setup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamD14 Posted January 6, 2013 Author Share Posted January 6, 2013 Thank you to everyone for the comprehensive replies. Just to add another extension. Has anyone successfully used hahn super dry bottles and if so how much carbonation drops per bottle. Im thinking 1 but thats seems to be sufficient for a 375ml stubbie. With hahn superdry being 330ml and me adding 1 carb drop per bottle with a difference of 45ml compared to 375ml, is that likely to cause some sort of catastrophic failure? after all i might just go get some tallies and go from there. seems to be the way forward. My only 2 reasons for not going with tallies are 1. i want my mates to be able to drink it out of the bottle - but they will get over it. and 2. I dont have any yet. whereas i have an entire bin full of hahn bottles. all feedback will be appreciated. Thanks again guys. Adam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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