Beerlust Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 Hi guys. I've been thinking about this beer again lately. I did get around to brewing something along these lines back in August last year. That version used a hop or two I thought might be in the Beechworth Pale, & some I'd heard might be in a very popular beer known as the Punk IPA made by BrewDog over in Scotland. Anyways the hops I used where Ahtanum, Nelson Sauvin, Columbus, & Ella. A combo I'd never used before. Two of those hops I'd never used at all. It turned out really well. Very different than the pales I usually make. It was certainly heading in the right direction, but not quite the same as the Beechworth Pale Ale. Time for another crack. The malt bill I used was fine without being an exact. I've locked Ella in as a keeper, so perhaps time to look at some other possibilities. Through hunting hard fought info on this beer, lychee came up as one of the descriptors. So Citra is in. I'm thinking Amarillo & possibly Simcoe as well. The New Zealand hop is a little harder, but I may stick with Nelson Sauvin, or possibly shift to Motueka in the dry hop. There's some other sneaky NZ ones worth looking at also, so may add something completely different to those two. Will be dry hopping this time with 3-4 hops to at least 100gms. It's a very aromatic beer above all else so this element needs to be pushed. I'm actually going to contact the brewery tomorrow & see if they will be kind enough to release some info on the hops used. Fingers crossed. Looking forward to doing a batch of this again. Lusty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porschemad911 Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 Good luck with the brewery. I don't understand why some won't just send you the full recipe. I'm fortunate enough that the head brewer from my local brewpub will send me his Promash reports. I'm curious, out of the hops you listed (Ella, Citra, Amarillo, Simcoe, Nelson Sauvin and Motueka), which ones have you done a single-hop beer on to 'get to know intimately'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerlust Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 Hi John. I'm curious' date=' out of the hops you listed (Ella, Citra, Amarillo, Simcoe, Nelson Sauvin and Motueka), which ones have you done a single-hop beer on to 'get to know intimately'?[/quote'] Excluding Simcoe, all of them. That said, I've used Simcoe in a number of ways among other hops to understand it pretty well too. What can I say, hops are 'my thing'. Good luck with your Amarillo dry hopped fresh wort brew, it's sounds pretty nice! P.S. Pacers fan right? Michael Jordan made a mess of every team he played against in his era. The Pacers were just one. Thought you might like these relating to probably their most notable player in the modern era... Cheers, Lusty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 Reggie Miller had the talk but unfortunately he wasn't even the best player in his own family Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICzed Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 I'm actually going to contact the brewery tomorrow & see if they will be kind enough to release some info on the hops used. Hey Lusty' date=' good luck with the brew. If you want to try and get some info on the hop schedule you can send Bridge Road founder Ben Kraus a tweet @NakedNed - even if he doesn't give you the whole list he might point you in the right direction. Recently they released a brew intended for the European market under the moniker "Lost Valley" called Hopfen Kopfen which uses Topaz & Galaxy and it's a brilliant beer. Ben gave me the hop info via twitter [img']cool[/img] https://bridgeroadbrewers.com.au/beers/special-releases/lost-valley-hopfen-kopfen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerlust Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 Thanks for the info Mark. I contacted the brewery via their online webform, so will just wait for a reply. I'm going ingredient shopping tomorrow, so if I don't hear back before then I'll just go with my own gut feeling for a hop schedule for this weeks brew. Given the secrecy around the recipe, out of respect, I didn't ask for it. I simply asked if they would be kind enough to disclose all the hops used in the brew, & a gram per litre ratio used for the dry hop. Coopers openly disclose the hops used for their Vintage Ale each year, so I didn't feel I'd be asking for too much from Bridge Road by asking the same. It's one thing to know the hops being used, it's another thing to know how they are used. Reggie Miller had the talk but unfortunately he wasn't even the best player in his own family Yep' date=' poor Ol' Reggie, always second best. [img']sad[/img] No wonder he raged so hard, so often! Cheers, Lusty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porschemad911 Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 Reggie Miller had the talk but unfortunately he wasn't even the best player in his own family Haha yes that honour went to Cheryl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porschemad911 Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 Thanks for the links Lusty' date=' I've seen the doco but never watched the first 2. Will do so now over dinner while my wife's out at night classes (a red curry beef I whipped up yesterday, partnered with a Sierra Nevada Hop Hunter). Excluding Simcoe, all of them. If I could trouble you, would you care to share your findings? I could (should) search, but you have a lot of posts to go through Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waylon Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 Yu sick mongrel did you just shoot that little fur ball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porschemad911 Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 Haha no he's alive and well, his fur's even longer now to combat the Canberra winter cold though. It's just about touching the floor when he's standing up now! He's just catching some rare (these days) sunny rays. He's a stray that slept on my front doormat from day 1 after my wife and I moved in in March last year. His owners moved to the coast a few years ago, so we adopted him and he lived a happy life of leisure until my wife decided that he needed company and adopted another little furry from the RSPCA. He's a laid-back, affectionate guy. She on the other hand is a bit of a monster ... but very cute! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porschemad911 Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 Good luck with your Amarillo dry hopped fresh wort brew' date=' it's sounds pretty nice! [img']cool[/img] Well I just took a gravity reading - it's down to 1.007 so should be right to bottle this weekend. Your Mosaic Amber tasted nicer though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerlust Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 I must admit, I am amazed at the attenuation some of you guys get. I struggle to get any of my brews below 1.010. Probably because of the malt bases I use. On the hop query porschemad, the descriptors of the hops are pretty accurate in the bulk of my uses with a lot of hop varieties. The real key to getting what you want from them in your beer, is where to use them & how much of them to use to create the flavours & aromas you want. It's really about the questions you ask yourself, & what you want from the hop(s). For instance, something you might seek from a hop is a citrus presence. OK, so a couple of questions you need to then ask yourself (among numerous) are... What type of citrus presence do I want? Orange, lemon, lime, tangerine etc. etc. Where do I want that citrus presence to present in the beer? As a background flavour, a forward flavour, as an aroma, or as a dominant constant throughout the beer. Answering those two questions will give you an idea about where & how much of a said hop you should be using in various parts of the boil, if at all. Hops often have multiple attributes. Some when used in the boil can present other characteristics that don't present if say only dry hopping for aroma. They include things like spicy, earthy, herbal, resiny attributes. Once you understand a hop by using it at different points in the brewing cycle, you can then fully understand what YOU like most about it, & then begin to add some complexity to your beers by adding in other hops with other suitable blend-able qualities. Many of the commercial beers you buy are structured with different hops throughout the boil & dry hop phase using very different types of hops for very different reasons based on what they give a beer at those respective points in the process. Have no fear about throwing different hops together, just do a little research on those you're contemplating using beforehand. There are no real rules, bar maybe a little commonsense at times. Trying to explain the diverse nature of hops & match that with personal preferences is a near impossible thing to do, so I'm not even going to try. If starting from scratch, start your beer flavours/aromas with a hop you like, & then build some complexity in your brews by adding in new & different hops around it. Above all else, just have fun with them like I do from brew to brew. You'll seriously grow exponentially as a brewer by throwing caution to the wind sometimes, & will surprise yourself with what you are able to achieve. I might have to come up with a "Hop Triangle"! Cheers, Lusty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otto Von Blotto Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 I must admit' date=' I am amazed at the attenuation some of you guys get. [img']surprised[/img] I struggle to get any of my brews below 1.010. Probably because of the malt bases I use. I'd say that's probably what it is. Extracts can be hard to get to finish low unless you add a heap of table sugar/dextrose to it . Obviously with AG the fermentablility can be manipulated much more easily. I might have to come up with a "Hop Triangle"! Well we have a Beer Triangle and my own patented "Sanitation Triangle" so why not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 Lusty, your attenuation issues may be caused by two things: 1. Using extract tends to lead to a higher FG, and, prima facie, you have less control over the wort fermentability. 2. I recall you mentioning that you mash at 68 degrees in your partial mash beers (but I could be wrong). When I did partials I used to mash on the lower side to counter the use of extracts (around 64 degrees). My reading lead me to believe that extract is made from wort that is mashed at higher temps. Whether this is true or not I don't really know, but my practical experience tends to support the proposition that extract causes a higher FG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerlust Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 Thanks for comments on my attenuation remarks Hairy & Kelsey. Much appreciated. I am aware of how it is coming about. If you like, I've settled the base for the bulk of my recipes in the FG range of approx. 1.010 - 1.015. I found I like my beers in this FG range. Below 1.010 they start to taste thin like cat p!$$ unless they are heavily hopped. Beyond 1.014-15, they start to be a little full bodied & even 'chewy' to some extent. The liquid malt extracts are the main cause for the added body. The LME's leave more unfermentable sugars & body in the final beer due in part because they are sometimes a mixture of base malts & specialty malts, & as Hairy mentioned possibly to do with the temperatures at which they are created. If I were to use pure dry malt extract for my base, it doesn't have these specialty malt additives & is more fermentable. I have done a few brews with purely dry malt extract & it does have a higher fermentability than the liquid malt extract. Mixing 1½ - 2kg of LDM can be a PITA though so I use 1 x tin of LME as a base for all my recipes & build in a grain amount for certain flavours, then top up with dry malt extract to hit the ABV% marks I'm looking for. Interesting stuff Hairy about the wort produced for LME being mashed at a higher temperature. It does explain a few things if you look at that as being fact about LME's & their general fermentability. Slightly off topic, I experimented with mashing my grains at a lower temperature using my oven setup on my most recent brew. I aimed for a 65-66°C temp after adding the grains. Nailed it spot on! Set my oven at an unknown (but rough guide) temperature behind the starting increments of my dial temperature oven settings for the 75min mash & let it go. Pulled the mash out of the oven, & stoked it was bang on 65°C when I plunged the thermometer into the centre of the mash pot. It's only a partial mash brew, but I'll be interested to see how it might affect final attenuation. Cheers, Lusty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerlust Posted August 28, 2015 Share Posted August 28, 2015 Hi guys. 3-4 weeks ago I contacted the Bridge Road Brewery in an effort to find out the hops used in the Beechworth Pale Ale. The Owner/Head Brewer Ben Kraus was kind enough to get back to me a little earlier today. Unfortunately for me/us, as I suspected, he is not about to disclose those hops used anytime soon. Here is what he did say... Hi Anthony sorry for the delay on this. My advice is to find 3 or 4 hops that you like the profile of and begin blending them to achieve what you want in your pale ale. I would recommend that you forget old school brewing techniques of bittering additions and don’t use any kettle additions and add all your hops at whirlpool and dry hop. I hope this puts you on the right path. Cheers Ben There's only one way I know how to respond to something like that... ...Challenge accepted Ben. I've got a planned Kolsch I'm brewing this Sunday that I'm going to pound with about 200gms of hops. After that' date=' I might start putting some serious time into making something like this beer. Cheers, Lusty.[/size'] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben 10 Posted August 28, 2015 Share Posted August 28, 2015 I would recommend that you forget old school brewing techniques of bittering additions and don’t use any kettle additions and add all your hops at whirlpool and dry hop. I wonder if that is whirpool then cool? Or let steep for a bit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerlust Posted August 28, 2015 Share Posted August 28, 2015 I wonder if that is whirpool then cool? Or let steep for a bit? It would all be a matter of AA% vs time vs temperature. A certain weight of hops held at a temperature between boiling & 80°C for a set time to achieve the IBU target. The whirlpooling at the time really is incidental' date=' & is more about the process of forcing the break material into the centre of the boiler is it not? It just happens to coincide with being a perfect time to add these hops as the wort begins to taper away from boiling temperature. The commercial breweries would know exactly how long their processes allow the wort to stay above 80°C after flameout, so can then easily determine the amount of hops they require to hit the target IBU for this steeping/whirlpooling period. It's not a process easily achieved with small volume boils, given the sheer amount of hops required at that post flameout point to achieve a decent amount of bitterness from them, as the amount of wort lost to hop absorption does become a factor. I've actually gone back to making decent sized hop tea's for purely those flameout type additions, with good results. If I ever decided to make a beer as suggested by Ben Kraus with no traditional bittering additions in the boil, given my current equipment, I'd have to make a very large hop tea. [img']wink[/img] And I might just do that as an experiment in an attempt to make something like this beer. Cheers, Lusty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben 10 Posted August 28, 2015 Share Posted August 28, 2015 The whirlpooling at the time really is incidental' date=' & is more about the process of forcing the break material into the centre of the boiler is it not?It just happens to coincide with being a perfect time to add these hops as the wort begins to taper away from boiling temperature. [/quote'] Yep, and I think it has - for homebrewers - just become a replaceable name for flameout. After my next hop buy I will give this a go for sure. Example 30g of Ella and 30g of Topaz in a flameout for 20 minutes gives me - going by beersmith - 29 ibu. That's only 60g of hops and I have added way more at flameout before. More reason for you to go all grain lust man!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RepSpec Posted May 11, 2017 Share Posted May 11, 2017 *throws on mining hat and grabs shovel* Sorry for the thread mining guys, but this beer is what i want to make. The bridge road pale ale. I am curious (and have read this thread many times), has anyone come even close, or has any more information about this wonderful drop and how to make it? It seems like late additions of hop and lots of them id imagine...but which ones????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerlust Posted May 11, 2017 Share Posted May 11, 2017 Hi RepSpec. Bridge Road are very secretive about the hops they use in their Beechworth Pale Ale. All that is disclosed is that the beer is very aromatic & is dry hopped with a combination of US & NZ based hops. Apart from the hopping technique info I provided over in your "Putting flavour into beer" thread that came straight from the horses mouth, the only other thing I can add is that the beer is quite floral, so I would be looking to use at least 2 hops that are categorized as having a forward floral note among the likely 4 or more hop varieties that the commercial brew probably uses. A fairly uncomplicated malt bill, lots of late hopping, & a clean finishing ale yeast. After that it is down to a bit of trial & error. Cheers & good luck, Lusty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RepSpec Posted May 12, 2017 Share Posted May 12, 2017 thanks lusty...it will be the beer after next so i will try keep you posted. Did you manage to get close after the thread died off, or did you give up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben 10 Posted May 12, 2017 Share Posted May 12, 2017 I have made a pale with only whirlpool and dry hopping and it turned out great. I was also looking at cloning one day but don't do that and just brew whatever I want with whatever hop I have on hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerlust Posted May 12, 2017 Share Posted May 12, 2017 thanks lusty...it will be the beer after next so i will try keep you posted. Did you manage to get close after the thread died off' date=' or did you give up?[/quote'] In August 2014 I put together a hybrid of sorts of some of the hops that are used in the Brew Dog Punk IPA (obtained from the Brew Dog - DIY Dog), & possibly what I thought might be in the Beechworth Pale Ale. I used a combination of Ahtanum, Columbus, Ella, & Nelson Sauvin. The notes I took from that beer... "Yeast pitched @ 20.8°C. Fermented @ 18-20°C. Very nice. Floral with light tropical citrus & apricot notes. Nice fluffy white head & lovely glass lacing. Good bead. Nice aroma. Amplify it! Play around with this combo again. Maybe use the Nelson for smoother bittering, & up the late additions. Quite unique flavours & aromas. Perhaps pump some more citrus into the flavour zone with Cascade or Citra? 4½ stars." Was it a clone of the Beechworth Pale Ale, no, & it was never meant to be. Was it floral like the Beechworth Pale Ale, yes. From what I learned from that beer I adapted to a Galaxy/Ella Kolsch & my Midstrength Nirvana recipe that also attained 4½ - 5 stars. I'm pretty hard on rating my beers, & only a handful of beers have attained a 4½ star or better rating in the 150+ beers I've brewed since I got back into homebrewing beer some 6 years or so ago. Cheers, Lusty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.