Bottling Big

[SHunt]

Hey Everyone,

Like a lot of people when i did my first brew approx 2 years ago I used the plastic coopers bottles. I promptly discarded those and started bottling glass stubbies. After getting signs of RSI in my wrist from bottling (and drinking) all those bottles I got myself a few cartons of coopers longnecks and started rebottling in those which has been great.

Now I have my third child, I fear free time for bottling will disappear quickly. I'd love to keg but that would involve another fridge and pretty big initial financial outlay and spare time to work it all out to get started properly which i don't really have at the moment.

To get me through this busy time in my life, I want to bottle at least one or two 'big bottles' that i can pop open if i have a mate over or if I'm just feeling thirsty on the weekend. I've looked into growlers but don't think they will handle secondary fermentation.

What's the biggest 'bottle' you have bottled in? is there anything bigger than long necks that works ok?

i was thinking of picking up something like a 4L screw top keg/growler like this.

Or do i just stop avoiding the inevitable and get a keg system? maybe something like this?

Thoughts appreciated.

[Classic Brewing Co]

38 minutes ago, SHunt said:

Hey Everyone,

Like a lot of people when i did my first brew approx 2 years ago I used the plastic coopers bottles. I promptly discarded those and started bottling glass stubbies. After getting signs of RSI in my wrist from bottling (and drinking) all those bottles I got myself a few cartons of coopers longnecks and started rebottling in those which has been great.

Now I have my third child, I fear free time for bottling will disappear quickly. I'd love to keg but that would involve another fridge and pretty big initial financial outlay and spare time to work it all out to get started properly which i don't really have at the moment.

To get me through this busy time in my life, I want to bottle at least one or two 'big bottles' that i can pop open if i have a mate over or if I'm just feeling thirsty on the weekend. I've looked into growlers but don't think they will handle secondary fermentation.

What's the biggest 'bottle' you have bottled in? is there anything bigger than long necks that works ok?

i was thinking of picking up something like a 4L screw top keg/growler like this.

Or do i just stop avoiding the inevitable and get a keg system? maybe something like this?

Thoughts appreciated.

The Keg Guru's on this forum are more qualified to answer than me, however the dual system looks great but would would still need 2 x gas bottles & of course gas. 

It all depends on what you want to spend I guess.

Good Luck.

[Dozer71]

48 minutes ago, SHunt said:

 

What's the biggest 'bottle' you have bottled in? is there anything bigger than long necks that works ok?

i was thinking of picking up something like a 4L screw top keg/growler like this.

Or do i just stop avoiding the inevitable and get a keg system? maybe something like this?

Thoughts appreciated.

Can use soft drink bottles as they can handle the pressure -coke used to have 3 litre ones at one stage, however need to keep them out of the light the entire time to stop skunking.

Those mini-kegs/growlers can be multi-use. Fill them and ferment in them, then pour into a glass, or connect into a keg system like in the bottom link. The kegs in the 2 links are essentially the same, the bottom one just has the screw in ball lock cap for gas and dispensing. Even with 2 kegs, you only need one gas bottle, just run a T junction in the gas line to feed both. 

[thebeerpig]

Many years ago when we went on a lot of camping/fishing/lotsofdrinking trips we used to bottle our camping homebrew in straight sided 2 litre payless softdrink bottles. They were very handy because we could fit a lot more beer in our Esky’s using them, could freeze water in some to keep the beer cold, and drink the ice water in the mornings when we were afflicted with the “dry horrors”. They seemed to stay gassed up for a very long time and don’t break when dropped.

[Journeyman]

1 hour ago, SHunt said:

Now I have my third child, I fear free time for bottling will disappear quickly. I'd love to keg but that would involve another fridge and pretty big initial financial outlay and spare time to work it all out to get started properly which i don't really have at the moment.

To get me through this busy time in my life, I want to bottle at least one or two 'big bottles' that i can pop open if i have a mate over or if I'm just feeling thirsty on the weekend. I've looked into growlers but don't think they will handle secondary fermentation.

There are growlers that easily handle the pressure - look for the stainless ones and preferably double walled like this one - 40 psi rated so easily hold pressure. https://www.keg-king.com.au/ultimate-growler-2-litre.html

re: kegs. If you can afford it, going kegs will give you MORE time for the kids and normal life things. Bottling takes TIME! From cleaning through to carbing and capping, those are hours you don't need to spend. I'm presuming you brew K&K (Kit & Kilo) beers at present - with kegs you can have a brew in the FV in and hour and a week or so later spend 10 minutes kegging it.

Those little kegs seem like a good idea but I think you'd wind up need to brew quite often and it would be awkward because of the size issue. 2 x 5L is a craft kit size so most of the cheaper options like Coopers cans are oversized for brewing small amounts.  Of course you could get 5 of them - 5 so you can fill 4 with a full sized (20L) brew then when 3 have run out you can fill 4 again with the next brew.

Fridges can be very cheap or even free - ideally an upside down one for kegs means you're not bending and lifting and the taps are at human height. I have an all-fridge 375L for FV's which can have 2 FV's in there and a keg fridge that can hold at least 5 kegs. Something that size means you can put in a day of brewing and wind up with 4 kegs of beer ready to go in a week or even just a day if you fast carb them.

Expense-wise, sites like cheekpeakbrewery;com;au have kits so you can just add to your fridge - makes things much cheaper than buying a new set up like the Kegland ones. They are also great for advice. 

[Otto Von Blotto]

Kegs are a huge time saver. Next Saturday I have two batches to do, it'll probably take me about half an hour all up. If I was still bottling it'd probably be closer to two hours. Plus the cleaning time is a lot less too. But yeah the initial cost can be an issue. 

[ozdevil]

26 minutes ago, Otto Von Blotto said:

Kegs are a huge time saver. Next Saturday I have two batches to do, it'll probably take me about half an hour all up. If I was still bottling it'd probably be closer to two hours. Plus the cleaning time is a lot less too. But yeah the initial cost can be an issue. 

@SHunt i agree with   otto Von blotto,  kegging is a time saver and less messy.

get yourself a kegerator   kegland have  2 types of  kegeraters  series x  and the series x plus

series X  holds 4 kegs  up to 4 taps 

4 taps +kegerator = $743 apprrox
3 taps + kegerator= $663.75 approx 
2 taps+ kegerator = $614.50 approx
1 tap + kegerator =  $539.30 approx

series x plus holds 8 kegs upto 8 taps
will cost  just for the kegerator  $799.95



if you get a series x   with 2 tap font  for example you will still have room for stubbies and can
""     ""      ""  series x plus   with 4 or 6 tap for example again you plenty of room for  stubbies and cans


the good thing with kegging you still can bottle a the great thing is  you can  use a  counter pressure bottle filler 
i use a tap cooler   which clicks into my taps and then a gas line to tap cooler and fill and cap the desired bottle you want to fill from grolers to stubbies
for the take away.

it may cost you a bit to set up initially but in the long run it will save you time  and effort

Edited July 24, 2021 by ozdevil

[Stickers]

i haven't filled a bottle since switching to kegs just under three months ago. kegs are easy to clean, quick to fill, you get consistent carbonation through the whole batch, co2 is relatively cheap and no more mucking around with priming sugars. and your beer is good to go within days too

[SHunt]

9 hours ago, thebeerpig said:

 straight sided 2 litre payless softdrink bottles. They were very handy because we could fit a lot more beer in our Esky’s using them, could freeze water in some to keep the beer cold, and drink the ice water in the mornings when we were afflicted with the “dry horrors”.

Love this idea for next time i want to take my brew on the road. I went camping over christmas and really missed the home brew........

[SHunt]

8 hours ago, Journeyman said:

There are growlers that easily handle the pressure - look for the stainless ones and preferably double walled like this one - 40 psi rated so easily hold pressure. https://www.keg-king.com.au/ultimate-growler-2-litre.html

...

Those little kegs seem like a good idea but I think you'd wind up need to brew quite often and it would be awkward because of the size issue. 2 x 5L is a craft kit size so most of the cheaper options like Coopers cans are oversized for brewing small amounts.  Of course you could get 5 of them - 5 so you can fill 4 with a full sized (20L) brew then when 3 have run out you can fill 4 again with the next brew.

...

Expense-wise, sites like cheekpeakbrewery;com;au have kits so you can just add to your fridge - makes things much cheaper than buying a new set up like the Kegland ones. They are also great for advice. 

Thanks.. I was afraid the general consensus would push me towards kegs however i do like those stainless steel growlers. I take your point re the small kegs i was just thinking that way as i could make the space on the weekend to chuck one in out fridge but the way you describe it make it seem a bit more work than it's worth..

Those cheekpeak brewery kits look good. the most simple i have seen so far.  I think ill give that a crack with the two tap system provided i can find a cheap fridge.

7 hours ago, Otto Von Blotto said:

Kegs are a huge time saver. Next Saturday I have two batches to do, it'll probably take me about half an hour all up. If I was still bottling it'd probably be closer to two hours. Plus the cleaning time is a lot less too. But yeah the initial cost can be an issue. 

yep 2 hrs sounds about right. 1 hr to clean and 1 hr to bottle:(

7 hours ago, ozdevil said:

@SHunt i agree with   otto Von blotto,  kegging is a time saver and less messy.

get yourself a kegerator   kegland have  2 types of  kegeraters  series x  and the series x plus

series X  holds 4 kegs  up to 4 taps 

4 taps +kegerator = $743 apprrox
3 taps + kegerator= $663.75 approx 
2 taps+ kegerator = $614.50 approx
1 tap + kegerator =  $539.30 approx

series x plus holds 8 kegs upto 8 taps
will cost  just for the kegerator  $799.95

if you get a series x   with 2 tap font  for example you will still have room for stubbies and can
""     ""      ""  series x plus   with 4 or 6 tap for example again you plenty of room for  stubbies and cans

the good thing with kegging you still can bottle a the great thing is  you can  use a  counter pressure bottle filler 
i use a tap cooler   which clicks into my taps and then a gas line to tap cooler and fill and cap the desired bottle you want to fill from grolers to stubbies
for the take away.

it may cost you a bit to set up initially but in the long run it will save you time  and effort

I like the look of the kegerator but you still need to get kegs on top which pushes the price up plus if i get a dedicated beer dispensing fridge my wife would go bonkers. i think if i get a normal fridge and dedicate freezer space to the family i'd be on to a winner.

 

 

Thanks heaps everyone. Coke bottles and kegs coming my way...... lol

[Aussiekraut]

20 hours ago, ozdevil said:

4 taps +kegerator = $743 apprrox
3 taps + kegerator= $663.75 approx 
2 taps+ kegerator = $614.50 approx
1 tap + kegerator =  $539.30 approx

 

This is only half the story though. You have to add $105 per keg (new at Kegland), $70 per (filled) gas bottle and don't forget freight. That alone was close to $150. All up, I paid close to $1250 for the lot. And I have another 3 kegs on order, which is another $350 including shipping.

However the time saving huge. I cleaned and sanitised two kegs and filled them up in all up maybe 45 minutes, instead of soaking and rinsing around 100 bottles, then sanitise them, bottle them and find storage space for them. Bottling double batches on a Saturday was an almost all day job (waiting times included). 

[Journeyman]

13 hours ago, SHunt said:

i think if i get a normal fridge and dedicate freezer space to the family i'd be on to a winner.

Don't forget you can also put things other than beer... *pause for horrified gasps from audience* in the fridge, from soft drink in a keg to cider or mixed drinks for SWMBO. That can be a deal-maker for any objections. e.g. you could do 2 beer kegs, lemonade and (say) Bacardi and coke all on tap.

[Journeyman]

59 minutes ago, Aussiekraut said:

You have to add $105 per keg (new at Kegland), $70 per (filled) gas bottle

@SHunt- Cheekypeakbrewery have very good reconditioned kegs at $75 each. Lid and posts all new. Your initial gas bottle will be over $100 for the 1st time because you're buying bottle and gas. After that the refills are significantly cheaper, sometimes as low as $50 depending on where you are. Also, I've been kegging for 16 months and gone through 1 x 6 kg bottle in that time.

You can also get hired bottles from BOC agents where you get the bottle (full) and 1 x refill per year for (I think) about $75. I bought mine before I heard about it but given my usage it wouldn't have been such a good deal for me but depending how many mates come to help you empty kegs...

One hint I saw just recently was possibly getting refills from a local FES (fire equipment ) place - they usually have CO2 on hand. AFAIK it should be OK for brews but I haven't looked into it yet. 

1 very good hint I got early was, get a 6 kg bottle for normal use and a 2.6 kg one to swap in while you get the big one refilled then back out when you get home - because it ALWAYS runs out just when you need it and the shop isn't open.

Edited July 24, 2021 by Journeyman

[Classic Brewing Co]

1 hour ago, Aussiekraut said:

This is only half the story though. You have to add $105 per keg (new at Kegland), $70 per (filled) gas bottle and don't forget freight. That alone was close to $150. All up, I paid close to $1250 for the lot. And I have another 3 kegs on order, which is another $350 including shipping.

However the time saving huge. I cleaned and sanitised two kegs and filled them up in all up maybe 45 minutes, instead of soaking and rinsing around 100 bottles, then sanitise them, bottle them and find storage space for them. Bottling double batches on a Saturday was an almost all day job (waiting times included). 

That's what I was thinking when I saw those prices, I can get a 3 Font Series X with room for 4 kegs for $665.00 but I could pick it up. Then I started adding everything else to the list:  

Kegs, Gas Bottle, Gas & a few other parts for siphoning etc - another $500-$600. I sold my Galaxy Note 10+ phone when I upgraded for $750.00 but decided to keep it. 

@Aussiekraut  I trust your assembly/installation was successful & you are enjoying your new toy. 

Cheers.

[Aussiekraut]

30 minutes ago, CLASSIC said:

That's what I was thinking when I saw those prices, I can get a 3 Font Series X with room for 4 kegs for $665.00 but I could pick it up. Then I started adding everything else to the list:  

Kegs, Gas Bottle, Gas & a few other parts for siphoning etc - another $500-$600. I sold my Galaxy Note 10+ phone when I upgraded for $750.00 but decided to keep it. 

@Aussiekraut  I trust your assembly/installation was successful & you are enjoying your new toy. 

Cheers.

Working on it. The gas side is good but I detected a leak in one of the beer lines yesterday. Force carbed 2 kegs overnight and some time in the afternoon, I'll try and pour the first glass of presumably froth  

 

[Classic Brewing Co]

Just now, Aussiekraut said:

Working on it. The gas side is good but I detected a leak in one of the beer lines yesterday. Force carbed 2 kegs overnight and some time in the afternoon, I'll try and pour the first glass of presumably froth  

 

Better send us a photo of your very first pour of froth ... I mean beer. 

[ozdevil]

1 hour ago, Aussiekraut said:

This is only half the story though. You have to add $105 per keg (new at Kegland), $70 per (filled) gas bottle and don't forget freight. That alone was close to $150. All up, I paid close to $1250 for the lot. And I have another 3 kegs on order, which is another $350 including shipping.

However the time saving huge. I cleaned and sanitised two kegs and filled them up in all up maybe 45 minutes, instead of soaking and rinsing around 100 bottles, then sanitise them, bottle them and find storage space for them. Bottling double batches on a Saturday was an almost all day job (waiting times included). 

yes , i know i only gave the figures for just fridge and fonts without kegs and gas

my thoughts are some like to source kegs else where and are happy to go second hand for good  kegs
and gas prices canvary depending on how you go about it

i would agree  the end price is alot more then  just kegerator itself.   


The thing is you dont have to get every keg at once if on a tight budget,   
i started with 1 keg even though i had a 4 tap kegerator 
then when i had the cash i brought 4 more kegs down the track

spreading the load can make it  easyier for the budget minded   to get started

Gas well i dont like giving suggestions for gas  as this can flucuate depending  on who you go through
or how you purchase your gas bottle..


for thebudget minded people 

1x 2nd had fridge for $50 or free if your lucky
2x 19litre kegs  $210 brand new (kegland)   $140 second hand (approx)
1x gas bottle $70
2x picnic/bronco taps $3.80
1x 4mm beer/gas line 10m length $6.95
2x duotight – 9.5mm (3/8”) Female x FFL Female Thread (to fit MFL $7.90
2x gas disconnects $6.40
2x liquid disconnects $6.40
1x (20 PACK) Stainless Stepless Clamp (suit 6-8mm OD) 9.5mm $5.00

comes to $366.45 using brand new kegland kegs
comes to $296.45 using 2nd hand kegs   (approx)

many ways ya can go about kegging 







 

[Hoppy81]

Kegland have these advertised but not due to be in stock until September which will probably be more like Xmas time. 

Click me

 

 

Edited July 25, 2021 by Hoppy81

[ozdevil]

22 minutes ago, Hoppy81 said:

Kegland have these advertised but not due to be in stock until September which will probably be more like Xmas time. 

Click me

 

 

another cheap way of getting into kegging

could store them in a fridge door   with the use of a pluto or picnic/bronto tap  

[Hoppy81]

1 minute ago, ozdevil said:

another cheap way of getting into kegging

could store them in a fridge door   with the use of a pluto or picnic/bronto tap  

Exactly, small reg and Sodastream bottle, bugger all of an outlay.

[ozdevil]

22 minutes ago, Hoppy81 said:

Exactly, small reg and Sodastream bottle, bugger all of an outlay.

sodastream bottles can be swap and go as well  now and alot of servo's have this facility

 

[Pickles Jones]

Does the CO2 used for beer carbonation and dispensing have to be food grade or doesn't matter.

[Aussiekraut]

34 minutes ago, ozdevil said:

sodastream bottles can be swap and go as well  now and alot of servo's have this facility

 

I thought Sodastream uses those CO2 cartridges used for cream dispensers? No?

[ozdevil]

25 minutes ago, Pickles Jones said:

Does the CO2 used for beer carbonation and dispensing have to be food grade or doesn't matter.

you should always use food grade in my thoughts  other views may vary

 

11 minutes ago, Aussiekraut said:

I thought Sodastream uses those CO2 cartridges used for cream dispensers? No?

mate  i even use the co2  16g cannister bulbs     that i buy in packs of 10
which i use  on my 5litre keg for when i want to take a keg to golf or to bbq or mates place

but yes you can use the sodastream cannisters    for brewing  in the 400g cannister

 

[Malter White]

2 hours ago, Hoppy81 said:

Kegland have these advertised but not due to be in stock until September which will probably be more like Xmas time. 

Click me

 

 

I've been waiting for these. Supposed to be available 14/7 but now been pushed out to Sept. I'm betting the Covid vaccine will be fully rolled out before these arrive.