PET bottles

[Classic Brewing Co]

2 minutes ago, ozdevil said:

you all know 

if you guys kegged  

ya wouldn't have to worry about  bottle caps  or soft pet bottles 

or cross threading the threads on pet plastic

Fair enough comment OD & I for one would love to have a 4 Font Kegerator or a Fridge system modified to kegging, however there are a few factors to consider;

1. Cost of converting to kegging
2. Available room to house the extra equipment
3. Knowledge to be learnt  as supposed to simply bottling
4. Partner objects to the whole idea

I am simply all for it & I am single, however some of the above factors prohibit me from rushing into it.

Anyway, all good, Cheers.

[ozdevil]

25 minutes ago, CLASSIC said:

Fair enough comment OD & I for one would love to have a 4 Font Kegerator or a Fridge system modified to kegging, however there are a few factors to consider;

1. Cost of converting to kegging
2. Available room to house the extra equipment
3. Knowledge to be learnt  as supposed to simply bottling
4. Partner objects to the whole idea

I am simply all for it & I am single, however some of the above factors prohibit me from rushing into it.

Anyway, all good, Cheers.

i understand mate,   i'm just fortunate to do both if i want to (mind you i only use stubbies) 

i was kinda being cheeky anyway

i think its tougher to bottle and get carbonation spot on bottling then it is kegs 

you can't fix over carbonated beer bombs when bottling like kegs

Dont worry phil ,   i'll still bottle a couple here and there through the keg


however being serious   though

becuase people are stretching the pet bottles and you don't think much of it at 1st as you dont think ya putting 
that much pressure on the pet bottles , but the more it expands  in either direction  its going to eventually have its effects and bring weakness to the pet bottle

the more softer it is the weaker the bottle is so there fore when co2 happens whether you fill from a keg or  natuarually carbonate its going to expand and harden, but it may just be one occasion the  pet might split due to that softness as its creating a weak spots  and there is no way telling when that will occur

i have seen glass stubby bottoms  come clean off due to overcarbonation..


plastic does wear and will wear quicker then glass

[Spursman]

12 hours ago, ozdevil said:

i understand mate,   i'm just fortunate to do both if i want to (mind you i only use stubbies) 

i was kinda being cheeky anyway

i think its tougher to bottle and get carbonation spot on bottling then it is kegs 

you can't fix over carbonated beer bombs when bottling like kegs

Dont worry phil ,   i'll still bottle a couple here and there through the keg


however being serious   though

becuase people are stretching the pet bottles and you don't think much of it at 1st as you dont think ya putting 
that much pressure on the pet bottles , but the more it expands  in either direction  its going to eventually have its effects and bring weakness to the pet bottle

the more softer it is the weaker the bottle is so there fore when co2 happens whether you fill from a keg or  natuarually carbonate its going to expand and harden, but it may just be one occasion the  pet might split due to that softness as its creating a weak spots  and there is no way telling when that will occur

i have seen glass stubby bottoms  come clean off due to overcarbonation..


plastic does wear and will wear quicker then glass

Interesting theory. I've been wondering whether it would be feasible to place just filled bottles into a very tight crate so as to eliminate/reduce expansion while carbonating. 

[Classic Brewing Co]

2 hours ago, Spursman said:

Interesting theory. I've been wondering whether it would be feasible to place just filled bottles into a very tight crate so as to eliminate/reduce expansion while carbonating. 

For what it's worth I can say after using PET bottles continuously for 5-6 years ( as well as other bottles )  I have never had any problems apart from chucking the odd one due to the thread wearing out or replace a few caps. If they are looked after properly & filled just below the top leaving enough room 3mm ( 1 inch ) & no more than 2 carb drops or 2 teaspoons, 4.1gms of sugar per 740/750ml bottle they will be fine.  As far as storing I guess that comes down to available space & what you have on hand. I use the original 15 bottle boxes to store most of mine as it usually works out to 2 cartons ( 30 bottles ) of the 23l brew.  Shelves, cupboards are all OK as long as you can keep them at 18 degrees or higher & out of direct sunlight/weather they are fine.

As far as carbonation goes I stopped using carb drops 6 months ago as I get a satisfactory result with white sugar.

There are a few of our regular contributors using them  with no problems & I am sure most of them would agree with me on the continued use of them.

[Journeyman]

3 hours ago, Spursman said:

Interesting theory. I've been wondering whether it would be feasible to place just filled bottles into a very tight crate so as to eliminate/reduce expansion while carbonating. 

Hmm... My guess would be: 

1. bottles are round - they will still expand so you might wind up with square bottles.

2. The expansion eases the pressure a little - preventing it might just blow the tops off. 

[Billy1525230088]

I Keg and bottle and have PET bottles that must be well over 10 years old.

These days I only bottle Ginger Beer as I have found when keging GB it is hard to get the GB flavour out of the lines, very noticeable if you carb water using the lines previously used for GB.

Never really had an issue with lids however PET bottles are plastic and wear. I have had some of the older bottles leak when carbing. I have filled them with water and the don't leak so they start with a very fine pin hold which leaks under pressure. Have had some that are only 1/4 full when I discover they are leaking.

Suggest if your bottles are old and well used store them somewhere that the missus will not go off at you if they leak.

[Spursman]

5 hours ago, Billy1525230088 said:

I Keg and bottle and have PET bottles that must be well over 10 years old.

These days I only bottle Ginger Beer as I have found when keging GB it is hard to get the GB flavour out of the lines, very noticeable if you carb water using the lines previously used for GB.

Never really had an issue with lids however PET bottles are plastic and wear. I have had some of the older bottles leak when carbing. I have filled them with water and the don't leak so they start with a very fine pin hold which leaks under pressure. Have had some that are only 1/4 full when I discover they are leaking.

Suggest if your bottles are old and well used store them somewhere that the missus will not go off at you if they leak.

Good point Billy, haven't had any leak yet and I'm absolutely sure the house CEO will let me know if they do!

[Spursman]

21 hours ago, CLASSIC said:

For what it's worth I can say after using PET bottles continuously for 5-6 years ( as well as other bottles )  I have never had any problems apart from chucking the odd one due to the thread wearing out or replace a few caps. If they are looked after properly & filled just below the top leaving enough room 3mm ( 1 inch ) & no more than 2 carb drops or 2 teaspoons, 4.1gms of sugar per 740/750ml bottle they will be fine.  As far as storing I guess that comes down to available space & what you have on hand. I use the original 15 bottle boxes to store most of mine as it usually works out to 2 cartons ( 30 bottles ) of the 23l brew.  Shelves, cupboards are all OK as long as you can keep them at 18 degrees or higher & out of direct sunlight/weather they are fine.

As far as carbonation goes I stopped using carb drops 6 months ago as I get a satisfactory result with white sugar.

There are a few of our regular contributors using them  with no problems & I am sure most of them would agree with me on the continued use of them.

Thanks Classic. Regarding sugar levels are you recommending two teaspoons (total 8.2 gms) or just 4.1 gms per 740 bottle?

[Shamus O'Sean]

54 minutes ago, Spursman said:

Thanks Classic. Regarding sugar levels are you recommending two teaspoons (total 8.2 gms) or just 4.1 gms per 740 bottle?

@CLASSIC is recommending 2 teaspoons per 740ml bottle.  Each teaspoon holds 4.1g of table sugar.  So, yes: Total 8.2g of sugar per bottle.

I use 1 and a 1/2 teaspoons in my PET's.  That works out just a shade more than the 6g you get from 2 carb drops (about 3g each).

[Classic Brewing Co]

44 minutes ago, Shamus O'Sean said:

@CLASSIC is recommending 2 teaspoons per 740ml bottle.  Each teaspoon holds 4.1g of table sugar.  So, yes: Total 8.2g of sugar per bottle.

I use 1 and a 1/2 teaspoons in my PET's.  That works out just a shade more than the 6g you get from 2 carb drops (about 3g each).

Actually @Shamus O'Sean I would not like to mislead anybody & I am happy to stand corrected, I have just checked my Sugar measure with the Digital scales & although I have been using the larger funnel for all of my bottles, 740/750/450/500 ml the scoop weight varies each time.

I have just done a few tests.  It is very hard to get an exact 4.1gms per scoop as after 5-6 tries the weight varied from 4 to 5gms in different increments so I guess I have to say I am really only using 1 teaspoon of sugar per bottle. I get sufficient carbonation with this for all of the brews.

So @Spursman  I am sorry to misinform you but I am definitely using one scoop of the larger funnel of the sugar measure.

[ozdevil]

50 minutes ago, CLASSIC said:

Actually @Shamus O'Sean I would not like to mislead anybody & I am happy to stand corrected, I have just checked my Sugar measure with the Digital scales & although I have been using the larger funnel for all of my bottles, 740/750/450/500 ml the scoop weight varies each time.

I have just done a few tests.  It is very hard to get an exact 4.1gms per scoop as after 5-6 tries the weight varied from 4 to 5gms in different increments so I guess I have to say I am really only using 1 teaspoon of sugar per bottle. I get sufficient carbonation with this for all of the brews.

So @Spursman  I am sorry to misinform you but I am definitely using one scoop of the larger funnel of the sugar measure.

@CLASSIC you need to cut  the coke a bit finer and set a few lines    and you would be better of rolling up a $50 note  or a small straw to fit  in ya nose to sniff it up  , unless you have big nostrels  

Sorry i couldnt help myself as my screen at the time only showed the scales with sugar on it and reminds of someone weighing up abit of coke  to sniff

[Classic Brewing Co]

I wouldn't know about any of that, I can get into enough trouble drinking beer !

[Spursman]

2 hours ago, Shamus O'Sean said:

@CLASSIC is recommending 2 teaspoons per 740ml bottle.  Each teaspoon holds 4.1g of table sugar.  So, yes: Total 8.2g of sugar per bottle.

I use 1 and a 1/2 teaspoons in my PET's.  That works out just a shade more than the 6g you get from 2 carb drops (about 3g each).

Thanks Shamus.

[Spursman]

17 minutes ago, ozdevil said:

@CLASSIC you need to cut  the coke a bit finer and set a few lines    and you would be better of rolling up a $50 note  or a small straw to fit  in ya nose to sniff it up  , unless you have big nostrels  

Sorry i couldnt help myself as my screen at the time only showed the scales with sugar on it and reminds of someone weighing up abit of coke  to sniff

Thanks Classic.  Does the amount of time between carbing and drinking have any effect on the amount of sugar required? I drink mine 2 to 3 weeks after bottling? 

[Classic Brewing Co]

1 minute ago, Spursman said:

Thanks Classic.  Does the amount of time between carbing and drinking have any effect on the amount of sugar required? I drink mine 2 to 3 weeks after bottling? 

In my case 2 weeks is the minimum time I would start trying any brews, in a lot of cases they are better off left for 4,5,6 weeks or even longer. It can depend on the type of brew but generally the rule of thumb is the longer it has had time to carbonate, it will taste a whole lot better. I try to stagger mine out & carefully note the maturing times on each brew, that way I always have a variety.

Some say if you are going to leave them for a longer period, say 6-12 months or so you would use less sugar or 1 carb drop instead of 2.

[iBooz2]

2 hours ago, CLASSIC said:

 

 

Phil, you want to get yourself some of these mini Decor food containers if you don't have already.  I think I got them from Coles or Woolies, come in sets of 6 I think.

They are perfect for weighing out hops. whirlfloc granules and water salts etc.  Just stick the empty container on the scale minus the lid, tare it, then add your stuff to desired weight.

Way better than ingredients flying all over the shop and having to clean it up plus keeps your scales nice and clean not to mention sanitation risk from having to wash / wipe the scales down between different ingredients and batches.  I keep the lids on mine when in storage and always use the green ones for hops and the white ones for salts etc.

[Shamus O'Sean]

3 hours ago, CLASSIC said:

Actually @Shamus O'Sean I would not like to mislead anybody & I am happy to stand corrected, I have just checked my Sugar measure with the Digital scales & although I have been using the larger funnel for all of my bottles, 740/750/450/500 ml the scoop weight varies each time.

I have just done a few tests.  It is very hard to get an exact 4.1gms per scoop as after 5-6 tries the weight varied from 4 to 5gms in different increments so I guess I have to say I am really only using 1 teaspoon of sugar per bottle. I get sufficient carbonation with this for all of the brews.

So @Spursman  I am sorry to misinform you but I am definitely using one scoop of the larger funnel of the sugar measure.

No worries, I stand corrected. 

@Spursman, read what Classic said and ignore me. 

[Malter White]

Feeling rather crushed and unloved at the moment. Not one person has recommended the Muzzy method (Trademark, copyrights and patents pending) as a carbonation suggestion ie. 1 carbonation drop + 1 CSR sugar cube per 750ml bottle.

[Journeyman]

14 minutes ago, MUZZY said:

per 750ml bottle

Perhaps because we've moved on from bottles?

[Breaktrainjack]

Sugar on a 45deg angle from the bottom of the tallest cut out to just a tad below the lower cut out ..give or take you can quickly calibrate your scoops accuracy

Edited June 25, 2021 by Breaktrainjack

[Breaktrainjack]

Thinking kegs next myself ..but gee i like traditional bottled beer ..you can put on em' on the back of ya bike ..take em round to ya mates ..camping you name it ..hit ya brother over the head for drinking XXXX   ..it endless  

Edited June 25, 2021 by Breaktrainjack

[Tricky Micky]

On 6/23/2021 at 3:05 PM, iBooz2 said:

You could be on to something there Mick.  I have never had a problem leaving that ring on with any of my bottles so got to wondering if its possible these bottles come out of a different roto-mold (balloon mold , however they make these things) and the neck length is different on some.  All mine are Coopers brand bought at various times, some from Coopers store some from various Dan's.

The measurement my micrometer gives me from the flat of the top to the upper edge of the ring stop flange is exactly 19.8 mm.

One roto-mold could be pumping them out at 19.8 mm and another 18.0 mm.  Or are the tops cut there at the very top by the factory to separate the newly formed bottle from the mold?

I wonder what your faulty bottle one measures?  Academic I know but just wondering.

Boozer, I don't believe it - measured the bottle I'm having issues with and another and they had different measurements from the top of the bottle to the ring where the bottom of the new cap sits. You're right there was about a 1.7 mm difference which doesn't sound like much but enough to stop the cap from tightening completely. I too had never had an issue with leaving the bottom ring of a new cap on the bottle before now. 

[iBooz2]

2 hours ago, MUZZY said:

Feeling rather crushed and unloved at the moment. Not one person has recommended the Muzzy method (Trademark, copyrights and patents pending) as a carbonation suggestion ie. 1 carbonation drop + 1 CSR sugar cube per 750ml bottle.

That's on account Mr. MUZZ, if you remember the conversation of me being your sole agent and manger and all.  Sadly I have to report that to date no funds have been forthcoming to me from others for use of your method (not that I would tell you anyway ha ha).  So until some money comes into the fund you will just have to miss out on that warm and fuzzy feeling.

[Malter White]

1 minute ago, iBooz2 said:

That's on account Mr. MUZZ, if you remember the conversation of me being your sole agent and manger and all.  Sadly I have to report that to date no funds have been forthcoming to me from others for use of your method (not that I would tell you anyway ha ha).  So until some money comes into the fund you will just have to miss out on that warm and fuzzy feeling.

I think I need a new agent.

[Classic Brewing Co]

2 hours ago, MUZZY said:

Feeling rather crushed and unloved at the moment. Not one person has recommended the Muzzy method (Trademark, copyrights and patents pending) as a carbonation suggestion ie. 1 carbonation drop + 1 CSR sugar cube per 750ml bottle.

It's all right @MUZZY I feel for you, us bottlers have to stick together, your method, although I have never tried it must work well.