All in one brewing system pros and Cons

[Bingilbeer]

Hi everyone.

  I’m looking at buying one of the all in one brewing systems.  I’m talking about Brewzilla/ robo brew,  grainfather or the Guten. I know there are others  but they do go into the very expensive side.

  Besides the Grainfather being twice as expensive as the rest, Guten does have some good deals on complete kits through keg-king and I do like the variable temperature control you get with it.

  Has anybody purchased any of these systems? If so how do you rate them, especially the Grainfather as it does cost a lot more but seems like a good package.

  Cheers to all in advance

[PaddyBrew2]

I bought a robobrew which more or less is a cheaper grain father and I haven't looked back. It paid for itself within a few brews 

[Hilltop hops]

Also have a Robobrew, had it about 12 months and no issues. 

[Shamus O'Sean]

I have a G30 style Grainfather.  I like it now that the app is working better.  When I started using it I had issues.  At the time I was thinking that the Grainfather might make a good anchor.  Our relationship has improved immensely since then.

Is it worth the programming from the app, because that is probably the main difference.  I do not have a Brewzilla to compare it.  However, watching videos of other using the Brewzilla, it seems like pretty good kit too.

A few of the brewers on here use the Guten as well.  Most of them seem pretty happy with what they have.

This probably does not help a lot.  Would I change if I had my time over?  Probably not.  However, I am a bit of a t0sser, and funds were not a massive constraint.  Those with either a Brewzilla and Guten speak very positively about their equipment.  To me that says that none of them are bad.  You might have to base your decision more on your personal situation, rather than reco's of others.

[Titan]

i have been running a grainfather for 3 years. Pro for me is being able to program a delay start to heat my strike water ready for when i get up in the morning. Con is the silicon ring on the bottom plate but have recently solved by using some olive oil rubbed around the edge.

[Bingilbeer]

8 hours ago, Shamus O'Sean said:

I have a G30 style Grainfather.  I like it now that the app is working better.  When I started using it I had issues.  At the time I was thinking that the Grainfather might make a good anchor.  Our relationship has improved immensely since then.

Is it worth the programming from the app, because that is probably the main difference.  I do not have a Brewzilla to compare it.  However, watching videos of other using the Brewzilla, it seems like pretty good kit too.

A few of the brewers on here use the Guten as well.  Most of them seem pretty happy with what they have.

This probably does not help a lot.  Would I change if I had my time over?  Probably not.  However, I am a bit of a t0sser, and funds were not a massive constraint.  Those with either a Brewzilla and Guten speak very positively about their equipment.  To me that says that none of them are bad.  You might have to base your decision more on your personal situation, rather than reco's of others.

The Grainfather seems like a really good unit and it does do well in the video reviews and comparisons on the net. It was more the price compared to the others.

I do like that it comes with its own counter flow chiller and the app/ wifi is something I like.
I also like all the other attachments that you can get for the Grainfather as well, so I probably have already sold myself on the Grainfather.

I recently sold my house so I have some cash to throw around and was looking for people views on these all in one systems before I went ahead and bought one.

 

[Bingilbeer]

2 hours ago, Titan said:

i have been running a grainfather for 3 years. Pro for me is being able to program a delay start to heat my strike water ready for when i get up in the morning. Con is the silicon ring on the bottom plate but have recently solved by using some olive oil rubbed around the edge.

When you bought the Grainfather was there any extras that you needed to buy or was it a complete kit ready to go?

[Aussiekraut]

I've been using a Guten 40l since November. Probably made about 25 batches in it so far and can't complain at all. IMHO, it is a cost effective way to get into AG brewing and makes life fairly easy. The results are good and besides one little accident (the bottom screen of the malt tube fell out when I lifted the tube out), I haven't had any problems with it. 

But as Shamus said, there are a few very similar devices out there, none of them bad, and at the end of the day, it depends on you and your situation. 

Either way, I'm sure you won't regret your choice.

[Titan]

3 hours ago, Bingilbeer said:

When you bought the Grainfather was there any extras that you needed to buy or was it a complete kit ready to go?

All good to go. Counter flow chiller included.

[Shamus O'Sean]

5 hours ago, Bingilbeer said:

When you bought the Grainfather was there any extras that you needed to buy or was it a complete kit ready to go?

Grainfether currently have an accessories kit. The kit has a mash paddle, small batch pipework, wortometer, Grainfather cleaner, and overflow filter.  Other than the filter, I bought all of the above items separately to the Grainfather. 

The only item whose use is questionable is the overflow strainer.  I did not get one, but I used one half of a mesh hop ball as a filter during one brew, but it clogged up and the main tube overflowed.  Maybe that meant it was doing what it should?

I have not looked at the value of these items as a kit compared to individually, but if you do go with the Grainfather I recommend the kit.  Some sellers even include some of those items as a package.  You might be able to negotiate a deal with a seller. 

As Titan says, the counter-flow chiller that comes with the Grainfather is ace. Using the wortometer on the outlet side, so you know the "out" temperature of the wort is great.  It was what probably sold me on the Grainfather. Many of the other systems come with an immersion chiller, but not the hoses or connectors necessary.  Plus the counter-flow chiller does a better job.

[Hairy]

Re Grainfather - you will probably need to sparge if you want a 23 litre batch. This means you will need a pot big enough to hold, say 15 litres and somewhere to heat up the water.

I have the original series model and still going strong.

I used to do 3v brewing with the esky mash tun, 50 litre pot and big gas burner. Going electric 1v was the best thing I did.

The only con is the size limitation. Great for making 23 litres of standard gravity beers but it is harder to do bigger batches or 23 litres really high gravity beers.

[Bingilbeer]

4 hours ago, Titan said:

All good to go. Counter flow chiller included.

I did see that it comes with a counter flow chiller. You can buy one separately with the Guten.

 

[Bingilbeer]

7 hours ago, Aussiekraut said:

I've been using a Guten 40l since November. Probably made about 25 batches in it so far and can't complain at all. IMHO, it is a cost effective way to get into AG brewing and makes life fairly easy. The results are good and besides one little accident (the bottom screen of the malt tube fell out when I lifted the tube out), I haven't had any problems with it. 

But as Shamus said, there are a few very similar devices out there, none of them bad, and at the end of the day, it depends on you and your situation. 

Either way, I'm sure you won't regret your choice.

Cheers aussiekraut, I have watched many a review online with all the different kits and they all seem very similar and would do the job well. Guten through keg king does give you a good price for a kit that comes with a lot of extras as well. They do sell a counter flow chiller separately.

[Bingilbeer]

9 minutes ago, Hairy said:

Re Grainfather - you will probably need to sparge if you want a 23 litre batch. This means you will need a pot big enough to hold, say 15 litres and somewhere to heat up the water.

I have the original series model and still going strong.

I used to do 3v brewing with the esky mash tun, 50 litre pot and big gas burner. Going electric 1v was the best thing I did.

The only con is the size limitation. Great for making 23 litres of standard gravity beers but it is harder to do bigger batches or 23 litres really high gravity beers.

Cheers Hairy, I read the John Palmer book like you said, the first edition at least online. I have orderEd the latest edition as I really struggle to read books that big online I would rather read a real book in front of me.

I have seen many online reviews of the all in one systems and one reviewer preheated his sparge water in his all in one system, then transferred that to an insulated esky. He just kept that to one side until sparging was required. He just preheated the sparge water a few degrees above what was required to allow for the temperature loss.

[Marty_G]

I am one who is not an advocate for "all in ones". I have never used of owned one and I know that those who have them in the main love them but i see several issues with them:

1) Versatility.  In general terms the majority of brews have the small version and they just don't have the capacity to do larger batches. As a grain brewer i have found that the ability to brew double batches is the key.  It save so much time. 

2) length of brew day.  I know many brewers who say their normal brew day is 5-6 hours with an "All in one" that is one hell of a day for a single batch. Today with my 2 vessel set up I brewed a double batch or Czech Pilsner with a 75 minute step mash with a mash out , 75 minute boil, chilled to 23c, pitched, fermenting and cleaned  with a full scrub and pressure clean with gurney. Which took 5 hours from start to finish.  A normal brew with a 60 minute mash and boil and clean is around 4 hours for a double. Cant do that with a 30 litre Grainfather.  

3)  Quality control.  I have read so many post in forums of guys who have paid top dollar for a set up only for it to be incomplete, not working or worse leaking. 

4) superseded software. These systems rely on electronics and we all now in this day electronic have a finite life. 

5) are they really "all in one" . You still need to heat the sparge water so a second vessel is needed.  

6) Pump issues. I have read a re-occuring theme of brewers have blocked pumps from hop debris. 

7) stuck sparges another of the issues that increases the time it takes to use an "all in one" It is common for brewers to have to use rice hulls in the grist to improve sparge drainage.

 

There are 7 reason why i would not get an all in one. I k now that those who have all in one will clarify each of  those issues however, they are things you need to be aware of.   

Anyway just being the devil advocate there.  

[Pezzza]

Or @Bingilbeer Bingil mate go the high road - get yourself the components - nice SS Mash Tun... Inkbird Temp Controller... heating element...  SS mesh basket or BIAB Bag... pump and hose recirc... and don't worry about all the electronics and push pad stuff.... cos you are in control of all you do ; ).      CPB have nice SS gear pumps and controllers etc... 

Edited August 22, 2020 by Bearded Burbler

[Hairy]

3 minutes ago, MartyG1525230263 said:

2) length of brew day.  I know many brewers who say their normal brew day is 5-6 hours with an "All in one" that is one hell of a day for a single batch. Today with my 2 vessel set up I brewed a double batch or Czech Pilsner with a 75 minute step mash with a mash out , 75 minute boil, chilled to 23c, pitched, fermenting and cleaned  with a full scrub and pressure clean with gurney. Which took 5 hours from start to finish.  A normal brew with a 60 minute mash and boil and clean is around 4 hours for a double. Cant do that with a 30 litre Grainfather.  

My brew day for a single batch in a 30 litre Grainfather is 4 to 4.5 hours including cleaning.

[Hairy]

9 minutes ago, Bingilbeer said:

Cheers Hairy, I read the John Palmer book like you said, the first edition at least online. I have orderEd the latest edition as I really struggle to read books that big online I would rather read a real book in front of me.

I have seen many online reviews of the all in one systems and one reviewer preheated his sparge water in his all in one system, then transferred that to an insulated esky. He just kept that to one side until sparging was required. He just preheated the sparge water a few degrees above what was required to allow for the temperature loss.

Many ways to do it.

Heating the sparge water first increases the length of the brew day. I like to heat the sparge water during the mash.

[Marty_G]

22 minutes ago, Hairy said:

My brew day for a single batch in a 30 litre Grainfather is 4 to 4.5 hours including cleaning.

Glad to read that.  I have been gob smacked where I have read forums where blokes say that 6 hours is there regular brew day for a 23 litre ferment.   

Edited August 22, 2020 by MartyG1525230263

[Marty_G]

20 minutes ago, Bearded Burbler said:

Or @Bingilbeer Bingil mate go the high road - get yourself the components - nice SS Mash Tun... Inkbird Temp Controller... heating element...  SS mesh basket or BIAB Bag... pump and hose recirc... and don't worry about all the electronics and push pad stuff.... cos you are in control of all you do ; ).      CPB have nice SS gear pumps and controllers etc... 

I agree, I have a great set up with a BIAB 2v set up with a HERMES coil in a HLT.   Bought most of the stuff of GumTree so all up with 75 litre kettle, coil, urn for HLT, 85,000 BTU burner, bag and pump. You are looking at change out of $300. Throw in the InkBird for $50 and that is a cheap set up that can brew a 50 litre ferment easily.   

[Smashed Crabs]

Depending on what you want to achieve and branch out with home brewing wise iv found my robobrew quite versatile. The extra attachments you can get also was the selling point for me but depending on what your end game is also should determine if ones for you. After trying BIAB and getting good results was a no brainer for me going to a all in one system as it suited my needs plus if you stuff up a brew with the extra attachments you will never tip or throw a bad / failed brew again.

[Norris!]

I have a Guten 50l, I can do double batches and no sparge single batches if I choose. So far it has fit my needs in brew size but if I could, I would of gotten a bigger one for ease of use for large batches and more versatility. Depends on what your needs are.

The grainfather and maybe the robobrew have a good set up with their sparge arm that is better than the Guten in the sense that you can just slide the lid up onto it and let it sit there versus the Guten I have to take the sparge arm out when stirring the mash or something. Small thing but something I noticed.

The Guten came with a chiller in the pack I got for free but it wasn't a counter flow chiller and I have never used it. I might give the nod to the GF for which cooler is better but I don't honestly know.

The app for the GF is an advantage over the Guten.

Cheeky peaks has some good systems and one of my buddies has one and he enjoys it. He says he feels like he is brewing and it is expandable. So you could get the all in one and then add to it or even go to a 2v or 3v system due to its versatility.

If I was to do it all over again, I might of went with the cheeky peak system and a triple batch one over the Guten and or any other system, just because it could have other pieces added easily. If my pump goes out on my Guten or the heater I am not sure if I can replace it or if I have to get a new system. But I do like the small footprint and the programmability on the Guten and there isn't anything that I am hating about it.

[Marty_G]

28 minutes ago, Norris! said:

If I was to do it all over again, I might of went with the cheeky peak system and a triple batch one over the Guten and or any other system, just because it could have other pieces added easily. If my pump goes out on my Guten or the heater I am not sure if I can replace it or if I have to get a new system. But I do like the small footprint and the programmability on the Guten and there isn't anything that I am hating about it.

Great post!!!!!

[Hairy]

These posts pop up fairly often and there are pros and cons for all brewing set ups.

People just need to work out what is more important to them and what works for them. I did that and made the change.

They all make decent beer (except for those BIAB guys)

[Pezzza]

42 minutes ago, Norris! said:

Cheeky peaks has some good systems and one of my buddies has one and he enjoys it. He says he feels like he is brewing and it is expandable.

Me too Norris...