Jump to content
Coopers Community

Reusing daily SG test liquid back into Fermetation Vessel


pilotsh

Recommended Posts

Hello!

About to start by first brew ever, but note that the instructions say sprinkle on yeast, then half fill the tube with liquid and discard, fill again, test specific gravity and then discard. And then near the end where you measure SG daily to discard.

Is there a reason I can't pour the liquid from each test back into the FV? And at the start, why can't I measure the SG, pour it back into the FV, then sprinkle yeast and cover?

I hate the thought of wasting good wort!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Take one sample then cover (with a breather) and sit it beside your brew. Check it every so often and when it gets to a low for a couple of days, discard it, clean the jar and take a new sample. If it's the same as the one you just chucked, you're at FG.

If your brew is in the fridge, you could even leave your sample out at ambient temps as that should ferment faster. Then you know what your brew will get down to.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I take my brew day gravity before putting any yeast in. Those instructions seem pointless to me.

I drink the samples I take and only do 3 or 4 all up. It gives me an idea of how the beer will end up, and if I'm doing a dry hop, whether I leave it the hops in an extra day or so.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yep 100% agree DO NOT put back into the FV it is an infection waiting to happen. 

Myself and many other like JM follow the procedure of taking a sample the day after the yeast has been pitched and putting it next to the FV and monitoring that.  When that is steady for 2 days and in the range of 1010+- a couple of points. It is an indication that fermentation has stopped. Then take a new sample from the fermenter and usually, well always for me, the FV will be the same.   That is a good indication that the ferment is over. After that leave for a minimum of 2 more days to allow for more settling and the yeast to clean up the non alcohol by-products of fermentation. If you have a fridge you can then cold crash it to help clarify or leave it for longer. If time is an issue you can bottle a couple of days after it has finished.  

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Journeyman said:

Take one sample then cover (with a breather) and sit it beside your brew. Check it every so often and when it gets to a low for a couple of days, discard it, clean the jar and take a new sample. If it's the same as the one you just chucked, you're at FG.

 

ok, so at the START when everything is crystal clean, can I take the starting SG, return to FV, pitch yeast and cover FV?

Then after few days, you say take a sample, but how would I cover the Coopers sample tube? Plastic wrap? And leave the floating scale in it I assume.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, pilotsh said:

ok, so at the START when everything is crystal clean, can I take the starting SG, return to FV, pitch yeast and cover FV?

Then after few days, you say take a sample, but how would I cover the Coopers sample tube? Plastic wrap? And leave the floating scale in it I assume.

 

If you have sterilised everything that would be OK, but a sample is like 100 ml. If you're taking 1 every day it adds up but 1 at the start and 1 at the end is minor compared to the risk every time you open the lid to pour stuff in there. 200 ml or a chance to turf your brew? 😄 

If it's in the fridge with the brew, I guess you could leave the thermo in there but it'll get all gunged up from the kraussen that forms even in the tube. Also the tube normally has a top on it. The Coopers one (red plastic, wide base, the top has a breather in it. My glass hydro tube top doesn't - first time I did it the bottom cap blew off - HOW I don't know given the liquid was sitting on top of it - and I had clean up in aisle 1 to do. So if you have one of those just sit the cap lightly on the tube.

Edited by Journeyman
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, Journeyman said:

 (red plastic, wide base, the top has a breather in it.

Ha, it does too! I hadn't opened the kit yet because I was waiting for my Heat Belt and Sodium Percarbonate to arrive in the mail! Can't wait to get started! 🙂

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yeah don't pour the samples back in. Not worth it. 

I don't brew from kits anymore so my original reading is taken before it even gets in the fermenter. I take a progress sample 3 days after pitching yeast, but rather than leaving it next to the fermenter I keep it out somewhere warmer so it ferments quicker (my fermenters are in fridges for temp control). I then take proper FG samples another day or two after the hydrometer stops dropping in that sample, which is usually 6 and 8 days since pitching.

All up it's about 300mL taken but it's not an issue really. I make 21 litre batches and use 19 litre kegs, so that extra litre or two just gets tipped anyway. Not really losing anything by taking the samples. The original sample is also taken from dregs that get tipped so not part of the final batch.

That's for ales. Lagers I do the same but with slightly longer timeframes. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Refractometer will solve the issue of 1st sample. $25 ebay and it can be used during the ferment with a correction factor for fermenting wort. Many brewers use a fast ferment method for a sample taken once the actual ferment is at its peak. Sample is taken and put in the warmest environment you can find. The sample ferments out much quicker than the real brew but it gives you the fg you should expect for the beer in the fv.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 minutes ago, Titan said:

Many brewers use a fast ferment method for a sample taken once the actual ferment is at its peak. Sample is taken and put in the warmest environment you can find. The sample ferments out much quicker than the real brew but it gives you the fg you should expect for the beer in the fv.

I like this idea, thank you for mentioning it! 🙂

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Otto Von Blotto said:

Yeah don't pour the samples back in. Not worth it. 

If it’s a brew recipe that I have made before and my ingredients or technique has not changed I don’t take an OG.  My notes tell me what the last one, or average over a couple OG’s was.

If it’s a new brew recipe I take my first sample just prior to pitching, it is then recorded with a photo and the sample is normally discarded as it will have little or no yeast in it.

I take another sample (or in the case of a repeat recipe the first sample) after yeast has re-hydrated and is showing actual signs of working which is usually next morning after pitching the evening before.

This sample then stays in the FV fridge fermenting in parallel with the FV brew until it appears to land at FG and it’s then discarded. Then thoroughly wash the hydro and test tube and take the last sample which also stays in the FV fridge which has its temp bumped up by a couple of degrees for a couple of days to see if I have squeezed a point or two extra out of previous parallel FG sample.  Usually it does not drop any further.

I cannot see the point of having your sample land at FG days before your brew does.  The recipe or SS will give you an idea of what it will land at anyway.

You want to know WHEN the brew HAS actually landed not what it will land at.  That way you know when you can actually move onto the next stage, i.e. CC or bottling.

Cheers - AL

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I always check OG because sometimes I get a low one, or in the case of my last lager, an unusually high one. Malt bill and process still the same. However it's different with all grain, kits and extract is predictable and actually pretty easy to calculate without needing to take a sample at all. It's only based on grams of sugar per litre.

With the samples, it originally started because I check it after a period to see if it's ready to raise the temperature, 3 days for ales and 5 days for lagers. Depending on this reading I'll bump it up then or give it another day. Then I figured these samples could act as a sort of fast ferment test, not so much about when it reaches FG but making sure that it does. Hence leaving them on the bar. My fermentations are consistently good but it's still nice to have confirmation. My other reason for not putting it in the fridge is that it's a very small volume compared to the batch so its temperature likely drops further when the fridge does come on, which could actually make it take longer than the batch. 

This predictability makes it pretty easy to figure when the actual batch has hit FG. I took a sample on Monday which was late for this batch at 5 days, but judging by the reading it probably reached FG either yesterday or today since it only had about 10/11 points to go and the temperature was allowed to rise 3 degrees. It's also taking quite a while to rise the 0.3 degrees that kicks the fridge on, which is a good indication that it's done. I'll check it Friday or Saturday, if it's where I'm expecting it to be it can begin chilling down on Saturday, as these few days will be enough for any yeast cleanup. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've just rinsed everything in the Brand New Craft kit to start my first one tonight, I'm just letting the chlorine from my tap water air for half a day.

So I will mix the can, stir, measure SG, return sample/s, pitch the yeast and seal the lid. After that I will not be returning samples to the FV.

Thanks for all the info. 🙂

So excited!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Don't take anything for granted when it comes to how clean anything is, the germs that cause infections in a brew won't be seen by the eye, but they will stuff a brew, use the products that the guys on here advise eg I sanatize brand new bottles just in case some gunk has got into them from the factory, ya just don't know, rinsing won't cut it, sanatise the bugger & you'll be slurping great beer every time.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, pilotsh said:

Now for the slowest week ever!... 😁

Spend your time researching, looking for bargain equipment on Gumtree and asking questions and before you know it, you'll be at FG and ready for finings to clear the brew and get ready to bottle. 

I use gelatin - for not much more than the price of a finings pack at BigW you can get a tin of powdered gelatin at Coles for $3.70 and that's enough for clearing 10 or more brews.

Edited by Journeyman
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I hadn't even considered clarifying my beer, I guess I will learn and experience my first batch. I don't think hazy beer will worry me, but I guess I will see how it all turns out.

This brew is the Craft Kit of Bewitched Amber Ale. What temperature do you think I should tell the heat belt to turn on? (I have an inkbird temperature controller). At the moment I have target of 23C (73.4F) with a drop of 1.8c, so the controller will turn the belt on at 21.2C (70.2F), and a low temperature alarm if it hits 20.5C (68.9F). Are these about right? The kit says brew at 20-27c. I can change any value in 0.1C increments.

For the last two days the bathroom has been the coolest place in the apartment, steady at about 23.5, and with no more summer days forecast this week it should only go down.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Coopers kits always recommend up around 22° but most of us brew under control between 18° and 20° - I doubt very much the Craft Series is picky about such things so the yeast will be similar to their usual breed. I did see a list of the yeasts they use (or at used to use when the post was made) that might give you more info if you want to research a bit. 

1.8° is a bit of a wide range compared to what most of us do - Inkbirds give control to 0.3° and that's a +/- figure. I run at that and some use +/-0.5° When the goal is consistency of temps you don't want too wide a swing up and down

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for the info. Eek! I checked the US05 yeast I used on it and it says 15-24C! (The can date was March 2017, so I didn't use the yeast that came with the can, fearing it was old/dead).

I'm going to change to a low alarm of 18C, belt on at 19.2C and a target of 19.9C.

Good fun, this brewing thing 😝

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...