What's in Your Fermenter? 2020

[PaddyBrew2]

i feel your pain mate, i can imagine theres nothin worse after the effort and expense  to have to tip it

you use sodium percarb to clean and star-san/stellar san to sanitise?

[Otto Von Blotto]

Kegged the pale ale just now, and it's in the kegerator on 45psi until about 1100 tomorrow (currently 1400 here). This was the added sediment from the biofine addition. I was able to clear the immediate area around the tap outlet by pouring a couple of schooners with the tap on full bore, but the lighter layer under it is normally where it settles when I use the isinglass and polyclar treatment. 

[Otto Von Blotto]

That off smell doesn't necessarily sound like an issue to me. I know it sounds odd to say that, but just about every one of my beers smells like crap if I stick my head in the fermenter (like when adding dry hops or finings or whatever). You're probably getting a smack in the face from the carbon dioxide as well. 

By the time they're kegged and carbonated they're fine, or even the sample glass I take from the fermenter when I keg them is fine. I would definitely taste a sample, because it can often throw funky aromas in the fermenter that aren't indicative of how it really is. For example, my lagers generally throw a rotten egg aroma in the fermenter, but they sure as hell don't taste like it.

Edited January 17, 2020 by Otto Von Blotto

[Norris!]

@ozlizard

I agree with everything Otto and Paddybrew have said. I brew a lot of hoppy ales and the smell you describe sounds nice to me, orange fruity. With that, I taste each sample to give me an understanding of what is happening with the brew and to check for issues. I don't drink a lot but a tiny sip to test the taste and generally spit it out, but I have drank some tests.

My opinion is that if I am reducing the volume, I want to do everything I can with that sample, max the value of what I am doing, I test gravity, taste, aroma, colour and mouthfeel.

I like most brewers have had infections and I have had brews that had ingredients that I just didn't like and thought were infected, for example I don't like a lot of crystal malt and thought a batch was infected but everyone that had it liked it and wanted more, which I gladly gave them. So with that said, try it to make sure. If in doubt, I would probably keg it,bottle whatever, and keep trying it every so often. If you keg, it is really no issue, but if you bottle you have to weigh up the cost to benefit of using your time and bottles on a possible bad batch.

One last thing, have you cleaned the tap of the fermenter, taken it apart and the holes around the top of the fermenter cleaned the fittings in those, like fully taken everything apart and cleaned and sanitised? I hope it comes good.

Edited January 17, 2020 by Norris!

[ozlizard]

paddybrew2  I used Brewmart No Rinse Steriliser (sodium percarbonate)

otto I hope you are right mate! But it was the sample that I could smell first

norris Fingers crossed, that's all it is. NEIPA #2 seemed to be off but came good. I have taken the tap apart previously but I always let the sanitiser drain through it to clean it out.

Well, just had a taste and it's exactly the same as the last batch. I am terrible at describing tastes or aromas. It has a bitter/sour/off taste, bloody awful. But I will give it some more time.

PS Could it be a temp issue?

Edited January 17, 2020 by ozlizard

[Norris!]

Can you post the recipe and fermentation temps? It could be the temp. Do you santise the airlock before sticking it in and the fittings around the airlock hole?

It could also be too bitter but the sourness...don't know Mate. At this point it is fingers crossed but I don't want you to have another bad batch. Maybe brew a simple and cheap brew next batch after nuking everything and see if it happens again?

Edited January 17, 2020 by Norris!

[ben 10]

On 1/15/2020 at 6:32 PM, Beerlust said:

it's a failing of mine that after a gen or 2, why most of my stored yeast falls away.

Dunno why that would be happening. I use the ultra lazy Ben10 method.
Ferment a not high abv and not too hoppy beer. Save 4 bottles of slurry. When I get to the last one do it again. And then maybe once more. Perhaps 10 per yeast thingy?

[ben 10]

5 hours ago, ozlizard said:

I have a ROTM to do after this and that might be my last attempt. I can't afford to keep throwing brews out!

Don't give up. If it is fooked go back to basics. Simple brew, no dry hops, no opening the lid.
I had a horror run once, even threw a full fermenter in the bin along with two boxes of full bottles.

[PaddyBrew2]

37 minutes ago, Ben 10 said:

Don't give up. If it is fooked go back to basics. Simple brew, no dry hops, no opening the lid.
I had a horror run once, even threw a full fermenter in the bin along with two boxes of full bottles.

And that’s cos he undershot his OG !!!

[ben 10]

1 minute ago, PaddyBrew2 said:

And that’s cos he undershot his OG !!!

I dont measure that anymore.

[PaddyBrew2]

Fair dinkum? You rely on past figures or software ?

[ben 10]

Kveik yeast going hell for leather after being pitched this morning. 
Go you good thing. Need to fill empty kegs. Saison yeast is going too actually. Looking forward to the sour.

[ben 10]

1 minute ago, PaddyBrew2 said:

software ?

Software. Don't really care too much.

[PaddyBrew2]

My efficiency goes from 65 to 80. I need to know my OG.  Starting off anyway 

[Norris!]

22 minutes ago, Ben 10 said:

I dont measure that anymore.

Straight gangsta . Ben don't measure OG because Ben is an OG.

[Pezzza]

On 1/16/2020 at 10:43 AM, ChristinaS1 said:

The reason for the switch to Carapils is because I read wheat is lower in LTP1 protein than regular base malt, whereas Carapils is higher in this than base malt. The LTP1 protein is supposed to be good for head retention and flavour stability. In my experience the head you get from malted wheat doesn't stick around or produce lacing. I am interested in seeing if Carapils will result in more lacing and delay hop fade....I might have to use a larger amount than I used this time to get a significant benefit, but I am just trying it out.

Good luck with that Christina!

I regularly use Wheat Malt in my AG brews in just about everything and do so for creamy top - head retention... and have always had great lacing...  with head that hangs around... on rainwater.

Now I have not done two brews with exact same variables plus or minus wheat so I guess cannot definitively say.... but certainly plus wheat - everything has been great.

So I may be living in a dreamworld of my own (no surprises there) but I reckon that the malted wheat has helped greatly with creamy top and head retention and lacing.

I should also say that I am brewing AG higher ABV beers with bigger malt bills so don't brew anything below 5% and am not scared of using an extra kilo or two of grain as I buy bags of 25kgs and mill my own and the added expense is not prohibitive.

I guess one added interesting fact - in early 2019 I did a dry malt extract brew - just made up recipe - in 23L a swag of LDME... 500g of liquid malt... and the brew was great... but dry malt I reckon contributes just about nine tenths of SFA to any brew for head and head retention... by the time you spray dry it - reckon the head proteins are gone. INMHO. BB

 

[Beerlust]

Wheat in it's various forms is good for head building, but it is body (FG) in the beer that will make it stick around & improve lacing.

Cheers,

Lusty.

[ozlizard]

Thanks for all the replies. I won't be giving up just yet! Just a thought. I have been using the same fermenter for wine (at least 2 batches) and beer. Not good?

[Journeyman]

6 minutes ago, ozlizard said:

Thanks for all the replies. I won't be giving up just yet! Just a thought. I have been using the same fermenter for wine (at least 2 batches) and beer. Not good?

If you've got a good clean regimen it should not matter. But still... it's an oddity most of us don't have. The comment from the missus about 'fermenting oranges' might be indicative of something from the fruit side.

So maybe a new FV solely for beer and see if it makes a difference?

Edited January 18, 2020 by Journeyman

[ozlizard]

1 minute ago, Journeyman said:

So maybe a new FV solely for beer and see if it makes a difference?

Yeah might be a good idea. At least it eliminates another possibility. Eve though I clean it well it still retains either a beer smell or wine smell, depending on the last batch.

[PaddyBrew2]

Yeah I’d seperate the two.  Wine uses a different yeast doesn’t it. If there’s scratches in the fermenter and even though you’ve cleaned it can still harbour some remnants or nasties 

your wine hasn’t been tasting like beer has it  

[Otto Von Blotto]

Either that or get some iodophor to use for sanitising the fermenter. That will kill off any yeast that may be still there. 

Meanwhile, I've taken my 5 days SG sample from the leftovers lager, which is sitting at about 1.030 down from 1.058, so a pretty good rate of fermentation. I'll probably raise the controller up to 18 either tonight or tomorrow morning when I wake up for golf. 

Still no idea what temperature it's actually at, didn't really feel that cold but I suppose the sample tube was room temperature. The inkbird says 12ish but I forgot to calibrate it before the batch. It seems to wander more easily than the STC one does. Dropping 28 points in 5 days is a bit quicker than they normally drop so either the yeast are in top condition or the temperature is a bit warmer. 

Edited January 18, 2020 by Otto Von Blotto

[Pezzza]

10 hours ago, Beerlust said:

Wheat in it's various forms is good for head building, but it is body (FG) in the beer that will make it stick around & improve lacing.

Cheers,

Lusty.

Cheers Lusty.  Thanks for that.  Guess that is why with my AG brewing that I don't seem to have a problem with head retention and lacing...

I guess if I do a Saison that might change with its low inherent FG?

[Pezzza]

5 hours ago, PaddyBrew2 said:

Yeah I’d seperate the two.  Wine uses a different yeast doesn’t it. If there’s scratches in the fermenter and even though you’ve cleaned it can still harbour some remnants or nasties 

your wine hasn’t been tasting like beer has it  

And given that @PaddyBrew2 I reckon I might do the Saison in the Stainless Steel Vat and leave my Coopers Plazzi for Beer... as the Saison Yeast supposedly is more like a red wine yeast...  @Greeny1525229549 you had that one brew go down to 1000 when it was supposed to be 1010 or 1012 - possibility of saison yeast infection?

Am keen to do a Saison but not keen for every following brew to then be going down to near water SG ; )

[Greenyinthewestofsydney]

26 minutes ago, Bearded Burbler said:

And given that @PaddyBrew2 I reckon I might do the Saison in the Stainless Steel Vat and leave my Coopers Plazzi for Beer... as the Saison Yeast supposedly is more like a red wine yeast...  @Greeny1525229549 you had that one brew go down to 1000 when it was supposed to be 1010 or 1012 - possibility of saison yeast infection?

Am keen to do a Saison but not keen for every following brew to then be going down to near water SG ; )

Hey BB. Yeah my 2nd to last budvar finished at 1000 when it is usually 1008ish. As Captain i think pointed out usually a diastaticus infection would show in the bottle not at ferment time as it is slower working. My batch was kegged and tasted the same as my normal bubvar bar being very dry. Still got not idea what happened with that batch as the next one from the same yeast finished at the normal 1008.