The English Bitter Thread!

[The Captain!!]

7 hours ago, ChristinaS1 said:

It is not grassy like its parent, Fuggle.

I kinda see what you mean if your saying grassy, like what’s just beneath grass, being dirt! Ha ha ha

[YeastyBoy]

5 hours ago, Gazzala said:

@SteveL, @YeastyBoy - are you guys using the Coopers English Bitter extract?

That's the one, great base.

[YeastyBoy]

17 minutes ago, ChristinaS1 said:

FYI, bitterness level of the English Bitter kit is completely out of style / way too high; and ditto for the Real Ale kit. Not sure why Coopers makes them so bitter. If you are going to do a hop boil, I would recommend the Mexican Cervesa kit, or the APA kit as a base. Personally I will be using the Mexican Cervesa kit. 

Cheers,

Christina. 

You are probably correct however I really enjoy both the EB & RA extract kits pimped as noted.

The MC extract, I like to go pale ale style with a Galaxy hop & Lemon. Great summer beer and never lasts long in the beer fridge when friends and family drop in!!

Cheers

[Hairy]

I have ordered some Bramling across, Fuggles, Challenger and Styrian Goldings. I already had Target with which I like to Bitter.

I have never used Bramling Cross; I’m looking forward to giving it a go.

[ben 10]

I had a glass last night of mine. Needs another day on gas I think.

I'll post a pick later today.

[SteveL]

On 6/14/2019 at 3:21 PM, Gazzala said:

@SteveL, @YeastyBoy - are you guys using the Coopers English Bitter extract?

Yes...and loving it!

Cheers

[ChristinaS1]

Just put this baby down:

Brown Sugar Bitter with Toasted Malt

 

1.7kg Coopers Mexican Cervesa

1.0kg Maris Otter 30.9%

200gm home toasted wheat malt 6.2%

350gm Demerara sugar 10.8%

125gm C75L 3.9%

60gm TF Pale Chocolate 1.9%

30gm Willamette 3.5% AA boiled x 30 min

15gm Willamette boiled x 10 min

20gm Willamette at FO + hop stand x 20 minutes

20gm Willamette dry hop x 4-5 days

23L reverse osmosis water

10mL Clarity Ferm

10gm MJ's Liberty Bell yeast, dry pitched

 

OG 1.041 FG 1.009  ABV 4.17% IBU 28 BU:GU 0.73 EBC 24

 

Decided to use Demerara sugar this time around, instead of making Inverted Sugar No. 2 syrup. Looking forward to tasting this one.

 

Cheers,

 

Christina. 

[YeastyBoy]

8 hours ago, ChristinaS1 said:

23L reverse osmosis water

I see now how you use a Mex for a English Bitter. Thanks.

Interesting water comment and relevant. How does that hardwater impact on your brew, do you tweak in any way?

So you are in an area that uses desal plants as required to top up the network like Melbourne/Adelaide.

Cheers

 

[ChristinaS1]

Hi Yeastboy,

The only reason I use reverse osmosis water nowadays is because we moved to town and the tap water tastes like a swimming pool. If I forget to get reverse osmosis water the day before brew day I sometimes treat it with a crushed 1/4 Campden tablet instead. 

English Bitters can stand to be brewed with hard water, if that is what you have. If your water is really soft, you could experiment with 1/4 tsp gypsum (CaSO4). 

I did not tweak the water for this batch. My last batch was a Blonde, where I wanted to emphasis maltiness, so I added 1/2 tsp calcium chloride. I have not tasted that batch yet, so I am not sure how it turned out. 

When I lived in the country we had delicious well water, but a bit on the hard side. It made great beer. I thought I could improve on it by adding small amounts of gypsum or epsom salts for hoppy brews, or calcium chloride for malty ones, but that did not work well and I gave it up. Adding minerals to kit brews should probably only be done if your water is very soft, and maybe not even then. If you are an all grain brewer, it is a different story.

Hope that helps.

Cheers,

Christina.

Edited June 20, 2019 by ChristinaS1

[ChristinaS1]

PS I do pay a bit of attention to my partial mash water. If I have a lot of darker specialty malts, I use tap water (which is a bit hard). If the partial mash is amber, like this one, I use RO water. If the partial mash is very light in colour, I add 60gm of acidulated malt to the recipe.

Cheers,

Christina.

[Shamus O'Sean]

1 hour ago, ChristinaS1 said:

Adding minerals to kit brews should probably only be done if your water is very soft, and maybe not even then.

In a podcast I listened to recently, I think it was John Palmer, explained that with extract brews you should not have to worry about water too much.  The theory is that whoever made the extract got the water right in their mash.  The water is then evaporated off under pressure.  The water goes, but the minerals remain.  In using the extract later we just add the water back.  I guess the more neutral the water you reintroduce into an extract beer, the better. 

[broseley28]

On 6/14/2019 at 12:10 PM, YeastyBoy said:

Bloods worth Bottling @SteveL

So pleased with the EKG hop outcome in my latest EB as you suggested. Thanks.

Will have to try this one next. Assume you 50/50 BX & EKG, Boil as before?

I note we can get BX Hops in Oz just need to add postage.

Cheers

 

Where do you get them? Are they allowed in Tasmania

[Otto Von Blotto]

43 minutes ago, Shamus O'Sean said:

In a podcast I listened to recently, I think it was John Palmer, explained that with extract brews you should not have to worry about water too much.  The theory is that whoever made the extract got the water right in their mash.  The water is then evaporated off under pressure.  The water goes, but the minerals remain.  In using the extract later we just add the water back.  I guess the more neutral the water you reintroduce into an extract beer, the better. 

That actually makes a lot of sense. Minerals don't get boiled or evaporated off, so whatever was in the wort would still be in it, and concentrated, after it's turned into goo. Possibly in dry malt too. 

Should see the amount of crud in the bottom of the still after it's distilled a cube full of water, from the various minerals being left behind. We have somewhat hard water here.

 

[Gazzala]

1 hour ago, broseley28 said:

Where do you get them? Are they allowed in Tasmania

 

Beer Belly website has them in stock - http://shop.beerbelly.com.au/bramling-cross-hops-100gm.html

No idea about the Tasmania query...

[ChristinaS1]

6 hours ago, Shamus O'Sean said:

In a podcast I listened to recently, I think it was John Palmer, explained that with extract brews you should not have to worry about water too much.  The theory is that whoever made the extract got the water right in their mash.  The water is then evaporated off under pressure.  The water goes, but the minerals remain.  In using the extract later we just add the water back.  I guess the more neutral the water you reintroduce into an extract beer, the better. 

Yes....In one interview I heard, John Palmer actually recommended kits be diluted with soft water, for this reason. But in practice I think it is okay to top up most kits with tap water, even if it is hard, as you are not mashing. The only exception might be Pilsner kits, which IMO should be diluted with soft water. Examples of soft water include reverse osmosis, distilled, or rainwater.

Some people might say that for a partial mash, not to worry too much about the brewing water, as it only makes up 1/4-1/2 of the fermentables, and you are doing it more for flavour than gravity points, but I don't totally agree with that. Personally I don't want a lot of unconverted starch in my brews, which is why I do what I mentioned in my last post. 

Cheers,

Christina.

 

Edited June 20, 2019 by ChristinaS1

[Greenyinthewestofsydney]

2 hours ago, ChristinaS1 said:

Yes....In one interview I heard, John Palmer actually recommended kits be diluted with soft water, for this reason. But in practice I think it is okay to top up most kits with tap water, even if it is hard, as you are not mashing. The only exception might be Pilsner kits, which IMO should be diluted with soft water. Examples of soft water include reverse osmosis, distilled, or rainwater.

Some people might say that for a partial mash, not to worry too much about the brewing water, as it only makes up 1/4-1/2 of the fermentables, and you are doing it more for flavour than gravity points, but I don't totally agree with that. Personally I don't want a lot of unconverted starch in my brews, which is why I do what I mentioned in my last post. 

Cheers,

Christina.

 

The best thing I have for my brewing is the tank collecting the rainwater. It allows me to brew every style without having to worry about getting an RO system or buy distilled water. Very blessed to have a tank.

[YeastyBoy]

22 hours ago, broseley28 said:

Where do you get them? Are they allowed in Tasmania

@broseley28 google is your friend as my local HBS did not have them and was not prepared to get them in for me given slow stock for him.

I found them here; https://www.cleverbrewing.com.au/bramling-cross-hops.html

No issue re Tassie. Processed product the pellets.

Cheers

[Hairy]

I bought mine from Clever Brewing.

[Hairy]

20 hours ago, Greeny1525229549 said:

The best thing I have for my brewing is the tank collecting the rainwater. It allows me to brew every style without having to worry about getting an RO system or buy distilled water. Very blessed to have a tank.

Greeny, aren’t you in Western Sydney. Where do you find all this rainwater?

[Greenyinthewestofsydney]

Yeah Western Sydney mate. 2500L tank. I turned off the pump to the toilets for 3 months to keep it from running out. The rain a week ago filled the baby up again. 

[Hairy]

1 hour ago, Greeny1525229549 said:

Yeah Western Sydney mate.  

See you at the next WSB meeting 

[Greenyinthewestofsydney]

You know i joined WSB on the bookface about a year or so ago and have been meaning to get to one ever since especially when they meet most times around the Blacktown area which is a convienient 10 min bus ride. Cant make next weeks but the following i will make it a point to get there. They seem a really nice bunch of blokes.

[Hairy]

5 minutes ago, Greeny1525229549 said:

You know i joined WSB on the bookface about a year or so ago and have been meaning to get to one ever since especially when they meet most times around the Blacktown area which is a convienient 10 min bus ride. Cant make next weeks but the following i will make it a point to get there. They seem a really nice bunch of blokes.

Yeah, I’ve seen you in the group members list.

I will use my significant influence to hold the next one in Blacktown.

And I will bring an ESB (to keep this on topic) 

[ben 10]

Here is my go at an EB. @ChristinaS1 the toasted malt was purchased toasted. House of Malt....

Quote

Description

Has a wonderful toasty flavour, ready to liven up a malt driven beer.
Enough enzyme activity to be used as a base malt.

Indicative Analysis:
Moisture: 5.0%
Colour: 8.0 EBC
Extract: 80.5%
Kolbach: 45.0
Viscosity: 1.45
DP: 220

 

Recipe: Benny's Bitter
Brewer: Grumpy
Style: Best Bitter
TYPE: All Grain

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------

Batch Size (fermenter): 21.00 L   
Estimated OG: 1.041 SG
Estimated Color: 27.2 EBC
Estimated IBU: 35.9 IBUs

Ingredients:
------------
Amt              Name                                             Type          #          %/IBU         Volume        
3.00 kg          Coopers Pale Malt (4.2 EBC)                      Grain         1          78.9 %        1.96 L        
0.25 kg          Brown Malt (128.1 EBC)                           Grain         2          6.6 %         0.16 L        
0.25 kg          Crystal Rye Malt (Thomas Fawcett) (157.6 EBC)    Grain         3          6.6 %         0.16 L        
0.25 kg          Toasted Malt (8.0 EBC)                           Grain         4          6.6 %         0.16 L        
0.05 kg          Roasted Malt (Joe White) (1199.7 EBC)            Grain         5          1.3 %         0.03 L        
70.00 g          Fuggles [4.30 %] - Boil 60.0 min                 Hop           6          35.9 IBUs     -             


Mash Schedule: BIAB, Medium Body
Total Grain Weight: 3.80 kg

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

[ChristinaS1]

Thanks for posting your recipe and the beautiful picture Ben! I see you used no late hops. Interesting. We are also using the same yeast! 

So you are able to buy toasted malt? Cool. I toasted my own. I lined a cookie sheet with aluminum foil, to prevent any accidental contamination from cooking oil residue, and spread uncrushed base malt on it. Preheated the oven to 300F, and put it in the oven for 20 minutes, stirring once at around the 10 minute mark. You have to use your nose to decide when to take it out, not your eyes. It should smell and taste like Goldfish crackers. I find it starts to become fragrant at around the 15 minute mark, but I leave it in for a few more minutes; once I toasted the malt for 23 minutes, but by then the aroma had begun to diminish. I put it in a paper bag after it cooled and let it age for one week; they say aging is important to avoid grainy flavours. 

I don't have a mill and so normally crush my grain at my LHBS, but the malt has to be toasted whole. I ended up crushing my toasted malt in a ziplock bag, with a rolling pin, right before use. That worked just fine.

I got the home toasting instructions and grist percentage from this very informative thread on English Bitters: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/yeoman-special-bitter.192039/

He says you can replace the 6% home toasted malt with 4% Victory malt, but it does not provide the same rich maltiness as toasted malt. You can also replace the toasted malt with 2-3% amber, but the flavour will be more burnt toast crust / slightly cocoa powder instead of toasty / biscuit. 

Cheers,

Christina.

Edited June 22, 2019 by ChristinaS1