I didn't realise Coopers supported the Australian Bible Society

[Cerveja]

Should see the backlash on their Facebook page... the comments here are rather tame by comparison.

 

Possibly one of the greatest marketing blunders of all time. Certainly in the finals. Time will tell if they survive this. Be a long night in Adelaide tonight I reckon.

[ChristinaS1]

Should see the backlash on their Facebook page... the comments here are rather tame by comparison.

 

Possibly one of the greatest marketing blunders of all time. Certainly in the finals. Time will tell if they survive this. Be a long night in Adelaide tonight I reckon.

 

I will check their Facebook page.

 

In their statement Cooper's said, "....we aren’t trying to push a religious message, we see these commemorative cans as a celebration of the Bible Society’s 200 years of charitable work in Australia." Charitable work? The Bible Society gives away Bibles. IMO that is not charitable work, that is proselytizing.

 

Cheers,

 

Christina.

[dadndave]

You do realise this is Coopers Light they're talking about here Christina? Personally I can't bring myself to get close enough to the damned stuff to take a photo for you, (shudder).

 

I suppose the one thing left to be said is that Coopers should have been smart enough to keep a brewery the hell away from politics and religion. A predictable PR disaster for sure.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[RepSpec]

i just cant see the issue here?

 

- company donates money to a charity

- company gives charity a gift

- charity uses product in a video to help more people open up talk about an issue

- internet SJW's lose their minds

 

am i missing something?

 

surely the other big brewers give more money to lobyists and government backers to keep them going/let them do what they want? And who surely support worse things? Why arent the leftys whinging about that?

 

(btw...im all for gay marriage and marriage equality...and tasty coopers beers!)

 

id hate to see a small (big) aussie company go down because of some virtual-signalling hate campaign, caused by a poor error of judgement!

[Beefy1525229962]

surely the other big brewers give more money to lobyists and government backers to keep them going/let them do what they want? And who surely support worse things? Why arent the leftys whinging about that?

 

There is a *massive* gulf between lobbying business interests' date=' and lobbying for your own morals - which in this case would specifically impose their morals on the basic legal rights of citizens.

 

- charity uses product in a video to help more people open up talk about an issue

 

This is a pretty poor view of what that video is doing. It is basically pleading with society to allow people to be overt bigots but without fear of reprimand, purely because they hide behind a shield of religion. Straining the tolerance paradox to within an inch of its life.

 

- internet SJW's lose their minds

 

I am intolerant of bigots, I always will be, and I wear this attitude with pride. If you or anyone else thinks SJW is an insult, you are sadly mistaken.

 

id hate to see a small (big) aussie company go down because of some virtual-signalling hate campaign, caused by a poor error of judgement!

 

Coopers role in this is still poorly defined. But these things stick...... I still don't eat Barilla pasta.

[RepSpec]

seems we will just have to wait and see how Coopers handles this further and what impact it will have.

Like i said... hopefully it doesnt have a bad impact on their products and peoples overall opinions of them and they continue to make great stuff!

 

 

[PXR-5]

As has been noted before, this is a homebrew forum and not the place to conduct discussions of this nature. That said, I'll throw another log on the fire.

 

Have you noticed while reading all the posts that just about everyone is very emotional in what they say even though most people seem to be saying similar things. Also we have gone from Coopers putting a bible verse on their cartons to holding them responsible for anti-gayism, anti-abortion, all the outrages of the middle ages and promoting something essentially evil. If a verse from the bible is so irrelevant and fantastical, why get so upset about it?

 

Jeremy, you seem to be like an evangelist of atheism (or should it be Atheism with a capital A?). Even the messiah of atheism, Richard Dawkins (when pressed) said he was only 99.9% sure that God didn't exist, which technically makes him an agnostic rather than an atheist. It guess it takes a lot of faith to be that sure that something doesn't exist.

 

With the gay marriage question ... don't gay couples have the same defacto rights as non-gay couples living together? I have been to a gay wedding, although it wasn't in a church and as noted above, why would a gay couple want to get married in a church anyway? Legislation probably won't change that, and gays even have their own churches. I think that the only area that gay marriage would make a difference (and probably the only thing stopping it from being legislated) is that it would give gay couples the right to adopt children ... something that I personally don't think is good ... and don't believe the discussion should go into the reasons here. We should have a referendum. Unfortunately, Labour doesn't want that ... apparently we can't be trusted to debate the issue. We as Australian citizens can't even be trusted to give the Government directions on how the laws should be made.

 

And this is probably the whole reason for the emotion behind this discussion. There are people who want to be able to control others actions and thoughts when they have no right to do so. For example: "Coopers can't just put what they want on the carton because I don't want it. I'll just go and drink something I don't like quite as much".

 

Anyway lets all go grab a VB

 

John

 

 

[Beefy1525229962]

I think that the only area that gay marriage would make a difference (and probably the only thing stopping it from being legislated) is that it would give gay couples the right to adopt children ... something that I personally don't think is good ... and don't believe the discussion should go into the reasons here.

 

 

Single-parent LGBT adoption has been possible since 1993' date=' and same-sex-couple adoption has been possible since 2002. Reference. Where's the fire and brimstone? The moral decay?

 

We should have a referendum. Unfortunately, Labour doesn't want that ... apparently we can't be trusted to debate the issue. We as Australian citizens can't even be trusted to give the Government directions on how the laws should be made.

 

Incorrect. The reason why a referendum is such a monumentally bad idea, is because it is a popular vote on basic human rights. The only precedent for this in Australia's history was the 'Aboriginal' vote in 1967, and the only reason that went to a referendum was because it required constitutional change. We cannot, and should not, *ever* allow for a tyranny of the majority. Not when it comes to equality under the law.

 

Besides, Little Johnny amended the marriage act in 2004 without a referendum. There is no logical argument to say that reverting his changes inherently requires a public vote.

[PXR-5]

Single-parent LGBT adoption has been possible since 1993' date=' and same-sex-couple adoption has been possible since 2002. Reference. Where's the fire and brimstone? The moral decay?[/quote=Beefy]

 

 

If gay couples can already adopt children, what is the big issue either way?

 

We should have a referendum. Unfortunately' date=' Labour doesn't want that ... apparently we can't be trusted to debate the issue. We as Australian citizens can't even be trusted to give the Government directions on how the laws should be made.[/quote=PXR-5']

 

 

Incorrect. The reason why a referendum is such a monumentally bad idea, is because it is a popular vote on basic human rights. The only precedent for this in Australia's history was the 'Aboriginal' vote in 1967, and the only reason that went to a referendum was because it required constitutional change. We cannot, and should not, *ever* allow for a tyranny of the majority. Not when it comes to equality under the law.[/quote=Beefy]

 

 

Why should rule by a minority be better than rule by the majority? Who is to say that one particular minority ( or a group of minorities) should have a right to say what the majority should do? I would prefer no tyranny, however what we see around the world now is tyranny of one kind or another. Regardless of the label they go under, we are being totally controlled by minorities. In extreme cases, you get the likes of ISIS where if you don't do what you are told you get shot. In less extreme cases you get fined or imprisoned.

 

John

 

 

 

 

[Shags]

Coopers are under threat by self congratulating, artificial, self righteous, naval gazing, donuts? I'm off to Uncle Dan's to get me some Slabs!! To those who are boycotting it, you need to check every purchase you make and ensure all of the brands associated with your purchase are not associated with any church, Billionaires who don't share their wealth ( or don't pay taxes ), foreign Governments that unfairly persecute innocent people, Business that continually pollute the planet we walk on without restitution, ill treatment of animals when making their products, ripping of workers and their pay whilst that get fat on the profit, and I could go on. Until you do that, Grab a Pale, sit back and relax!!

 

[Gag Halfrunt]

" internet SJW's lose their minds"

 

Please excuse my ignorance, but what or whom is an SJW?

[King Ruddager]

As has been noted before' date=' this is a homebrew forum and not the place to conduct discussions of this nature.[/quote']

 

Seems fitting to me that we as a community would discuss something directly related to Coopers here in the "Everything Else" sub forum.

 

... we have gone from Coopers putting a bible verse on their cartons to holding them responsible for anti-gayism' date=' anti-abortion, all the outrages of the middle ages and promoting something essentially evil. If a verse from the bible is so irrelevant and fantastical, why get so upset about it?[/quote']

 

I think you'll find it's the apparent endorsement of the Bible Society's religious political agenda that people are upset about, not the verses being on cans.

 

Jeremy' date=' you seem to be like an evangelist of atheism (or should it be Atheism with a capital A?). Even the messiah of atheism, Richard Dawkins (when pressed) said he was only 99.9% sure that God didn't exist, which technically makes him an agnostic rather than an atheist. It guess it takes a lot of faith to be [b']that [/b]sure that something doesn't exist.

 

Theism is about belief, gnosticism is about knowledge. Richard Dawkins is 99.9% an agnostic atheist and 0.1% deist by your description, although of course atheism has no doctrine so calling anybody it's "messiah" is absurd ... but you know that and are clearly just pushing buttons

 

Faith, as I said earlier, is a chosen belief based on no evidence, or in spite of evidence to the contrary. As some say, calling lack of belief in a given religion (ie. atheism) a religion itself - as you seem to be implying - is like calling not collecting stamps a hobby, or as Bill Maher says like calling abstinence a sex position.

 

With the gay marriage question ... don't gay couples have the same defacto rights as non-gay couples living together?

 

No, they do not have the right to get married.

[RepSpec]

" internet SJW's lose their minds"

 

Please excuse my ignorance' date=' but what or whom is an SJW?[/quote']

 

 

social justice warriors

 

they are generally those who, protest for the sake of protesting, jump on any cause because it is seen as the "right and social" thing to do.

 

there is a guy i watch on youtube who makes very good videos (yes they are far right) but he calls out some of the biggest celebrities and "those who influence modern culture" and shoots their left based views down.

 

if you want il mention his name, but it maybe too off topic and political for this thread

[jeremy-o]

" internet SJW's lose their minds"

 

Please excuse my ignorance' date=' but what or whom is an SJW?[/quote']

 

"Social Justice Warrior." It's a recent pejorative buzzword that functions much the same way as "politically correct" - ie, used primarily by a certain breed of emotionally stunted white men who have no idea how lucky they have it, and can't wrap their head around the idea that not everyone has the same shield of privilege that they do. If you take any active step towards tolerance or make any slim show of empathy or sensitivity to anyone - especially based on their identity as a woman or minority - you're a Social Justice Warrior and should feel bad.

[Beefy1525229962]

If gay couples can already adopt children' date=' what is the big issue either way?[/quote']

 

Exactly. Thanks for agreeing with me, I think?

 

Perhaps you don't actually understand what same sex couples feel they are missing out on. It is very easy to dismiss it when you are not subjected to it. Look at it this way...... if same-race and inter-racial couples were specified as different under the law, it would be state sponsored discrimination, and the vast majority would consider that totally unacceptable. The simple fact is that laws against same-sex marriage are state sponsored discrimination.

 

Why should rule by a minority be better than rule by the majority? Who is to say that one particular minority ( or a group of minorities) should have a right to say what the majority should do? I would prefer no tyranny, however what we see around the world now is tyranny of one kind or another. Regardless of the label they go under, we are being totally controlled by minorities.

 

The idea that the world is ruled by minorities is absolute and utter rubbish. It is a ridiculous falsehood perpetuated by people who previously held the power to discriminate on a whim, but they are finally being held to scrutiny for their opinions and actions, and they don't like it.

 

The simple fact is that equality under the law for same-sex couples in absolutely no way shape or form imposes anything onto your life. It will not cause social decay or a slippery amoral slope. This has been proven time and time again in a growing list of countries where same-sex-marriage has been legalised.

[RepSpec]

" internet SJW's lose their minds"

 

Please excuse my ignorance' date=' but what or whom is an SJW?[/quote']

 

"Social Justice Warrior." It's a recent pejorative buzzword that functions much the same way as "politically correct" - ie, used primarily by a certain breed of emotionally stunted white men who have no idea how lucky they have it, and can't wrap their head around the idea that not everyone has the same shield of privilege that they do. If you take any active step towards tolerance or make any slim show of empathy or sensitivity to anyone - especially based on their identity as a woman or minority - you're a Social Justice Warrior and should feel bad.

 

whack...wow that hurt.

 

emotionally stunted white men...did you just assume my race and or gender? Im triggered.

 

time for me to get out of this thread

[jeremy-o]

Jeremy' date=' you seem to be like an evangelist of atheism (or should it be Atheism with a capital A?). Even the messiah of atheism, Richard Dawkins (when pressed) said he was only 99.9% sure that God didn't exist, which technically makes him an agnostic rather than an atheist. It guess it takes a lot of faith to be [b']that [/b]sure that something doesn't exist.

 

Oh I'm an atheist, but far from evangelical. I studied the Philosophy of Religion (alongside the Philosophy of Biology - fine bedfellows!) as an undergrad and got a lot out of it. There are certain arguments in favour of God's existence that I still use at times when teaching. They don't convince me personally, but I like to talk about it. And you can't teach Thomas More or Shakespeare without some understanding of, for example, the Catholic Church. Sure, I'll start the occasional lesson with a bold and unapologetic "God Is Dead", but then Nietzsche's just good value all round.

[Jason B]

Absolutely disgusted, archaic fairy tales to excuse bigotry?

Congratulations, Coopers, you've just turned a fan who has drunk your beers (mainly pale ale) since moving to SA 25 years ago.

 

And from this day forth, not another drop of your brew will ever pass my lips. Not one cent of my money will ever go into your coffers.

 

You chose a side, well now so have I and you aren't on it.

 

You live in the past with your child-raping priests and dictate about "family values". I'll live in the 21st century, with science, reason, rationality and any beer that isn't yours.

 

Goodbye, for ever.

 

Jason B

[GrantM3]

Honestly, folks: heads should be pulled in.

 

People, even corporations, are entitled to support whom they please in the public arena and the Bible Society with its 200 yrs, certainly is public.

 

I am a lifelong atheist, but if people want to believe in the invisible and, they perhaps would agree, the unknowable, then go for it!

 

The video itself is a model for civilised discussion/conversation in a diverse, liberal society like ours. With the "explain the other guy's vieew" bit near the end, a good idea for any public debate.

 

My only complaint: why was there no Red in evidence?

 

Oh: I forgot; it's an advertisement for Cooper's Light.

 

And James Brechney, the petition bloke, has every right to object, especially if he agrees with me that they should have had the Red on screen....

 

Me, I'm going out to find a Red.

[jeremy-o]

Update from Coopers: In a third statement, Coopers apologised again, announced that the commemorative cans are cancelled and that they're joining Australian Marriage Equality.

[Ocean's of Ale-]

I'll marry mr Cooper's(!!) god knows ive been in a long term relationship with him for years and years... Cooper's beer rock's!! (Ps).. if my wife is reading this honey ,there is nothing to worry about...or is there??

(Honestly the world's is far to f**king serious these days)

[Beerlust]

Those I've surrounded myself with in my personal & professional life are for the most part generous, good spirited, kind hearted people. Like me, they all have their flaws, & no-one is perfect. As friends & colleagues, we accept our differences. Along the way I have deliberately separated myself from selfish, mean spirited, & intentionally cruel people.

 

I see nothing selfish, mean spirited, deliberately cruel, or intentionally hurtful in what Coopers did here in ANY way. I have NEVER seen anything but kindness, generosity, support for numerous charities & fundraising events from those at Coopers that represent the company in my time in the hospitality industry.

 

For those that wish to make more from a 'storm in a tea cup', or 'make a mountain out of a mole hill', or somehow misrepresent what transpired & link it into some personal agenda of their own then you just add to the already unhealthy numbers that subscribe to the 'tall poppy syndrome' that currently exists in this country, & add NOTHING positive to the equation.

 

I'm not a religious man, but I respect the rights of ALL who wish to follow a religion provided that religion does not intentionally seek to cause harm to followers or non-conformists.

Peace is not something you wish for; It's something you make' date=' Something you do, Something you are, and something you give away.[/quote']

Coopers are still the same decent company to me today as they were before this story broke, & as such, will continue to have my support.

 

Lusty.

[Gag Halfrunt]

Update from Coopers: In a third statement' date=' Coopers apologised again, announced that the commemorative cans are cancelled and that they're joining Australian Marriage Equality.

 

Wow! Hope they didn't strip their gears going into reverse so suddenly.

Adverse publicity invokes sudden damage control response.

[MarkC]

I must say I'm stunned - beer giant enters contract to celebrate bicentenary of bible society, seemingly because of shared beliefs, consumers react violently, Coopers changes story at least once, then rescinds contract and jumps ship.

I really feel sorry for them, but I reckon this is a double fail by Coopers.

[Gag Halfrunt]

I must say I'm stunned - beer giant enters contract to celebrate bicentenary of bible society' date=' seemingly because of shared beliefs, consumers react violently, Coopers changes story at least once, then rescinds contract and jumps ship.

I really feel sorry for them, but I reckon this is a double fail by Coopers.[/quote']

 

Could be worse.

Dreamworld killed four people and their damage control response was to say that they have a good safety record.